1 Down 59 More to Go..Bye Bye Healthcare Reform

**RockGod** · 01-20-2010, 12:00 AM

Ted Kennedy is rolling over in his grave. Republicans take a seat in probably the most liberal state in the US. This just shows you that America is not a leftwing nut job country like a lot of people would have you believe and don't think that a lot of those blue dog dems didn't take notice. First up; Bye Bye healthcare Reform, next up Election Day 2010 and bye bye democrat control. Thank You Obama for exposing the democrat party for the socialist whack jobs that they are.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34923900...-capitol_hill/

**4G63** · 01-20-2010, 11:19 AM

The comments from the last 30 seconds are hilarious.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4aQCiRjvZY

**Galen Sevinne** · 02-11-2010, 11:59 PM

Thank You Obama for exposing the democrat party for the socialist whack jobs that they are.

Great thinking Rockgod! Instead of healthcare reform which would end preexisting conditions, limits on benefits, reform medicare, reduce the deficit and help cover the uninsured, you support the private companies that will continue to gouge your dumb ass by 39% more all while reeling in billion dollar profits!!! Fucking Brilliant RocksForBrains!!!!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100211/...ates_wellpoint

You are a satirist right? I mean, your posts are supposed to funny? ala Colbert? yeah?

Seriously Rocks...stop voting against yourself.

**4G63** · 02-13-2010, 01:12 PM

Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne

Great thinking Rockgod! Instead of healthcare reform which would end preexisting conditions, limits on benefits, reform medicare, reduce the deficit and help cover the uninsured, you support the private companies that will continue to gouge your dumb ass by 39% more all while reeling in billion dollar profits!!! Fucking Brilliant RocksForBrains!!!!

Why can't the .Gov reform Medicare/Medicaid by itself? If its so easy to save money through them, why won't they stick with that and prove they can actually reform Medicare/Medicaid and save a few $Billion?

Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100211/...ates_wellpoint

You are a satirist right? I mean, your posts are supposed to funny? ala Colbert? yeah?

Seriously Rocks...stop voting against yourself.

Those rates are raised on those who pay for insurance themselves, not through their employer. The purchasers dropped some of their coverage for higher out of pocket costs or dropped out altogether. Its risk pools are smaller and therefore premiums rise. I'm not going to sit here and say 39% is acceptable but if I needed insurance and was going to pay for it myself, I'm going to find the cheapest plan I can get with what I want covered and find that in the open market. What would be nice is if I lived in California, I could buy something like the Geisinger Health plan that is in PA and has a wonderful track record of coverage. The open market trumps all and would force Health systems to compete with one another, therefore running lowering costs.

**Galen Sevinne** · 02-13-2010, 04:48 PM

Originally Posted by 4G63

Why can't the .Gov reform Medicare/Medicaid by itself? If its so easy to save money through them, why won't they stick with that and prove they can actually reform Medicare/Medicaid and save a few $Billion?

Ahhh...yeah, this is part of healthcare reform that the Republicans are obstructing. The reason the govt. can't do it is because the U.S. requires a 60% majority to do anything and that is unlikely to ever happen...especially with special interest groups and lobbyists working the uneducated mass of America into a frenzy with fear tactics.

[/QUOTE]Those rates are raised on those who pay for insurance themselves, not through their employer. The purchasers dropped some of their coverage for higher out of pocket costs or dropped out altogether. Its risk pools are smaller and therefore premiums rise. I'm not going to sit here and say 39% is acceptable but if I needed insurance and was going to pay for it myself, I'm going to find the cheapest plan I can get with what I want covered and find that in the open market. What would be nice is if I lived in California, I could buy something like the Geisinger Health plan that is in PA and has a wonderful track record of coverage. The open market trumps all and would force Health systems to compete with one another, therefore running lowering costs. [/QUOTE]

Then why isn't it working? Here is what is so frustrating with those who find incredulous that 95% of America is not banging down the doors for HCR.

Your argument is that an open market ie...no Govt. interference is what will make health insurance work. That is how it is! right now! For profit as in the tune of 39% more for this particular plan. How is that working? Not so well if people are dropping out because they can't afford it and the risk pool is dwindling only making it more expensive. Follow the logic of that argument!

Govt. involvement is ADDING competition in that it will give another option that is not-for-profit and this will create a baseline price for the true cost of health insurance. Now if you are a populist rage monster and think government DNA is inherently flawed then you can still pay for your for-profit plan since the DNA of a multimillionaire insurance exec is so much more evolved.

**4G63** · 02-14-2010, 01:04 AM

You really can't answer my question, can you?

I think most Americans would feel much better if the .gov could/would take "baby steps" with reform of Medicare/Medicaid and prove they're up to the challenge and make worthwhile changes that really work. But, I know, that's what a rational, thinking person would be confortable with and that's just not good enough for the "Intellectuals".

As to your second point, I never mentioned anything about a totally government free market. Most successful markets have minimal government intrusion and when an issue arises, government intervenes to restore the marketplace as efficiently as possible. The US doesn't have a truly open market in regards to HC, as you're unable to purchase a plan from another state. Those customers of Wellpoint are unable to buy coverage from an Insurer in Arizona, Oregon, or any other state for that matter, even though they may be able to purchase an equal amount of coverage for a cheaper price. The free market dictates that if a company can't compete with the guy down the street, he goes out of business, therefore his raising of rates must be weighed against whether their customers will leave or not.

**Galen Sevinne** · 02-14-2010, 02:03 PM

Originally Posted by 4G63

You really can't answer my question, can you?

I think most Americans would feel much better if the .gov could/would take "baby steps" with reform of Medicare/Medicaid and prove they're up to the challenge and make worthwhile changes that really work. But, I know, that's what a rational, thinking person would be confortable with and that's just not good enough for the "Intellectuals".

As to your second point, I never mentioned anything about a totally government free market. Most successful markets have minimal government intrusion and when an issue arises, government intervenes to restore the marketplace as efficiently as possible. The US doesn't have a truly open market in regards to HC, as you're unable to purchase a plan from another state. Those customers of Wellpoint are unable to buy coverage from an Insurer in Arizona, Oregon, or any other state for that matter, even though they may be able to purchase an equal amount of coverage for a cheaper price. The free market dictates that if a company can't compete with the guy down the street, he goes out of business, therefore his raising of rates must be weighed against whether their customers will leave or not.

Baby steps?

HCR has been in the process for decades! Baby steps! You are being propagandized my friend by corporate america. Put the tea down.

**4G63** · 02-14-2010, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne

Baby steps?

HCR has been in the process for decades! Baby steps! You are being propagandized my friend by corporate america. Put the tea down.

What does Corporate America have to do with reform of Medicare/Medicaid? So my rational answer elicited an irrational answer from you? Big surprise!

Since you brought it up, if the .Gov was in the Healthcare game, do you feel they need to realistically operate at a profit or are you OK with them operating at a deficit? BTW, I know your answer but I need you to put it in words so you'll set up my next point...

**RockGod** · 02-24-2010, 11:10 PM

Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne

Great thinking Rockgod! Instead of healthcare reform which would end preexisting conditions, limits on benefits, reform medicare, reduce the deficit and help cover the uninsured, you support the private companies that will continue to gouge your dumb ass by 39% more all while reeling in billion dollar profits!!! Fucking Brilliant RocksForBrains!!!!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100211/...ates_wellpoint

You are a satirist right? I mean, your posts are supposed to funny? ala Colbert? yeah?

Seriously Rocks...stop voting against yourself.

Your unbelievable dude, for the life of me I can't wrap my arms around anyone in the United States that wants the government to do anything for them. Your just a lazy democrat that believes the government can do all for all. There are millions of examples of regular people being successful is this country, some of those people have educations and some don't. The one thing they have in common is they didn't sit around and wait for Obama to do it for them.

Your stupid misinformed tiny brain never brings up that anything they want to do in this freedom taking healthcare bill doesn't insure everyone. In fact just as many people will be uninsured 10 years from now as there are right now. This stupid bill doesn't even go into effect for another 3 or 4 years.

I work for a corporation and it affords me a pretty good lifestyle, I have a great healthcare plan and I've had one since I was 18 years old, I am now 42. I didn't need Obama to get it for me; I got a freakin job that offered health insurance. Hello, idiot! You can't get health insurance working at Moe's sandwich shop or standing on a street corner strumming a guitar thinking you’re the next Bob Dillon. If the government would get the hell out of the health insurance business then the prices will go down. The 39% you say these companies are gouging people for is a direct result of the government raising taxes on everything they do and make. Every company passes along tax increases to their customers. Why do you think a pack of cigarettes cost $10 because their gouging their customers? Why do you think a gallon of milk cost $3 because their gouging their customers? Get your head out of the democrat party ass a wake the freak up. It's morons like you that keep voting these idiots in office that screw everything up. There isn't one elected person in Maryland that I voted for, democrats have full run of Baltimore and it's an utter failure as is every other democrat run state/city. If it wasn't for DC being so close to Maryland this state would be in the same situation as New York. Have you looked at Detroit lately? Why isn't that place lined with gold? If the democrat way works so well then why is there utter failure every where it's tried? Have you been to Texas? Do you see Texas giving IOU's for tax returns like they are if California? Do you hear Texas saying they have 20 billion dollar deficit? How can California have a 20 billion dollar deficit when they live and die by the democrat philosophy?

Give it up dude your so far gone it's not even worth debating anything with you. You live in a shell of a world and you only know what you’re told by leftwing media. Let me make this clear to you. I hate government, I don't need the government to do anything for me except plow the snow and maintain the army. I love free market capitalism, I love big corporations, I love working for big corporations, I love getting a big pay check from big corporations, I love my healthcare, I love my freedom, I love my country. I don't need you, I don't need Obama and I don't need the democrat party. You’re all a collection of deceiving, misguided, misinformed pea brains, that couldn't win a debate against anyone armed with nothing more then commonsense. Everything you believe in is lie and your world is a complete fabrication and void of reality.

**Galen Sevinne** · 02-25-2010, 12:17 AM

[QUOTE=RockGod;198829]

Rocky, your angry rants are maybe some of the best reading on this board post football season.

I work for a corporation and it affords me a pretty good lifestyle,

I work for myself, run my own business, one man show, paid my way through 10 years of postsecondary education with loans that are all paid back and worked, at times, three jobs while working on two different dissertations.

You have no clue about self-reliance or what you are talking about. You work for the man and you are told when to show up and what to do on a daily basis. You are not part of the free market and you rely on someone else's ideas and risks to pay your way.

I have a great healthcare plan and I've had one since I was 18 years old, I am now 42. I didn't need Obama to get it for me

Right...because your employer, whether you see it or not, skims it off the top of what your salary could be and pays that plus the additional 35% profit to the insurance corporations. You are a simply a tool in the system that falls for hokey terms like freedom, free markets, liberty etc. while corporate america continues to cash in million dollar bonuses while you get your measley 3% COLA --- if lucky.

Bob Dillon.

Its spelled Dylan. Dillon? Chany? If you want to make silly little jokes at least learn how to spell the names of people my 4 year old son could spell correctly.

**Rochardrik** · 02-25-2010, 03:57 PM

Originally Posted by RockGod

Ted Kennedy is rolling over in his grave. Republicans take a seat in probably the most liberal state in the US. This just shows you that America is not a leftwing nut job country like a lot of people would have you believe and don't think that a lot of those blue dog dems didn't take notice. First up; Bye Bye healthcare Reform, next up Election Day 2010 and bye bye democrat control. Thank You Obama for exposing the democrat party for the socialist whack jobs that they are.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34923900...-capitol_hill/

And Hello strangling health care costs... Like $30,000 per year by 2018. Wow, am I glad that happened!

**Rochardrik** · 02-25-2010, 04:03 PM

Originally Posted by 4G63

Why can't the .Gov reform Medicare/Medicaid by itself? If its so easy to save money through them, why won't they stick with that and prove they can actually reform Medicare/Medicaid and save a few $Billion?

Those rates are raised on those who pay for insurance themselves, not through their employer. The purchasers dropped some of their coverage for higher out of pocket costs or dropped out altogether. Its risk pools are smaller and therefore premiums rise. I'm not going to sit here and say 39% is acceptable but if I needed insurance and was going to pay for it myself, I'm going to find the cheapest plan I can get with what I want covered and find that in the open market. What would be nice is if I lived in California, I could buy something like the Geisinger Health plan that is in PA and has a wonderful track record of coverage. The open market trumps all and would force Health systems to compete with one another, therefore running lowering costs.

What? Are you kidding? or just uninformed? I own a business with 100 employees. We CANNOT continue to pay our employee's insurance because of the increase in costs. 10 years ago, 7-800 dollars per... Now it's nearing $10,000.00. You have to be completely ignorant to believe that advertising, and billion dollar profits to insurance companies create lower rates.