Shooting at Santa Fe High School

[Ortizer]

True. But on school safety...shouldn’t that be a universal deal? I mean private school kids deserve to be safe too.


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Eh. It's not the public school system's job to take care of that though. At least the safe schools will bump their property values?

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[cjandrze]

True. But on school safety...shouldn’t that be a universal deal? I mean private school kids deserve to be safe too.


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Not gonna happen. No way public funds will be used for private schools.

[The Excellector]

I must say that I was expecting the thread to head south when I first saw it, but have read through 80% of it and am glad it has not.

I like Wicked's idea of metal detectors.

Now, there is one major issue here that's going to take a while for people to see, through the outrage. You have to have qualified people who want to do the job. That is why many Law Enforcement Agencies are understaffed now. Less pay than what the job is worth and far more direct danger. Suddenly, you're the one responding to house calls where you don't know who has what weapon or who is hopped on what drug. Suddenly, you're the one locked in a jail unit by yourself with at least 60 inmates, behind cell doors so old the inmates can really get out whenever they want if they weren't concerned with the trouble they would get into. You may end up like I did in that jail unit, for those of you who know my story. Some people just aren't built for that pressure.

Suddenly, you would have a gun on your hip, with the responsibility of protecting hundreds of children. If something happens to them, not only will you feel the guilt of failing, which is how you may likely think of it in your mind psychologically, but you would then be the guy who the entire nation is shitting on like you weren't doing your job. Why? Because they don't understand the responsibility and they don't want to understand the responsibility. Much of America just wants to protest fake outrage, then go home and play video games and get on social media. They'd much rather backseat drive.

This is one reason why Baltimore has the corruption issue that it does. Gangs said, 'Y'all don't want the jobs, we'll put our people in there', and they send specific members who they know would qualify, to apply for the jobs and go through the academy.

A.) Someone has to want to do that job. I heard the military mentioned, but these are different animals we are dealing with. Different training would be needed. Secondly, the assumption would be that military guys would want to deal with that responsibility all over again. I've actually come across several military personnel and LEOs who shook my hand, because they could never work Corrections, for example. When you're a Police Officer, you don't have to have the social skills necessary to cope. Your gun is your social skill, because when people see that they know you can find cause to use it. In the jail, you have to drop that gun off at Mass Control/Control Center, before you even enter the building. Then, you may find yourself surrounded by dozens and dozens of inmates walking freely. There are different skills needed to cope in that environment and a lot of military guys and LEOs have admitted to me that they would never do it.

That example was just to say that taking on such a job would be a major responsibility, with the potential for extremely pressurized situations, with major psychological consequences for failing, AND children dying. Sad to say, I don't know of many qualified people who would want the responsibility.

B.) To go back to Wicked's idea of the metal detector. If you don't have that metal detector, there is nothing to stop a kid from shooting the security first if necessary.

You also have to be careful about throwing a big blanket over all of the children with so-called solutions, because it comes off as feeling that they should have to deal with wholesale changes, but we don't want to give up our guns. I've heard counseling mentioned. While it's true that parents can be in denial, kids have long been known to develop stigmas about therapists.

This is not going to be an easy solution by any means, and it may have to be multi-layered.

[Laxdad24]

I must say that I was expecting the thread to head south when I first saw it, but have read through 80% of it and am glad it has not.

I like Wicked's idea of metal detectors.

Now, there is one major issue here that's going to take a while for people to see, through the outrage. You have to have qualified people who want to do the job. That is why many Law Enforcement Agencies are understaffed now. Less pay than what the job is worth and far more direct danger. Suddenly, you're the one responding to house calls where you don't know who has what weapon or who is hopped on what drug. Suddenly, you're the one locked in a jail unit by yourself with at least 60 inmates, behind cell doors so old the inmates can really get out whenever they want if they weren't concerned with the trouble they would get into. You may end up like I did in that jail unit, for those of you who know my story. Some people just aren't built for that pressure.

Suddenly, you would have a gun on your hip, with the responsibility of protecting hundreds of children. If something happens to them, not only will you feel the guilt of failing, which is how you may likely think of it in your mind psychologically, but you would then be the guy who the entire nation is shitting on like you weren't doing your job. Why? Because they don't understand the responsibility and they don't want to understand the responsibility. Much of America just wants to protest fake outrage, then go home and play video games and get on social media. They'd much rather backseat drive.

This is one reason why Baltimore has the corruption issue that it does. Gangs said, 'Y'all don't want the jobs, we'll put our people in there', and they send specific members who they know would qualify, to apply for the jobs and go through the academy.

A.) Someone has to want to do that job. I heard the military mentioned, but these are different animals we are dealing with. Different training would be needed. Secondly, the assumption would be that military guys would want to deal with that responsibility all over again. I've actually come across several military personnel and LEOs who shook my hand, because they could never work Corrections, for example. When you're a Police Officer, you don't have to have the social skills necessary to cope. Your gun is your social skill, because when people see that they know you can find cause to use it. In the jail, you have to drop that gun off at Mass Control/Control Center, before you even enter the building. Then, you may find yourself surrounded by dozens and dozens of inmates walking freely. There are different skills needed to cope in that environment and a lot of military guys and LEOs have admitted to me that they would never do it.

That example was just to say that taking on such a job would be a major responsibility, with the potential for extremely pressurized situations, with major psychological consequences for failing, AND children dying. Sad to say, I don't know of many qualified people who would want the responsibility.

B.) To go back to Wicked's idea of the metal detector. If you don't have that metal detector, there is nothing to stop a kid from shooting the security first if necessary.

You also have to be careful about throwing a big blanket over all of the children with so-called solutions, because it comes off as feeling that they should have to deal with wholesale changes, but we don't want to give up our guns. I've heard counseling mentioned. While it's true that parents can be in denial, kids have long been known to develop stigmas about therapists.

This is not going to be an easy solution by any means, and it may have to be multi-layered.

Damn fine post Sword! Glad you joined and offered insight.


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[cjandrze]

I must say that I was expecting the thread to head south when I first saw it, but have read through 80% of it and am glad it has not.

I like Wicked's idea of metal detectors.

Now, there is one major issue here that's going to take a while for people to see, through the outrage. You have to have qualified people who want to do the job. That is why many Law Enforcement Agencies are understaffed now. Less pay than what the job is worth and far more direct danger. Suddenly, you're the one responding to house calls where you don't know who has what weapon or who is hopped on what drug. Suddenly, you're the one locked in a jail unit by yourself with at least 60 inmates, behind cell doors so old the inmates can really get out whenever they want if they weren't concerned with the trouble they would get into. You may end up like I did in that jail unit, for those of you who know my story. Some people just aren't built for that pressure.

Suddenly, you would have a gun on your hip, with the responsibility of protecting hundreds of children. If something happens to them, not only will you feel the guilt of failing, which is how you may likely think of it in your mind psychologically, but you would then be the guy who the entire nation is shitting on like you weren't doing your job. Why? Because they don't understand the responsibility and they don't want to understand the responsibility. Much of America just wants to protest fake outrage, then go home and play video games and get on social media. They'd much rather backseat drive.

This is one reason why Baltimore has the corruption issue that it does. Gangs said, 'Y'all don't want the jobs, we'll put our people in there', and they send specific members who they know would qualify, to apply for the jobs and go through the academy.

A.) Someone has to want to do that job. I heard the military mentioned, but these are different animals we are dealing with. Different training would be needed. Secondly, the assumption would be that military guys would want to deal with that responsibility all over again. I've actually come across several military personnel and LEOs who shook my hand, because they could never work Corrections, for example. When you're a Police Officer, you don't have to have the social skills necessary to cope. Your gun is your social skill, because when people see that they know you can find cause to use it. In the jail, you have to drop that gun off at Mass Control/Control Center, before you even enter the building. Then, you may find yourself surrounded by dozens and dozens of inmates walking freely. There are different skills needed to cope in that environment and a lot of military guys and LEOs have admitted to me that they would never do it.

That example was just to say that taking on such a job would be a major responsibility, with the potential for extremely pressurized situations, with major psychological consequences for failing, AND children dying. Sad to say, I don't know of many qualified people who would want the responsibility.

B.) To go back to Wicked's idea of the metal detector. If you don't have that metal detector, there is nothing to stop a kid from shooting the security first if necessary.

You also have to be careful about throwing a big blanket over all of the children with so-called solutions, because it comes off as feeling that they should have to deal with wholesale changes, but we don't want to give up our guns. I've heard counseling mentioned. While it's true that parents can be in denial, kids have long been known to develop stigmas about therapists.

This is not going to be an easy solution by any means, and it may have to be multi-layered.

Agreed on all fronts.

[The Excellector]

Damn fine post Sword! Glad you joined and offered insight.


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I was kind of hesitant, but the thread turned out okay. That's unusual for the Political forum.

[Laxdad24]

I was kind of hesitant, but the thread turned out okay. That's unusual for the Political forum.

You’re a smart guy. I know most of the posters over here would appreciate your insight. Some threads race down the rabbit hole though. You’re 100% right about that.


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[The Excellector]

I thought about a discussion that a few of us had with JSmoove. He talked about the training that teachers were going through, gun training potentially included. He acknowledged that he didn't want that for himself. There's nothing wrong with that and certainly no shame in it. I was just glad that he acknowledged it. A lot of people will complain, but not acknowledge that.

America has reached a point where the lid is off of the proverbial jar. Technology has taken over. Social skills, including coping skills for life, liberal arts, have all been devalued. It's a mass issue. I feel most for the children. They don't deserve this.

[The Excellector]

The entry exit thing would be a good start. That would have to be worked over, in cases of emergencies. The children need a good plan for escape in case of fires and so forth, to remain in place. EMTs would also need efficient accessibility if they are called upon for whatever reason. All of this not even about the potential of a shooting. The teachers have been squeezed as much as you can. They're overpaid, stripped of power and really babysitters more than anything in the public school system in some parts of the country. I mean, the layers to this are morbidly plentiful.

[ravenmaniac4life]

America has reached a point where the lid is off of the proverbial jar. Technology has taken over. Social skills, including coping skills for life, liberal arts, have all been devalued. It's a mass issue. I feel most for the children. They don't deserve this.

Spot on.

It’s up to parents to make the most difference in our kids’ lives....not the government.

IMO, we are a truly Godless society moreso today than ever in my lifetime. The foundation of any person is their humanity and too many kids are growing up without that defining set of principles which used to be waaaaaay more prevalent in our culture. Human life just isn’t valued as much as it used to be. A child’s life especially.

Children are a blessing. I wish more people treated them as such.

Fix that, and this toxic disease that is plaguing our schools will go away.

[Laxdad24]

Fellas. The solution is simple. And it really won’t cost a lot of money. If we as a society simply go back to the way we did shit when I was a kid ( 70’s+80’s) problem solved. No more “participation trophies”. Not every kid makes the team or school play / band. Stop the “inclusion “ bullshit in school. It every kid should be in “regular “ classes. Some kids need more help than others. Some kids have legit learning disabilities. They shouldn’t be holding back the other kids. Tell your kids ...NO!!! Don’t be their damn friend. Be their parent! He’s an idea that worked for my mom and dad ...when your kid gets outa line , bad grades ...whoop their Ass!!!! Fixed my shit. I screwed up ...bam..ass whopping stopped it from happening again. Teach your kids to stand up for themselves. Stop being a pussy!! Make your kids play outside. Limit their electronics. Stop Common Core teaching!! Go back to teaching shit students need to learn! The Three “R’s” and liberal arts. Kids need music, art , gym. How bout shop class. Home Ecc? Make them learn a foreign language. Learn about different cultures. We did. I still remember a handful of teachers that actually impacted my life. They really loved their career. You don’t have that now.
These kids are never told NO. They can’t cope with real world problems. They need “safe places “ and “soft words”. Screw that! Guess what Mr and Mrs John Q....little Johnny ain’t gonna make my baseball team. He’s not good enough. Little Johnny ain’t gonna pass this English class cause he reads like a 3 rd grader. Little Susie ain’t getting the lead in the school play cause ...she’s not a good actor. Sorry. Try again next year. We as a society are cheating our children out of a future. We need to take it back. We let the schools raise our kids. They become dependent on the system to live. What happens when these kids are supposed to lead us???

End of rant. Sorry. Had to be said. I feel better.


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[ravenmaniac4life]

Fellas. The solution is simple. And it really won’t cost a lot of money. If we as a society simply go back to the way we did shit when I was a kid ( 70’s+80’s) problem solved. No more “participation trophies”. Not every kid makes the team or school play / band. Stop the “inclusion “ bullshit in school. It every kid should be in “regular “ classes. Some kids need more help than others. Some kids have legit learning disabilities. They shouldn’t be holding back the other kids. Tell your kids ...NO!!! Don’t be their damn friend. Be their parent! He’s an idea that worked for my mom and dad ...when your kid gets outa line , bad grades ...whoop their Ass!!!! Fixed my shit. I screwed up ...bam..ass whopping stopped it from happening again. Teach your kids to stand up for themselves. Stop being a pussy!! Make your kids play outside. Limit their electronics. Stop Common Core teaching!! Go back to teaching shit students need to learn! The Three “R’s” and liberal arts. Kids need music, art , gym. How bout shop class. Home Ecc? Make them learn a foreign language. Learn about different cultures. We did. I still remember a handful of teachers that actually impacted my life. They really loved their career. You don’t have that now.
These kids are never told NO. They can’t cope with real world problems. They need “safe places “ and “soft words”. Screw that! Guess what Mr and Mrs John Q....little Johnny ain’t gonna make my baseball team. He’s not good enough. Little Johnny ain’t gonna pass this English class cause he reads like a 3 rd grader. Little Susie ain’t getting the lead in the school play cause ...she’s not a good actor. Sorry. Try again next year. We as a society are cheating our children out of a future. We need to take it back. We let the schools raise our kids. They become dependent on the system to live. What happens when these kids are supposed to lead us???

End of rant. Sorry. Had to be said. I feel better.

+1