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  1. #181

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by StingerNLG View Post
    Which is probably why he was a supplimental draft pick and not a first rounder. But of course fact continues to be irrelevant in all this. Gaither's problems weren't caused by Gaither of course. It was everyone else.

    Jon, let's just blame it on Kyle Boller and let's get this over with, shall we?
    That's not at all what I am saying.

    You are correct that he would have otherwise been a first rounder, probably top 10 pick the following year had he not been a knucklehead, stayed in school and played one more year.


    Literally ALL I am saying is that the folks at the castle share SOME blame. It's funny to watch everyone excuse this away as yet another of the famed wizard of Oz's great moves, when in fact, it hurt our team greatly.

    If you don't want a lazy immature POS on your team polluting the minds of others(understandable) then you adequately replace the player and move on with life. Had we adequately replaced the loss of Gaither, I could subscribe to it being addition by subtraction in the lockerroom. As it is now, we are significantly worse accross 60% of the line, tracing it's roots back to this situation.





  2. #182

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by jonboy79 View Post
    That night Harbs commented the move was "potentially permanent" and the very next day, just a couple of snaps in, Gaither hurts his foot. He then lost 20 pounds came to camp and hurt his back almost immediately.

    So in short, I blame the precipitous drop of our Oline play on that decision and the manner in which his coach handled it with the media, which led to Gaither being an immature, lazy POS.
    Well then we just disagree. Harbaugh is the boss, like it or not. If what happened here was Gaither throwing a hissy fit because he didn't like what the boss told him to do, then that makes it 110% Gaither's fault and 0% anyone else. I'm sorry but I am not going to hold Harbaugh accountable in any way for Gaither behaving like an immature, lazy POS.

    Instead, I'll suggest that you can trace Gaither's immature, lazy POS approach from Hargrove Military Academy -> University of Maryland -> Baltimore Ravens -> KC Chiefs, and it merely took the coach making a reasonable demand of his player to reveal this fact, whether that coach was Ralph Friedgen or John Harbaugh.

    We can have a debate whether moving Oher to the left was smart, be we can't have an argument that this experiment should have been avoided because of fear about how Gaither would deal with it. That argument I can't listen to.





  3. #183

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by jonboy79 View Post
    Agreed, and that was an inner-child known to the Kings of the castle prior to the move.

    The same damn thing happenned at MD.

    The definition of insanity is expecting different results from the same conditions.
    I assume you suggested this line of reasoning to support the idea that the Ravens should have known better than to try and upset Gaither. They should have seen how fragile he was a Maryland and known better than to mess with his head.

    But to me, what I get out of this expression is that it was insane to think Gaither would work out at all, and they should never have put him on the roster to begin with -- they should not have made the same mistake Friedgen and Maryland made when they gave him a chance. By my way of thinking, Haley and KC are revealing themselves to be insane x3.





  4. #184

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by jonboy79 View Post
    If you don't want a lazy immature POS on your team polluting the minds of others(understandable) then you adequately replace the player and move on with life. Had we adequately replaced the loss of Gaither, I could subscribe to it being addition by subtraction in the lockerroom. As it is now, we are significantly worse accross 60% of the line, tracing it's roots back to this situation.
    Okay, that's a different argument and one that I can listen to. Perhaps they should have seen the writing on the wall with Gaither and never banked on him being reliable.

    In which case, it has nothing to do with Oher. Oher is the "other tackle" in this equation, and what you are saying is in addition to Oher, they should have had a better alternative to Gaither and been ready for the inevitable flame out. There is some truth to that perhaps.

    They may have put too much hope in taming Gaither and too much hope in developing Cousins.

    In the end, two weeks from now, I think they'll have a free agent who will step in as the alternative to Gaither...and then even this argument should be moot.





  5. #185
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    The Greater Metropolitan Granite Falls, NC Area
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    2,226

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    shas--
    Not accusing you of typos, but that's HargrAve Military Academy! ;) (Jr. Petard matriculated there...)





  6. #186

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by Beau Petard View Post
    shas--
    Not accusing you of typos, but that's HargrAve Military Academy! ;) (Jr. Petard matriculated there...)
    My bad.

    Mike Hargrave Military Academy it is then.





  7. #187

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by Shas View Post
    My bad.

    Mike Hargrave Military Academy it is then.
    Every game starts with a rain delay, even if there's not a cloud in the sky.
    "This space for rent" - Roger Goodell





  8. #188
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    The Greater Metropolitan Granite Falls, NC Area
    Posts
    2,226

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    No problem. If you ever have occasion to drive down that way, there are a couple of little "gas&go's" on Rt. 29 just north of Chatham that have about the best gasoline prices in the whole travel corridor from Baltimore down into N.C.

    BTW, here's a link to some of the NFLers that went there. My understanding is that many of them are getting a "second chance" - sometimes need to pull up a grade point average - by spending an extra year there befor hitting the "big time" colleges.





  9. #189
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    From parts unknown
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    1,110

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by Shas View Post

    We can have a debate whether moving Oher to the left was smart, be we can't have an argument that this experiment should have been avoided because of fear about how Gaither would deal with it. That argument I can't listen to.
    Ding ding ding! We have a winner!!!





  10. #190

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by Beau Petard View Post
    No problem. If you ever have occasion to drive down that way, there are a couple of little "gas&go's" on Rt. 29 just north of Chatham that have about the best gasoline prices in the whole travel corridor from Baltimore down into N.C.
    I used to have to go to Roanoke a lot and I do recall the gas prices being cheaper than home.

    Hey, while we're on the subject of spoiled brats (Gaither, Not Petard Jr. I'm sure he's an upstanding citizen).

    Did everyone see the story on Jonathan Baldwin?

    Recall he was that prototype, tall, speedy deep threat that many hoped the Ravens would get in the first round of the draft instead of Torrey Smith. The Chiefs traded up ahead of the Ravens to nab Baldwin at pick 26, leaving Jimmy Smith for the Ravens at 27. I was thrilled, but many were furious that we missed on Baldwin.

    Well, he won't be in uniform tonight for the Chiefs. Apparently he has proven to be the complete punk-diva that some people warned us about. He punched-out a teammate and broke his wrist. Out for two months. And he has also pissed off the coaching staff already because he won't listen. So the Chiefs have Gaither and Baldwin in the playpen together.

    I would like the Chiefs to do well, but Frankly, I think Haley is an asshole, so part of me is happy that he's got these fools to work with. Remember it was Haley who pissed off Anquan Boldin in Arizona and the media ended up calling Boldin a spoiled brat. I always felt it was Haley who deserved the criticism. Haley is that nine-year old pitcher who gives up six runs in an inning and then throws his glove on the mound when the coach comes to take him out.
    Last edited by Shas; 08-19-2011 at 03:16 PM.





  11. #191

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by Shas View Post
    Okay, that's a different argument and one that I can listen to. Perhaps they should have seen the writing on the wall with Gaither and never banked on him being reliable.

    In which case, it has nothing to do with Oher. Oher is the "other tackle" in this equation, and what you are saying is in addition to Oher, they should have had a better alternative to Gaither and been ready for the inevitable flame out. There is some truth to that perhaps.

    They may have put too much hope in taming Gaither and too much hope in developing Cousins.

    In the end, two weeks from now, I think they'll have a free agent who will step in as the alternative to Gaither...and then even this argument should be moot.

    It is the basis for my argument that Oz felt that Oher/Cousins WAS a suitable replacement, which we all know to be false now. So, yes, to me, cornered and in no position to rock the boat on gaither, I think it was a poor decision to do so. I think it was an organizational screwup to not have a backup in place, and then after that was not possible, it was a coaching error in attempting to motivate a guy in a way that has proven in the past not to work. The team shot itself int he foot by not having adequate depth, and then pissing off it's best tackle.


    If we had another, legit LT in here, Gaither would be a distant memory, but now we have a sub-par LT (with absolutely 0 backup) and a nightmare situation on the right side. Yanda is average to above on the outside ont he right, but he leaves a gaping hole at RG where he is one of the best in the game. Oher is below adequate on the left, leaving a gaping hole at RT.


    And to pre-empt the others, Gaither as a fifth round pick was low risk, high reward. KC's move is the same. Had we signed Gaither to the big deal that Drew, himself, myself and others deserved it would have been a high-risk, high reward move. There are differences in the moves that I do see.





  12. #192

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by jonboy79 View Post
    I think it was an organizational screwup to not have a backup in place, and then after that was not possible, it was a coaching error in attempting to motivate a guy in a way that has proven in the past not to work. The team shot itself int he foot by not having adequate depth, and then pissing off it's best tackle.
    Totally agree with the first part and disagree with the second.


    And to pre-empt the others, Gaither as a fifth round pick was low risk, high reward. KC's move is the same. Had we signed Gaither to the big deal that Drew, himself, myself and others deserved it would have been a high-risk, high reward move. There are differences in the moves that I do see.
    When the Ravens drafted Gaither, he was a developmental back up, which is essentially what the Chiefs called him--a back up to Brandon Albert. That much is the same. The rea difference is when you look at last season, when the Ravens were dependent on him to be a starter, whether it was going to be the left or right side. That changes it from a low-risk/high-reward scenario, to a high-risk/high-reward scenario.

    They had already questioned his work ethic, and suggested the lack of effort had led to health vulnerability. And yet, they were caught with their pants down when he tanked on them. Perfectly reasonable to criticize them on that count. As for them being the cause of his unavailability due to mishandling him -- bullshit.





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