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  1. #13

    Re: Your thoughts on He Gets Us SB ad

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    Sure, Christians have behaved in terrible ways over the years. But that isn't what Jesus taught.
    The no true Scotsman fallacy.


    The entire history of Christianity and the evil actions taken in that name is exactly why BHC called it hateful, because as you admit Christians have behaved that way.
    Mike MacDonald should be our head coach next season

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  2. #14
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    Re: Your thoughts on He Gets Us SB ad

    Quote Originally Posted by ShadeRaven View Post
    The no true Scotsman fallacy.


    The entire history of Christianity and the evil actions taken in that name is exactly why BHC called it hateful, because as you admit Christians have behaved that way.
    This isn't a fallacy, and the "No True Scotsman Fallacy" isn't in play. I at no time said you were wrong because I had one or a small sample of examples of where you are wrong.

    It is a response to a poorly thought out take. You completely ignore the incredible good done in the name of Christ. From someone in the know, who is also an atheist. Now you may try and employ the fallacy, but I am not giving one or a very few as an example, but a continent and the impression it gave to an atheist.

    As for the evil done by Christians, this as opposed to the evil done in the name of Islam, many eastern religions,or atheism (which has killed more than any other worldview). We can exchange these all you want, but this has nothing to do with the teachings of Jesus, though you tried by distorting one you obviously didn't understand.





  3. #15

    Re: Your thoughts on He Gets Us SB ad

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    , but this has nothing to do with the teachings of Jesus, though you tried by distorting one you obviously didn't understand.
    It's not about what I understand the teaching that has nothing to do with anything. It doesn't matter what I believe.

    The Bible has been used to excuse and incite violence for centuries by Christians. That's a historical fact. Christians using Christianity to incite violence is why BHC called it hateful.

    I'm just answering the question you asked.

    "Sure, Christians have behaved in terrible ways over the years."


    You agree with me.

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    Last edited by ShadeRaven; 02-13-2024 at 09:18 PM.
    Mike MacDonald should be our head coach next season

    If Youre gonna say I said something, Quote me cause yall be lying.





  4. #16
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    Re: Your thoughts on He Gets Us SB ad

    Quote Originally Posted by ShadeRaven View Post
    It's not about what I understand the teaching that has nothing to do with anything. It doesn't matter what I believe.

    The Bible has been used to excuse and incite violence for centuries by Christians. That's a historical fact. Christians using Christianity to incite violence is why BHC called it hateful.

    I'm just answering the question you asked.

    "Sure, Christians have behaved in terrible ways over the years."

    Even you agree with me.

    Sent from my Pixel 6a using Tapatalk
    Indeed, and as I noted this violence is in direct contradiction to what Jesus teaches. Hence, playing Beethoven badly. If you need that clearer not living as Jesus taught.

    People who claim to be Christians are NOT Christianity. The teachings of Jesus, along with the saving Grace of God given through the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus is.

    Christianity is not hateful, which was the claim. I am defending Christianity, not the terrible acts of those who claim to be followers.

    I hope you can see the distinction.





  5. #17

    Re: Your thoughts on He Gets Us SB ad

    Idealistically Islam is a religion of peace but when people call it hateful we all understand why because what has been done in the name of and to spread it.



    Sent from my Pixel 6a using Tapatalk
    Mike MacDonald should be our head coach next season

    If Youre gonna say I said something, Quote me cause yall be lying.





  6. #18
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    Re: Your thoughts on He Gets Us SB ad

    Quote Originally Posted by ShadeRaven View Post
    Idealistically Islam is a religion of peace but when people call it hateful we all understand why because what has been done in the name of and to spread it.



    Sent from my Pixel 6a using Tapatalk
    Peace? Muhammed was a man of war, a conqueror. Jesus says to love your enemies. Muhammed says kill or enslave them. The teachings of Islam are no where near Christianity.





  7. #19

    Re: Your thoughts on He Gets Us SB ad

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    Peace? Muhammed was a man of war, a conqueror. Jesus says to love your enemies. Muhammed says kill or enslave them. The teachings of Islam are no where near Christianity.
    War and slavery are justified in the Bible as stated prior.

    Moses tells the Israelites on the way to the Promised Land how they should acquire and keep slaves (Lev 25:44-46)


    His successor, Joshua, explains that “some of you shall always be slaves” (Josh 9:23).

    Slaves, obey your earthly masters with fear and trembling” (Eph 6:5-6)

    In Deuteronomy 20, God Himself sends Israel to war.

    The Bible does not prohibit all taking of life. For instance, killing in self-defense is justified (Ex 22:2),

    When you hear of wars and rumors of wars, do not be alarmed; this must take place, but the end is still to come” (Mark 13:7, also Matt. 24:6, Lk. 21:9).

    “Or what king, going out to wage war against another king, will not sit down first and consider whether he is able with ten thousand to oppose the one who comes against him with twenty thousand?” (Lk. 14:31). Jesus also said, “When a strong man, fully armed, guards his castle, his property is safe” (Lk. 11:21). Jesus seems to recognize that war and violence are sometimes justified.


    In early Old Testament times war was often seen as a holy war, a conflict initiated and led by God. Such a war was declared by God, Himself (Exodus 17:16; Numbers 31:1-3, 1 Samuel 15:1-3

    Jesus said it is inevitable that wars will continue until He returns (Mark 13:7-8), and He did not oppose earthly governments or their right to maintain armies (Matthew 8:5-10).

    the OT permitted one to retaliate against an offender, taking “an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth” (Mt. 5:38).

    A gentle answer turns away wrath, but a harsh word stirs up anger" (Proverbs 15:1).

    God himself waged war against the Egyptians shows that he is not against all warfare. On other occasions, he authorized his people Israel to wage war. For example, he commanded them to wage war against the Canaanites, who were exceedingly wicked. (Deuteronomy 9:5; 20:17, 18) He directed Israel’s King David to war against the oppressive Philistines. God even provided David with a battle strategy that ensured victory.—2 Samuel 5:17-25.



    in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. Completely destroy them — the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites — as the Lord your God has commanded you. (Deuteronomy 20:16–17)

    Literally do not leave your enemies alive.


    This is what the Lord Almighty says: ‘I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt. Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’ (1 Samuel 15:2–3)


    Literally kill the women and children and infants.

    Again, the Bible repeatedly justifies and endorses war and slavery.


    Sent from my Pixel 6a using Tapatalk
    Mike MacDonald should be our head coach next season

    If Youre gonna say I said something, Quote me cause yall be lying.





  8. #20

    Re: Your thoughts on He Gets Us SB ad

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    Indeed, and as I noted this violence is in direct contradiction to what Jesus teaches. Hence, playing Beethoven badly. If you need that clearer not living as Jesus taught.

    People who claim to be Christians are NOT Christianity. The teachings of Jesus, along with the saving Grace of God given through the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus is.

    Christianity is not hateful, which was the claim. I am defending Christianity, not the terrible acts of those who claim to be followers.

    I hope you can see the distinction.
    They don’t want to see the distinction





  9. #21
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    Re: Your thoughts on He Gets Us SB ad

    Quote Originally Posted by ShadeRaven View Post
    War and slavery are justified in the Bible as stated prior.

    Moses tells the Israelites on the way to the Promised Land how they should acquire and keep slaves (Lev 25:44-46)


    His successor, Joshua, explains that “some of you shall always be slaves” (Josh 9:23).

    Slaves, obey your earthly masters with fear and trembling” (Eph 6:5-6)

    In Deuteronomy 20, God Himself sends Israel to war.

    The Bible does not prohibit all taking of life. For instance, killing in self-defense is justified (Ex 22:2),

    When you hear of wars and rumors of wars, do not be alarmed; this must take place, but the end is still to come” (Mark 13:7, also Matt. 24:6, Lk. 21:9).

    “Or what king, going out to wage war against another king, will not sit down first and consider whether he is able with ten thousand to oppose the one who comes against him with twenty thousand?” (Lk. 14:31). Jesus also said, “When a strong man, fully armed, guards his castle, his property is safe” (Lk. 11:21). Jesus seems to recognize that war and violence are sometimes justified.


    In early Old Testament times war was often seen as a holy war, a conflict initiated and led by God. Such a war was declared by God, Himself (Exodus 17:16; Numbers 31:1-3, 1 Samuel 15:1-3

    Jesus said it is inevitable that wars will continue until He returns (Mark 13:7-8), and He did not oppose earthly governments or their right to maintain armies (Matthew 8:5-10).

    the OT permitted one to retaliate against an offender, taking “an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth” (Mt. 5:38).

    A gentle answer turns away wrath, but a harsh word stirs up anger" (Proverbs 15:1).

    God himself waged war against the Egyptians shows that he is not against all warfare. On other occasions, he authorized his people Israel to wage war. For example, he commanded them to wage war against the Canaanites, who were exceedingly wicked. (Deuteronomy 9:5; 20:17, 18) He directed Israel’s King David to war against the oppressive Philistines. God even provided David with a battle strategy that ensured victory.—2 Samuel 5:17-25.



    in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. Completely destroy them — the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites — as the Lord your God has commanded you. (Deuteronomy 20:16–17)

    Literally do not leave your enemies alive.


    This is what the Lord Almighty says: ‘I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt. Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’ (1 Samuel 15:2–3)


    Literally kill the women and children and infants.

    Again, the Bible repeatedly justifies and endorses war and slavery.


    Sent from my Pixel 6a using Tapatalk
    Yeah, I can't defend literally everything regarding the OT and what God commanded. That said, this is where faith resides. Not in believing God exists, but that God had good reasons for His commands to wipe out civilizations.

    In that context however, most of the slaves you are so worried about were conquered in war. The only way a civilization of that time could maintain control of a land they conquered would be completely wipe out the opposition or enslave them.

    That said, you don't understand a lot of this and you purposely (or the website you got it from) leaves out some important things. The verse Eph 6:5-6 is noted but only the first part of verse 5 is quoted. Why leave the rest out?

    Here are verses 5-8: "Bondservants,[a] obey your earthly masters[b] with fear and trembling, with a sincere heart, as you would Christ, 6 not by the way of eye-service, as people-pleasers, but as bondservants of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart, 7 rendering service with a good will as to the Lord and not to man, 8 knowing that whatever good anyone does, this he will receive back from the Lord, whether he is a bondservant or is free."

    Also note many translations use bondservant as opposed to slave. This is from the ESV, which I prefer, because it is closer to the true meaning of the Greek than many others.

    Why leave out the rest? In reality one should read a lot around a verse to get the context and setting. You should also understand the culture this was written in and to.

    And this author, Paul, also wrote Philemon in which he pleads for Onesimus to be released from slavery.

    Back to Jesus and Christianity. Jesus instructs as to simply walk away if they don't want to be His followers. This is the new covenant. In no way does He ever instruct us to wage physical war to convince them to believe in Him. Even in the OT the fights weren't to make people believe in Yahweh. They were mostly about wiping out people doing absolutely horrific things, including to children (burning them alive as sacrifices, for example). They were also likely done to preserve the uniqueness of God's Chosen People, chosen to bring revelation to the world and most importantly, to bring forth the Messiah.

    And let me finish with this. So what? Do you believe in God? If not, by what moral authority to rend ANY judgment? If there is no God there is no objective morality we are required to live to. It is all simply opinion.





  10. #22
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    Re: Your thoughts on He Gets Us SB ad

    [QUOTE=Greg;2647665]Yeah, I can't defend literally everything regarding the OT and what God commanded./QUOTE]

    They walked across the face of a clock for a brief time, all recorded perfectly by the perfectly created timepiece- The Moon.

    They were in time for a very brief time and were not only known before sent, but specifically created and sent into a specific time, inside of time, to settle a dispute that took place outside of time.

    Gods chosen instrument inside of time, chosen to settle the dispute that took place outside of time, that instrument written about inside the Old Testament, a book that has stood the test of time.
    Politics is the entertainment division of the military industrial complex. ― Frank Zappa





  11. #23

    Re: Your thoughts on He Gets Us SB ad

    My favorite part of this is the atheists going on and on about how terrible Christians are when their side is directly responsible for 100 million deaths in the 20th century. Islam and Christianity have combined for approximately 32 million deaths over the last two thousand years.

    They fuss about stuff in the Old Testament, and that's fine, but ingore the Holocaust (atheists) Mao (atheist) Stalin (atheist). Currently Russia and China are two of the most violent, human rights abusing countries in the world have atheism as their official religion.
    "A moron, a rapist, and a Pittsburgh Steeler walk into a bar. He sits down and says, “Hi I’m Ben may I have a drink please?”
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  12. #24

    Re: Your thoughts on He Gets Us SB ad

    Quote Originally Posted by darb72 View Post
    but ingore the Holocaust (atheists) . Currently Russia and China are two of the most violent, human rights abusing countries in the world have atheism as their official religion.
    Profoundly incorrect.

    Nazi Germany was an overwhelmingly Christian nation.The population of Germany in 1933 was around 60 million. Almost all Germans were Christian, belonging either to the Roman Catholic (ca. 20 million members) or the Protestant (ca. 40 million members) churches. The Jewish community in Germany in 1933 was less than 1% of the total population of the country.The Catholic church and the Nazis had a very strong relationship.





    And modern Russia identifies Christianity, Islam, Judaism, and Buddhism as the country's four “traditional” religions and recognizes the special role of the Russian Orthodox Church (ROC). Vladimir Putin is a member of the Russian Orthodox Church.

    Mike MacDonald should be our head coach next season

    If Youre gonna say I said something, Quote me cause yall be lying.





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