What does this coaching staff actually give Lamar?

[DonNMass]

https://twitter.com/koestreicher34/s...085681152?s=20

Forgot to add it’s because “culture”

[QtR Nevermore]

None of that changed facts. Running the ball, controlling the clock, playing good defense and winning the turnover battle will ALWAYS be winning football: It always has been and always will be.

Of course it is. That list covers every aspect of football other than passing offense and special teams. If you're good at all those things you'll win more games than you lose.

However, that formula is an expensive way to win. Is building a team that can do all that the most efficient use of resources in a salary cap league?

To play defense good enough to win those type of games requires a defense with very few weak links. That was possible in 19 and 20 because the offense was all on rookie contracts and about 70% of the cap was spent on defense. It takes a lot of high picks and salaries to build a complete defense, and even then, it won't stop the top passing offenses from scoring anyway.

To build a running game that dominates the time of possession you need a good O line and, as we've seen this season, good backs. Roman's offense has also needed some of the highest paid FBs and blocking TEs in the league, along with a very mobile QB. Again you're looking at high picks or salaries to build all that.

Even if you check all those boxes, that perfect 90s roster still doesn't help you to win from behind, or to generate any offense against packed boxes, so then you need to add pass catchers, as the Ravens realized.

Once you start drafting WRs and paying TEs, the cracks will start to showing in the rest of the edifice required to play that brand of football. It seems that trying to win that way is just aiming for a smaller target. It's not impossible, but you're making it unnecessarily difficult on yourself

[YorkRavensFan]

Of course it is. That list covers every aspect of football other than passing offense and special teams. If you're good at all those things you'll win more games than you lose.

However, that formula is an expensive way to win. Is building a team that can do all that the most efficient use of resources in a salary cap league?

To play defense good enough to win those type of games requires a defense with very few weak links. That was possible in 19 and 20 because the offense was all on rookie contracts and about 70% of the cap was spent on defense. It takes a lot of high picks and salaries to build a complete defense, and even then, it won't stop the top passing offenses from scoring anyway.

To build a running game that dominates the time of possession you need a good O line and, as we've seen this season, good backs. Roman's offense has also needed some of the highest paid FBs and blocking TEs in the league, along with a very mobile QB. Again you're looking at high picks or salaries to build all that.

Even if you check all those boxes, that perfect 90s roster still doesn't help you to win from behind, or to generate any offense against packed boxes, so then you need to add pass catchers, as the Ravens realized.

Once you start drafting WRs and paying TEs, the cracks will start to showing in the rest of the edifice required to play that brand of football. It seems that trying to win that way is just aiming for a smaller target. It's not impossible, but you're making it unnecessarily difficult on yourself

I agree, none of this is cheap which has been my concern with Lamar's new contract that is on the horizon. If we pay him $45-50M a year, we likely won't be able to afford to build the rest of the team as needed to maximize what he does best and what the coaches appear to want. That's not a statement of should we or shouldn't we resign him, just a statement of fact.

[QtR Nevermore]

I agree, none of this is cheap which has been my concern with Lamar's new contract that is on the horizon. If we pay him $45-50M a year, we likely won't be able to afford to build the rest of the team as needed to maximize what he does best and what the coaches appear to want. That's not a statement of should we or shouldn't we resign him, just a statement of fact.

Without a good QB you just aren't a Super Bowl contender at all. Without Lamar and his salary the Ravens could build a feisty, borderline playoff team like they had between 13 and 19, but why would you volunteer for that when you're set up to aim higher?

That formula isn't cheap, that's why I think it's the philosophy that has to change.

Build a team that uses all your QB's skills, sacrifice a bit of time of possession and run defense in exchange for a bit more scoring, and there is a path to success.

[HbgPARavenfan]

Because I can run off a list of things they DON'T give him:

They don't give him a screen game
They don't give him the play-call until late in the play-clock
They don't give him the Sugar huddle, to help him get into a rhythm, or keep defenses on their heels once they start reeling, or to get the passing offense as a whole into a rhythm
They don't give him improved route concepts
They don't give him an abundance of blitz beaters

Now, if you have a differing opinion on who Lamar is and what his ceiling as a passer is, then that is very understandable. But unless you believe his ceiling is the roof of a basement....... I mean, someone help me understand what Roman actually does for Lamar and if it's that Lamar's ceiling is far lower than I think it is, what is really different about this offense, compared to other Roman offenses we've seen before Lamar? And if there is no difference, why?

I get ur point and I agree .


To play devils advocate, he has 3 first round wr, an all pro te, until injury what was projected to be yet another year are one of the better 1-2 punch rbs.


So I mean I do think they tried to surround him with talent which is something we've never done before,

The scheme and evaluation of talent is a different discussion

But if u need 3 1st round wrs, three good tight ends, very good rbs and u still think u need to improve the oline to make it a top 5 unit... maybe u don't belive in ur scheme or qb as much as you think

[Ravens4life22]

I get ur point and I agree .


To play devils advocate, he has 3 first round wr, an all pro te, until injury what was projected to be yet another year are one of the better 1-2 punch rbs.


So I mean I do think they tried to surround him with talent which is something we've never done before,

The scheme and evaluation of talent is a different discussion

But if u need 3 1st round wrs, three good tight ends, very good rbs and u still think u need to improve the oline to make it a top 5 unit... maybe u don't belive in ur scheme or qb as much as you think

We still counting Watkins ?

[webbrick2007]

Been doing some searching for Lamar passing videos, and I cannot find a single pass where he threw the pass pre break and the ball arrived just as the receiver came out of break.
This is bread and butter for most passing offenses, but I can't even find one time the Ravens executed it.

[jonboy79]

Been doing some searching for Lamar passing videos, and I cannot find a single pass where he threw the pass pre break and the ball arrived just as the receiver came out of break.
This is bread and butter for most passing offenses, but I can't even find one time the Ravens executed it.

Wait…. You are blaming that o. The offense not the passer? Lmao…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Ravens4life22]

Wait…. You are blaming that o. The offense not the passer? Lmao…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Both

[HbgPARavenfan]

We still counting Watkins ?

I mean... they expected him to be a legit wr.

Again they've tried on offense. For as much shit as I posted during the Flacco years about neglecting the O.....

They've tried at least now

[Iamjacks]

I mean... they expected him to be a legit wr.

Again they've tried on offense. For as much shit as I posted during the Flacco years about neglecting the O.....

They've tried at least now

Everyone except the OC that is

[Iamjacks]

Been doing some searching for Lamar passing videos, and I cannot find a single pass where he threw the pass pre break and the ball arrived just as the receiver came out of break.
This is bread and butter for most passing offenses, but I can't even find one time the Ravens executed it.

The entire Boykin thread is a highlight of this.