OT - US Soccer 2021

**Kyle Cactus** · 06-06-2021, 05:27 PM

Another year, another summer soccer thread.

There's no World Cup this year, but the US men's team are competing in Nations League and the Gold Cup while the women are playing in the Summer Olympics. Then the men start a condensed World Cup qualification campaign in the fall. It's been a loooooong drought for meaningful games for the men's team, so I'm ecstatic.

Tonight the men's team plays Mexico for the inaugural Nations League final. We narrowly survived Honduras in Thursday's semifinal, a comically "CONCACAFy" game. They had to bring a stretcher on the field 5 times for not-really-injured Honduran players trying to kill time to get to a shootout. But we got a goal just before the end of regulation.

I'm a little anxious for the game tonight against Mexico. This is the first time I've felt like we had the better players, but I don't know if we're a better team right now.

If you don't really follow the men's team, maybe you only know that we are consistently bad and that we didn't even qualify for the last World Cup. But the generation of young talent coming along is legitimately exciting. I think there is a bit of a lost generation (even by our standards) for the age group that's in their prime. That obviously holds us back right now. But for the 2026 WC cycle I think we will have a legitimately top-15 team. Maybe we'll even creep into the back end of the top 10.

4 players have notable roles at Champions League clubs:
Pulisic at Chelsea
Dest at Barcelona
McKennie at Juventus
Reyna at Dortmund

None of them is over 22. Reyna is only 18. I think it will be fun to watch this group come of age and lead us in the 2026 WC on home soil. If you haven't been following them (there hasn't been much to follow since the end of 2017) now is a great time to jump back in.

In July and August the men's B/C squad will play in the Gold Cup and the Women will play in the olympics. The olympics is a big competition for the Women. Outside of the WC it's really the only meaningful competition they play in.

Then we'll get 8 qualifying matches for the men's team in September through November!

It's a good time to be a US soccer fan!

**moose10101** · 06-06-2021, 07:24 PM

It’s hard to get interested in a sport where faking injuries is so common, and can even be a team strategy. It’s like watching 20 Tom Bradys.

**seraph** · 06-06-2021, 07:26 PM

Gregg out!

**FredGrau** · 06-06-2021, 09:16 PM

Originally Posted by Kyle Cactus

Another year, another summer soccer thread.

There's no World Cup this year, but the US men's team are competing in Nations League and the Gold Cup while the women are playing in the Summer Olympics. Then the men start a condensed World Cup qualification campaign in the fall. It's been a loooooong drought for meaningful games for the men's team, so I'm ecstatic.

Tonight the men's team plays Mexico for the inaugural Nations League final. We narrowly survived Honduras in Thursday's semifinal, a comically "CONCACAFy" game. They had to bring a stretcher on the field 5 times for not-really-injured Honduran players trying to kill time to get to a shootout. But we got a goal just before the end of regulation.

I'm a little anxious for the game tonight against Mexico. This is the first time I've felt like we had the better players, but I don't know if we're a better team right now.

If you don't really follow the men's team, maybe you only know that we are consistently bad and that we didn't even qualify for the last World Cup. But the generation of young talent coming along is legitimately exciting. I think there is a bit of a lost generation (even by our standards) for the age group that's in their prime. That obviously holds us back right now. But for the 2026 WC cycle I think we will have a legitimately top-15 team. Maybe we'll even creep into the back end of the top 10.

4 players have notable roles at Champions League clubs:
Pulisic at Chelsea
Dest at Barcelona
McKennie at Juventus
Reyna at Dortmund

None of them is over 22. Reyna is only 18. I think it will be fun to watch this group come of age and lead us in the 2026 WC on home soil. If you haven't been following them (there hasn't been much to follow since the end of 2017) now is a great time to jump back in.

In July and August the men's B/C squad will play in the Gold Cup and the Women will play in the olympics. The olympics is a big competition for the Women. Outside of the WC it's really the only meaningful competition they play in.

Then we'll get 8 qualifying matches for the men's team in September through November!

It's a good time to be a US soccer fan!

The 4 players you mentioned are young world-class players. The U.S. team can do some serious damage in the next few World Cups - this could easily include one or more upsets of the best in the world.

**jonboy79** · 06-06-2021, 11:55 PM

No effing way is Claudio Reyna old enough that his son is now the young buck on the US team... sonofabitxh, I am officially old...

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**Kyle Cactus** · 06-07-2021, 12:37 AM

Originally Posted by jonboy79

No effing way is Claudio Reyna old enough that his son is now the young buck on the US team... sonofabitxh, I am officially old...

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Haha, yup. I felt the same way. He's only 18 if that makes it any better. He had a great game tonight.

I'm on cloud 9 after watching the fight in this young team. They were a disaster playing out of the back, but they responded every time Mexico scored.

**L. G. Dupre** · 06-07-2021, 09:52 AM

Originally Posted by jonboy79

No effing way is Claudio Reyna old enough that his son is now the young buck on the US team... sonofabitxh, I am officially old...

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

My son was playing high school and club soccer in NJ about the same time as Claudio . I talked to Claudio’s dad at a soccer shop when he was deciding where he would sign in Europe.

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**MarkS** · 06-07-2021, 01:04 PM

Originally Posted by moose10101

It’s hard to get interested in a sport where faking injuries is so common, and can even be a team strategy. It’s like watching 20 Tom Bradys.

Yea, flopping is annoying, but let's be honest: faking an injury for strategic reasons happens in football,too.
Also, trying to draw a free kick or a yellow card is not strategically or ethically that different from a receiver trying to "sell" pass-interference to draw a flag.

As for the game: Holy crap, that was one for the ages. I was shocked when we came out with a back-3. I mean, this could easily have ended up 4-1 Mexico, especially if that 2nd goal hadn't been disallowed for the closet off-sides call I've seen. But the amount of young talent on our side is better then anything I've seen in 30 years.

**Kyle Cactus** · 06-07-2021, 02:26 PM

Originally Posted by MarkS

Yea, flopping is annoying, but let's be honest: faking an injury for strategic reasons happens in football,too.
Also, trying to draw a free kick or a yellow card is not strategically or ethically that different from a receiver trying to "sell" pass-interference to draw a flag.

As for the game: Holy crap, that was one for the ages. I was shocked when we came out with a back-3. I mean, this could easily have ended up 4-1 Mexico, especially if that 2nd goal hadn't been disallowed for the closet off-sides call I've seen. But the amount of young talent on our side is better then anything I've seen in 30 years.

There's flopping and then there's what Honduras did.

I can't blame the players too much, because, as you pointed out, it's a strategic decision. I feel like a rule change or an adjustment to how it's officiated would change that. You can already give a yellow for "simulation," but the refs never do. Tell them to be stricter and it will go away. Or if you want to avoid the subjectivity of that, make it so that when a player goes down and doesn't get back up that they have to stay out of the game for several minutes.

**MarkS** · 06-07-2021, 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by Kyle Cactus

There's flopping and then there's what Honduras did.

I can't blame the players too much, because, as you pointed out, it's a strategic decision. I feel like a rule change or an adjustment to how it's officiated would change that. You can already give a yellow for "simulation," but the refs never do. Tell them to be stricter and it will go away. Or if you want to avoid the subjectivity of that, make it so that when a player goes down and doesn't get back up that they have to stay out of the game for several minutes.

I've thought about that, specifically the ref's reluctance to call this, and here is what I think they should do:

During any meaningful competition, the organizer (FIFA) would review every single match after it's played. Any player found guilty of "simulation" (which was not already penalized on the field) would be retroactively given a yellow card. This would count exactly the same as any yellow card, so if they got a second yellow during the course of that competition - or if this was their second - they're out the next game.

Alternately, you could have the refs in the booth (who are already in charge of VAR) monitor the situation in real-time. They would call down and alert the ref to review any case where simulation may have occurred and not been called, but the ref would still make the final decision.

With regard to what Honduras did. It completely sucks but get used to it. Sadly, shortening the game is the best strategy to take for most of the CONCACAF squads we'll face in the Gold Cup and WC qualifying.

**Kyle Cactus** · 06-07-2021, 02:43 PM

Definitely a match for the ages. It was also just plain crazy. Some highlights, the good and the bad:
- 5 goals
- Extra time
- Controversial calls
- Scuffles between players
- Mexico's coach getting a red
- Pulisic ripping his shirt off and shushing the opposing fans after the PK
- Fans chucking things at our players
- Heroics from our substitute goal keeper
- Some guy running onto the broadcast area and then jumping off the rail behind them
- A pitch invader
- Refs stopping the game because of Mexican fans chanting a slur

Even the pregame coverage was bonkers:
- Clint Dempsey wearing a camo blazer
- Not figuring out who would carry the trophy onto the field until an on air pregame segment
- Losing one of your on air personalities (former US men's player Charlie Davies) to bring the trophy on
- Davies doing the stanky leg during the pregame trophy presentation
- Former US men's player Oguchi Onyewu (playfully) threatened to climb over the table and choke the former Mexican women's player who filled in for Davies

I'm sure there was more that I'm forgetting. This rivalry is fantastic, and CONCACAF is nuts.

**Kyle Cactus** · 06-07-2021, 02:46 PM

Originally Posted by MarkS

I've thought about that, specifically the ref's reluctance to call this, and here is what I think they should do:

During any meaningful competition, the organizer (FIFA) would review every single match after it's played. Any player found guilty of "simulation" (which was not already penalized on the field) would be retroactively given a yellow card. This would count exactly the same as any yellow card, so if they got a second yellow during the course of that competition - or if this was their second - they would miss the next game.

Sounds good to me. Anything that will make it a little more reasonable. The second half of the semifinal against Honduras was so bad that the 2nd half never got into a flow. There was almost as much theatrics as actual soccer. It's not usually nearly that bad. But when it does get that bad there has to be a way for officials to rescue the situation.