The 3rd TE competition.

**Ortizer** · 06-06-2021, 12:23 PM

His best chance to make the roster is if they decide they want Ricard on the dl.

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**QtR Nevermore** · 06-06-2021, 12:45 PM

Originally Posted by edromeo

Like you said, i think putting him on the practice squad is the most likely outcome
I can't see the Ravens carrying 2 FBs.

I've always liked Hill.... I don't think Mason represents any threat to Hill.

Neither do I really. I was just trying to come up with a scenario where Mason makes the roster because I can't see a path for him.

I think the practice squad is the best fit. I'd hate a situation where the Ravens potentially leave themselves short at O Line or DB (where they run out of bodies every year) to try to fit him into the 53 because he was a draft pick.

**Mark** · 06-06-2021, 02:57 PM

Originally Posted by one eyed bird

Yep in goal line and short yardage Ricard as FB and Mason as RB with Boyle as 2nd TE, thats a lot of beef for sure and hard for defenses to match up with

We’re keeping Gus on the bench for Mason?

**rhapsody** · 06-06-2021, 03:11 PM

Originally Posted by BcRaven

rhap, it's not as if Ricard (in the last year of his contract extension) is breaking-the-bank. Here are his contract details from OTC :

https://overthecap.com/player/patric...l%20guarantees.

To me ours is a team with legitimate Super Bowl aspirations. Do we want to cut a young, veteran who has proved his worth, for an unproven rookie at this time? If I was GM, I would not. Let's see how EDC reacts... Bc

I am not for cutting Ricard this year. Btw, your link has Ricard assigned as Interior DL. Looking at the ages of our DL starters, it may be the way forward (primarily) for him in the Ravens' eyes. Some posters were surprised EDC did not draft any IDL in 2021.

Sure, Mason could wind up on PS in 2021 but I don't think the Ravens drafted him with the PS as the preferred or automatic destination.

**John Reglarperson** · 06-06-2021, 03:13 PM

Originally Posted by edromeo

You think the Ravens will carry 2 FBs?

I believe the Ravens carry both Mason and Ricard.

I'm not sure exactly what those players will be called, perhaps Ricard is called a "blocking back", because when you look at the old single wing, you look at where the blocking back stood and what he did, Ricard did a lot of stuff like that. Single wing and today, shotgun snaps. The blocking back in the single wing days stood in front of the Tailback, who took the snap, typically, and the Fullback, who sometimes took the snap. The Tailback (in this case Lamar) would typically run and throw. The Fullback would also run, block and sometimes throw. The Blocking Back would typically block, didn't catch many passes, didn't run much. That's Ricard. There was also a Wing Back, or a Halfback. That would be the equivalent of the Running Back or Slot Back. So, you might have Lamar, Mason at FB, Ricard at BB and Duvernay could be at Slot/Wing or Dobbins could be at Halfback.

Mason and Ricard in the backfield at the same time would = better run blocking. Mason is also a powerful short yardage runner. The run game is improved, with Mason who can either run or block, and Ricard who blocks well, but so far hasn't looked good at running.

For a year or so now I have been calling for more run threats on the field, and Fullback, traditionally, has been a position from which teams have run a lot. Jim Brown was a Fullback, Czonka, Franco, Riggins, all big guys who run for power between the tackles. The Ravens have Ben Mason now who can do that. I didn't feel that the Ravens should've stopped using Ricard as that, but 1 carry, 1 lost fumble isn't exactly the results you want, so I get it.

**John Reglarperson** · 06-06-2021, 03:46 PM

Originally Posted by Mark

We’re keeping Gus on the bench for Mason?

Maybe. Maybe not. I guess it depends on the play.

Left Tight End - Mark Andrews (who is the target on a pass no matter who many dbs are covering him. You'll want him in there)

Right Tight End - Nick Boyle - excellent blocker at TE.

Blocking Back, a guy who stands in front of the TB/QB/Lamar - Patrick Ricard

Fullback, a guy who stands next to or behind the QB who might run or do something else, like block - Ben Mason

Running Back, a guy who runs often, who can also block - Gus Edwards

Quarterback, who, when hes the best running QB in the NFL, will be doing a lot of running - Lamar Jackson

That's 6 right there, Andrews and Boyle as the Ends, Ricard, Mason, Edwards and Jackson as the backs.

The best, most effective play the Ravens can do is Lamar Jackson + 10 blockers. When you're going to do that, it's good to have Ben Mason there, because he's a step up over whoever else you're going to have as a blocker for Lamar Jackson running.

The Ravens can't win the Super Bowl without winning every playoff game. In the Lamar era, the Ravens had no problem winning the games needed to get to the playoffs, but when the playoffs came around, they stopped doing what worked, and passed too much, and lost. They have 1 playoff win, and that was due to Lamar's big TD run. Maybe now, year 4, the Ravens will just do what needs to be done to actually win all the games, put aside "training Lamar to pass" and just get the wins. 1 win, 2 wins, 3 wins, 4 wins, Super Bowl victory.

When the Ravens have the ball between the 25 and the 20, they can use all the expensive new WRs they got to make big plays and score TDs. But when the Ravens get into the red zone, it's time for the Ravens to put in the big blockers, some of whom can run with power, and run the ball. Most of the time it will be Lamar running with 10 good blockers. And the Ravens will get the TD, and not a INT, pick 6, and lose. Ben Mason and Patrick Ricard are both helpful in this power run / Lamar run, red zone / goal line / short yardage offense.

**John Reglarperson** · 06-06-2021, 03:47 PM

Originally Posted by QtR Nevermore

Neither do I really. I was just trying to come up with a scenario where Mason makes the roster because I can't see a path for him.

I think the practice squad is the best fit. I'd hate a situation where the Ravens potentially leave themselves short at O Line or DB (where they run out of bodies every year) to try to fit him into the 53 because he was a draft pick.

If Ben Mason didn't replace Mark Ingram, WHO REPLACED MARK INGRAM?

**QtR Nevermore** · 06-06-2021, 04:08 PM

Originally Posted by John Reglarperson

If Ben Mason didn't replace Mark Ingram, WHO REPLACED MARK INGRAM?

Nobody. (Or NOBODY, if you prefer.)

The Ravens, and NFL teams in general, don't usually carry 4 RBs and a FB. It just happened that way because the Ravens found value they liked in Dobbins and other things fell in the right way for that to happen.

As it turned out, the roster composition wasn't right and the Ravens lacked depth at DB which they needed to add during the season. I don't think 3 RBs and 2 FBs should be the plan going forward.

**one eyed bird** · 06-06-2021, 04:19 PM

Originally Posted by Mark

We’re keeping Gus on the bench for Mason?

Just on goal to go or 4th down with less than 2 yds to go, Mason brings another 30lbs to the equation Straight ahead power runs

**John Reglarperson** · 06-06-2021, 04:29 PM

Originally Posted by BcRaven

I'd rather see Ricard @ FB, Boyle @ 2nd TE, and Edwards carrying the rock in goal line/short yardage situations. I'm not denying Mason, but Gus has proven himself that's why he was given a 2nd contract. He has 10 rushing TDs, 7 receiving, including his 2020 highs (6 rushing, 4 receiving). IMO Mason is not taking that "job" away from 6' 1" 240 lbs. veteran RB Gus Edwards... Bc

Mason would probably be a backup short yardage power runner to Gus Edwards. It's important that the Ravens have a backup power runner in goal line / red zone situations. Dobbins and Hill are not taking that backup power runner job away from Mason. When power running is a very important part of your offense, you want to have more than one player who can do that. You also want to have enough players who block well to fill your offense with them. Lamar plus 10 good blockers should get the job done in the red zone. Last year, the Ravens passed in the red zone, and failed, and lost, and were out of the playoffs.

**John Reglarperson** · 06-06-2021, 04:54 PM

Originally Posted by one eyed bird

Just on goal to go or 4th down with less than 2 yds to go, Mason brings another 30lbs to the equation Straight ahead power runs

You're saying a bunch of things that are absolutely right.

But. Lamar QB, Edwards RB, Mason FB, Ricard BB. You don't have to take Edwards out, or Mason or Ricard. Ricard was called a Fullback, but if you look where he actually lined up, he usually wasn't. He wasn't the big guy in the back - FullyBack - who gets a head of steam takes the handoff from the QB under center and bashes through the line. He often was one or 2 yards behind the line of scrimmage, often went in motion, and did lead blocking, left, right and middle. They called him FB because why not, and because the term "Blocking Back" hasn't really been used since the mid 1940s. But he wasn't lined up as a FB. When Ricard plays the position he usually does, there is a place for Lamar, Mason and Edwards.

The Ravens might also have Ben Cleveland not starting. If they have Ben Cleveland not starting, Ben Cleveland might be an excellent short yardage run blocker, and they can push Villanueva to 6th OL, at TE, put Ben Cleveland at RG or RT, with Villanueva to the right. That would leave Nick Boyle not at a TE spot, perhaps he would be used in the backfield, and you'd have 4 players for 3 backfield spots. Lamar at QB, and 3 of 4 - Boyle, Ricard, Mason, Edwards.

**John Reglarperson** · 06-06-2021, 05:05 PM

Originally Posted by QtR Nevermore

Nobody. (Or NOBODY, if you prefer.)

The Ravens, and NFL teams in general, don't usually carry 4 RBs and a FB. It just happened that way because the Ravens found value they liked in Dobbins and other things fell in the right way for that to happen.

As it turned out, the roster composition wasn't right and the Ravens lacked depth at DB which they needed to add during the season. I don't think 3 RBs and 2 FBs should be the plan going forward.

The Ravens have been the top running team in the NFL, historically, all time great.

They've gotten to the playoffs doing this every year. And then they pass too much and lose.

The Ravens look to me like they replaced one smaller running back with a bigger, more versatile running back.

There is no reason why the Ravens would have fewer running backs after having

In case anyone is curious. What happened was the Ravens replaced one of their running backs (Ingram) with another running back / fullback / special teams / versatile blocker - Ben Mason.

There is no evidence whatsoever that the Ravens did anything but that. There is no evidence that the best running team in NFL history is going to leave themselves short a running back. Ben Mason is the 2nd string power runner.

The Ravens have too many WRs, unnecessary WRs that they spent too much on. But, they're presumably good, they're presumably an upgrade, but they didn't need that upgrade, really. The Ravens had the largest margin of victory in the NFL last year. They just need to figure out the way to win in the playoffs. And the answer is to put big blockers out there when they get into the red zone and have Lamar run. The best thing the Ravens have is Lamar Jackson running.

The Ravens are not cutting down on the number of RB/FBs. It was 5 last year and it will be 5 this year.

Making the thing that they're great at, which gets them to the playoffs every year, record setting, worse is not a good plan. It won't be the Ravens plan, it's not a plan that I like, but you seem to think it's a good plan, to make the Ravens a more generic and dull NFL team.