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  1. #85

    Re: Browns offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by s.r.genovese View Post
    Right, And if you wanna win a Super Bowl your QB will have to, at some point, make some “gotta-have-it” plays where things aren’t schemed exactly right and the pressure is on. I have a lot more faith in all the guys you mentioned to do that before Baker. Again, the best rookie QBs are either locked up or negotiating a new deal after year 3. The browns know Baker the best and they are taking a wait and see mode so what does that tell you?

    He’s Jimmy G with a slightly worse coach. That can get you pretty far - can it get you a Super Bowl win in a world with Brady Mahomes etc? I wouldn’t bet on it.
    Best case scenario for Baker is he's able to ride the talent/coaching far like Jimmy G did in 2019. But the difference is the AFC is a lot tougher to navigate in the postseason.

    I think the gap between Mahomes and Baker is a death sentence if they match up. The Browns played the Chiefs at near full health and they couldn't even beat them with a depleted OL and an early toe injury to Mahomes, followed by a hit that knocked him out of the game completely. The stars aligned perfectly and they still couldn't get past them. A healthy Mahomes with an improved OL just shreds them to pieces.

    The Chiefs have had our number so I'm not going to push the Ravens as a better match up.. but I'm not buying that the Browns will be anything more than a strong regular season team. If they play KC/BUF/BAL in the playoffs it's going to be incredibly tough for them.

    Last 5 AFC QB's in the Superbowl: Mahomes, Mahomes, Brady, Brady, Brady

    I think you need a top 5 QB to get there in the AFC





  2. #86
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    Re: Browns offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by s.r.genovese View Post
    If they stay completely healthy and hit on all their draft picks they will go far. This can be said of almost all any good team. Very rarely does a team keep their key guys healthy or hit on all their picks so it’s much more interesting to me to think about what will happen when not everything goes right. I trust Lamar much more than Baker in said situation.
    I do too, but in "said situation." What if (God forbid) other key offensive Ravens are injured and out for any significant amount of time? You can't look at Mayfield's scenario in the worst light without a comparison to LJ or any other QB or team. All I am saying is "I think some underestimate Baker Mayfield" I do not... Bc





  3. #87

    Re: Browns offseason

    Baker Mayfield today is a better QB than Drew Brees was at this point in his career and not marginally worse than Brady was at the same point. Now that being said, with all of Brees's greatness and some of his supporting casts, he has as many Super Bowl wins and appearances as Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson. If the Browns got one Super Bowl victory out of him and that's totally possible, they'd build more than a statue for the guy.





  4. #88
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    Re: Browns offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Drake View Post
    Baker Mayfield today is a better QB than Drew Brees was at this point in his career and not marginally worse than Brady was at the same point. Now that being said, with all of Brees's greatness and some of his supporting casts, he has as many Super Bowl wins and appearances as Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson. If the Browns got one Super Bowl victory out of him and that's totally possible, they'd build more than a statue for the guy.
    Baker has better stats because the game has different rules than it did when Brady and Brees were going into year 4. Matt Stafford has significantly more passing yards than Dan Marino did after the same number of years played. In his 40s Tom Brady has better stats than he had in most of his 20s. It's tough to compare eras.





  5. #89

    Re: Browns offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by GOTA View Post
    Baker has better stats because the game has different rules than it did when Brady and Brees were going into year 4. Matt Stafford has significantly more passing yards than Dan Marino did after the same number of years played. In his 40s Tom Brady has better stats than he had in most of his 20s. It's tough to compare eras.
    It's always difficult to compare eras, but I can say definitively that Mayfield is a better quarterback than Brees was, in his 3d year in the league he threw 4 more picks than TDs and the Chargers thought Rivers a better option by year 5.

    Systems matter, surrounding talent matters and experience matters. Brady didn't become the guy we see now until the Pats went to the spread and brought in Moss and Welker. There is a narrative about Mayfield that seems tinged by personal dislike for the guy. Mahomes is elevated by Hill and Kelce to a degree we'll only appreciate as they slow down or get injured.

    Kyler Murray has a far higher number of people who think he's really good, even though he's like 26th in the league passing from a clean pocket and near last in passing to the middle of the field. Lamar is elite in both, all the greats excel in those 2 areas, Baker is really good in those areas, but Murray is terrible and it's a canary in the coal mine type stat. But one guy is thought of as a franchise guy, the other not so much.

    With Mahomes, Watson, Allen, Jackson, Lawrence, Burrow and Herbert in the same conference and maybe Tua and Zach Wilson if they pan out or Wentz if he can be fixed, it's going to be brutal for every young quarterback in the AFC. Lord help us if they trade Rodgers to the Broncos.





  6. #90

    Re: Browns offseason

    I know that others disagree, but I would take Baker over Lamar 7 days a week, I think we are 2nd or 3rd in the division this year, depends on Lamars development as a passer, making the proper reads , getting the ball out on time and accurately and not just between the hash. Not a lot of confidence that he will improve working with a pop Warner coach in the offseason.





  7. #91

    Re: Browns offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by one eyed bird View Post
    I know that others disagree, but I would take Baker over Lamar 7 days a week, I think we are 2nd or 3rd in the division this year, depends on Lamars development as a passer, making the proper reads , getting the ball out on time and accurately and not just between the hash. Not a lot of confidence that he will improve working with a pop Warner coach in the offseason.
    This is spam at this point.





  8. #92

    Re: Browns offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by one eyed bird View Post
    I know that others disagree, but I would take Baker over Lamar 7 days a week, I think we are 2nd or 3rd in the division this year, depends on Lamars development as a passer, making the proper reads , getting the ball out on time and accurately and not just between the hash. Not a lot of confidence that he will improve working with a pop Warner coach in the offseason.
    You got the 1st part right anyway. With Baker, this offense looks like the 2019 Browns.





  9. #93

    Re: Browns offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Drake View Post
    This is spam at this point.
    Hey! That's not fair. I like SPAM. It has value. It's great when fried. SPAM is nothing at all like going negative about our MVP quarterback.





  10. #94
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    Re: Browns offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Drake View Post
    This is spam at this point.
    Agreed.





  11. #95

    Re: Browns offseason

    Bakers flaw is his inability to see the middle of the field which is probably due to his height. Of you can keep him from throwing outside the numbers you can make him look bad.

    The Browns along with the Titans are two of the other afc teams where u need to stop the run 1st.





  12. #96

    Re: Browns offseason

    Care to make a bet on who has the better numbers this year Lamar or Baker, combined running and throwing yards to give Lamar a fair chance, I will put a $100 up, we can each pick a charity to donate the money to, I will select St Judes Childrens Hospital if I win. Made this offer last year didn’t have any takers
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Drake View Post
    This is spam at this point.





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