Grade the Ravens off-season so far

[BcRaven]

You do realize Ray Lewis was picked 26. Ed Reed 24. Jarret Johnson 109. Marshal Yanda 86. Za'Darius Smith 122.

You get the point. The other teams in the division all got to pick players those same years too and the Ravens out drafted them.

I can guarantee you that once the season starts there are absolutely zero people working for the Ravens, from Steve Bisciotti on down, who separate whether the players on the field were acquired in free agency, or trades, or the draft, or what round they were drafted in. Good talent is good talent. And bad talent is problematic. It makes absolutely no sense to treat them as separate to me.

Don't forget Todd Heap was drafted last (#31) in 2001 too... Bc

[Shas]

Don't forget Todd Heap was drafted last (#31) in 2001 too... Bc

One pick before....wait for it...Drew Brees.

[BcRaven]

One pick before....wait for it...Drew Brees.

OUCH! considering we weren't re-signing Dilfer (don't know if Elvis was signed by then), it was quite a blunder ... Bc

[jonboy79]

OUCH! considering we weren't re-signing Dilfer (don't know if Elvis was signed by then), it was quite a blunder ... Bc

Could be worse. A good friend of mine is a Dolphins fan. I rag on him all the time about the e-two punch of picking Dante Culpepper with a Knee injury over Brees with a shoulder injury. Just to run it in even more, then we talk about picking Jake Long over Matt Ryan two years later.


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[Shas]

Well, the Chargers gave up on Brees in '06 thinking he was done with a shoulder. So he was undervalued twice.

[Captain Silver]

OUCH! considering we weren't re-signing Dilfer (don't know if Elvis was signed by then), it was quite a blunder ... Bc

No. Kyle Boller was a blunder. If you want to be real, we drafted Chris Redman before Tom Brady... that is fucked.

[Ortizer]

It's not like the regular season where the team's record halfway through matters, and there are actual performances that matter. Asking to grade the season part way through makes a lot more sense than grading offseason moves part way through the offseason before their performance is in the books.

Look at what they are doing at Edge rusher. They let two guys go when they didn't match or top the contract offers. Was what they chose not to do there a smart decision? We don't know because we we don't know what they are choosing to do instead. How can I evaluate the decisions they've made at rosters spots like those occupied by Ward, Judon, and Ngakoue until I see how they elect to replace those players with, with experience levels, treadwear, cost, etc factored in?

At WR they let Snead and D. Bryant go. We know that Watkins has been added. There will almost assuredly be a rookie added. Will that be enough to say that was an upgrade over what they had?

If someone wants to argue they should have broken the piggy bank for Galloway instead of Watkins, okay, but I don't yet know how they will end up spending that money. What will we think if they sign AB? What if they still extend Andrews and Lamar this before the season starts? My feelings about the WR room depend on moves yet to be made.

On the o-line they grabbed Zeitler early. That seems like an upgrade over whomever played RG last year. But I'd also like to see how the depth chart plays out LG and OC, and what happens with OBj, if anything, before I am ready to grade the moves made on the offensive line.

Look, if you want to look at what they've done so far an slap a C or F or whatever on it, go right ahead, but I'm kinda of shrugging and thinking we still have to turn in that big paper we're working and then take the finals, so I'm not particularly focused on our grade right now.

On point. No idea how to grade it until I see what they do.

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[Ortizer]

C+ from me

Given the cap situation (which wasn't terrible but wasn't great)... I think we done alright in free agency. I think Zeitler is a significant upgrade at RG than Powers was last season. There are still some moving pieces on the OL, but as it stands, both pass protection and run defense is already better on paper especially of Stanley can come back.

Watkins in my view is an upgrade over Snead. Watkins is bigger and better blocker and I think he suits our scheme a lot better than Snead did. You are getting Boyle back (hopefully)... so the offense is definitely better on paper in a two TE base offense.

On the defense you have to say that we have took a step back (again only on paper so far). Losing Judon and Yannick is significant (even though Judon definitely was overpaid and is not the greatest pass rusher in the world)... I think this can change if we manage to sign a Justin Houston and then draft another guy in rds 1-2. We should see progress in Harrison, Queen, and Madubike, so that may mitigate some of the damage of losing Judon and Yannick. We are also getting Tavon back although can we really count on his health?

There is still work to do, and providing EDC has a solid draft, I think the grade can go up to a B. I would like to bring in a veteran edge rusher (at the right price) but if not, we should double up on edge rushers as that is the biggest hole on the roster right now.

We should double up anyways if it's a round 2 pick.

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[Captain Silver]

We should double up anyways if it's a round 2 pick.

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We should trade out of the 2nd round. What is our success rate? I feel like outside of Ray Rice & Dobbins... it hasn't been much to write home about. Correct me if I am wrong... or start a thread Culex....

[Shas]

We should trade out of the 2nd round. What is our success rate? I feel like outside of Ray Rice & Dobbins... it hasn't been much to write home about. Correct me if I am wrong... or start a thread Culex....

Are you fucking insane?

Just kidding.

Their early history was a debacle in the second round. It'd gotten better.

One of the problems is that second rounders are guys with first round credentials with some issue that is a question mark. It makes it a very boom or bust round. And it can also mean these players take a longer time to develop.

A little trip through the history of their second rounds...


Late bloomers:

'02 Anthony Weaver (shout out to the new DL coach)
'04 Dwan Edwards
'06 Chris Chester
'09 Paul Kruger
'17 Tyus Bowser

For many of the late bloomers you can point to them being asked to do something at the NFL level that was different than what they did in college. Also, I've always said that it takes longer for players in the trenches to develop the size, strength, awareness, and technique to be great. "Skill players" can be young and athletic kids. Men play in the trenches.

Worst picks:

'05 Dan Cody (made of glass)
'10 Sergio Kindle (ditto)
'10 Terrence Cody (double whammy)
'13 Arthur Brown
'16 Kam Correa

Best Picks

'97 Jamie Sharper
'08 Ray Rice
'11 Torrey Smith
'12 Kelechi Osemele
'20 JK Dobbins

Middling Picks:

'96 DeRon Jenkins
'98 Patrick Johnson
'01 Gary Baxter
'12 Courtney Upshaw
'14 Timmy Jernigan
'15 Maxx Williams

I would love to be able to put a WR or OL '21 pick in the best column. When I look at the Edge prospects I think Late Bloomer, at best.

[boller4president]

Are you fucking insane?

Just kidding.

Their early history was a debacle in the second round. It'd gotten better.

One of the problems is that second rounders are guys with first round credentials with some issue that is a question mark. It makes it a very boom or bust round. And it can also mean these players take a longer time to develop.

A little trip through the history of their second rounds...


Late bloomers:

'02 Anthony Weaver (shout out to the new DL coach)
'04 Dwan Edwards
'06 Chris Chester
'09 Paul Kruger
'17 Tyus Bowser

For many of the late bloomers you can point to them being asked to do something at the NFL level that was different than what they did in college. Also, I've always said that it takes longer for players in the trenches to develop the size, strength, awareness, and technique to be great. "Skill players" can be young and athletic kids. Men play in the trenches.

Worst picks:

'05 Dan Cody (made of glass)
'10 Sergio Kindle (ditto)
'10 Terrence Cody (double whammy)
'13 Arthur Brown
'16 Kam Correa

Best Picks

'97 Jamie Sharper
'08 Ray Rice
'11 Torrey Smith
'12 Kelechi Osemele
'20 JK Dobbins

Middling Picks:

'96 DeRon Jenkins
'98 Patrick Johnson
'01 Gary Baxter
'12 Courtney Upshaw
'14 Timmy Jernigan
'15 Maxx Williams

I would love to be able to put a WR or OL '21 pick in the best column. When I look at the Edge prospects I think Late Bloomer, at best.

Gary Baxter was not a middling pick and Upshaw ate himself out of league just like Cody did. I'd slot both of them one spot differently in opposite directions

In fact people seem to forget how good he was as our number 2. I was happy we ended up landing Rolle but Baxter earned that 6 year deal from the Browns with how he played for is.

[Shas]

Gary Baxter was not a middling pick and Upshaw ate himself out of league just like Cody did. I'd slot both of them one spot differently in opposite directions

In fact people seem to forget how good he was as our number 2. I was happy we ended up landing Rolle but Baxter earned that 6 year deal from the Browns with how he played for is.

You sure like to argue. I thought he was comparable to DeRon Jenkins' careerwise in Baltimore. But fine. We'll change it to say Gary Baxter was one of their best second round picks.