Reopening the Discussion: Perceived or Real Limitations on Lamar as a Passer and its Impact on the Offense

[Noelle18]

All you have to do is go to YouTube and type in “Lamar Jackson passing highlights”.. and any fool can see Lamar can make ANY throw. Even has some nice balls outside the numbers.

What I’ve noticed is many in this board don’t actually watch football outside of the ravens.

Every QB overthrow deep routes, throws bad INt, misses the timing on routes. Look at drew brees last night.

When Lamar does it once in a game “OMG THIS PROVES HE CANT THROW”.

The media does it too. It’s child like and silly.

IMO it stops us from focusing on the real issues. Which is 2 things.

1. I don’t see how anyone with a football IQ above 0 didn’t take away from the Buffalo game first and foremost how much Time josh had to throw vs the ravens.

The Oline was an utter mess. It doesn’t matter how good your offense is, if the Oline constantly collapses the Receivers don’t have time to run their routes and get open and the QB will be running for his life.

Ask Randy Moss and the patriots. If the most profilic passing attack in history couldn’t get off the ground because of the Oline getting beat. What do you think will happen to this ravens offense?

It’s not about Lamar pre snap blitz pickup. Our blitz pickup was fine. Unless it’s cover 0 we have enough blockers to pick up blitzes.

And we picked them up well. Our lineman were just getting destroyed. You saw guys shedding our blocks and collapsing the pocket within seconds.

Focusing on Oline play isn’t sexy nor does it make for good takes on TV, so the pundits stay away from it. So the Casual Fan has no clue what the hell is actually going on.

They just go “derrr look he missed that throw”. “Der look at that 58% completion percentage”.

A prime example of this is chiefs vs browns.

Chiefs were 3rd and about 20 yards from the endzone.

Andy calls a brilliant screen play.

It gets severely destroyed.

The announcers were so busy “ooohing and ahhhing”, they didn’t even tell the people what happened on the play.

I rewound it and slowed it down. It was a CLEAR touchdown...

But the lineman being pulled completely missed his block. He over ran too deep on his pull.

Had he made that one block it was a walk in touchdown.

What’s my point?

That one lineman missing his block was the difference between and touchdown and kicking a field goal.

This is how critical the Oline is, and most casuals don’t have the understanding to know that. So they blame the QB mostly.

Look at Carson wentz. I’ve never been a fan, but you telling me you go from mvp candidate to complete scrub in 2 years?

The reality is that Oline couldn’t block half the posters on this forum. Of course the media it’s all about Carson. But damn no Qb that doesn’t have the ability to run for his life could have success behind that Oline.

This

[Ravensblitzkrieg]

So much to offer, but you’re blinded by your own sense of intellectual superiority. Again, you have a lot to offer, but surely “any fool,” as you would put it, could see how your tone is off putting. Good luck to you. I’d like to be able to fully enjoy your takes in the future.

I have mentioned this before and take or leave it, it’s just cultural differences. I type exactly how I talk. Like how me an my boys talk sports.

One of my closet friends is a die hard Steelers fan. Before covid I use to have a lot of football parties. All we do is curse, scream, and call each other dumb for our opinions. I get it may offend some on here when you read it. Because you are reading it with YOUR VOICE and YOUR TONE in your head.

When I say “any fool”, I’m not calling you a fool literally. It’s not a serious nor condescending tone.

I will work on it as not to offend people. I will always offend hate trolls tho.

[LC_Ravens_87]

I don’t know why it’s so obvious to me I can’t see how an NFL offensive coordinator can’t see this shit.

I don't disagree with much of what you've said, particularly with respect to Roman's habit of repeatedly calling the same plays out of the same formations. But if the solutions were as simple as you claim, they'd be doing it already. They're paid professionals. You're an amateur on a message board.

[Continuity Steve]

That trends with multiple posters accusing Roman of arrogance. I kind of see it in that light, which infuriates me.

Hell, Belichick is arguably one of the better defensive minds in the game, and he CONSTANTLY adjusts his game plans (and, between seasons, tweaks his scheme, "goes back to the lab," etc.). Nobody should assume, just cuz they're "super smart" and have enjoyed success in the past, that other professional coaches, analysts, and film scouts aren't savvy enough to avoid falling into the same old traps week/year-in-and-out.

I wouldn’t even say arrogance so much as a general limitation on his ability to conceptualize and move to a strong pass attack. He has been figured out, and I don’t think he has the ability as an OC to take that next step.

[Continuity Steve]

I have mentioned this before and take or leave it, it’s just cultural differences. I type exactly how I talk. Like how me an my boys talk sports.

One of my closet friends is a die hard Steelers fan. Before covid I use to have a lot of football parties. All we do is curse, scream, and call each other dumb for our opinions. I get it may offend some on here when you read it. Because you are reading it with YOUR VOICE and YOUR TONE in your head.

When I say “any fool”, I’m not calling you a fool literally. It’s not a serious nor condescending tone.

I will work on it as not to offend people. I will always offend hate trolls tho.

Like I said in my last post. I mean well and want to see you maximize your ability to extend your knowledge to others.

As for trolls...strike first, strike hard, no mercy.

[Ravensblitzkrieg]

I don't disagree with much of what you've said, particularly with respect to Roman's habit of repeatedly calling the same plays out of the same formations. But if the solutions were as simple as you claim, they'd be doing it already. They're paid professionals. You're an amateur on a message board.

The solutions are that simple. Why do you think teams change offensive coordinators, if they are so godlike and all knowing?

I see your trying to take a “shot” or dig at me, but I’m sure my football knowledge is light years ahead of yours. So just keep quiet and learn.

[edromeo]

Lamar will go as far his rhythm drop back passing game fundamentals and mechanics will take them.

Scheme comes in to play also.

[FadeToBlack]

I do agree with you both, but it begs the question...why, if it is so obvious to us, is the team not investing in better scheme and offensive personnel? Do they see Jackson as limited as a passer or are they just foolishly stubborn.

I think they realize Lamar is a running quarterback and investing in top talent at receiver would be a poor allocation of cap space. How many times have we heard pundits say "Just let Lamar be Lamar", implying he's at his best as a running QB. Imagine signing a vocal receiver who wants to lead the league in receiving and him complaining to the media and to teammates in the locker room, ruining the chemistry with the team. That could be an expensive mistake on multiple levels.

[Shrubbs]

This is the way I’ve been looking at it:

If Alex Smith (low end NFL Starter) was our starter in this offense we’d win how many games

If Baker Mayfield (middle of the road NFL Starter) was our starter in this offense we’d win how many games?

If Aaron Rodgers (high end NFL starter) was our starter in our this offense we’d win
how many games?

We can talk about how Lamar is as a passer and nitpick his fundamentals and that’s all important. We bitch about the coaching staff and the weapons and the o line. But ultimately, Lamar is winning games at a HISTORIC rate. And I don’t really care how it happens, I just want to win. I think if you put Smith or Mayfield in this offense we’re a sub .500 team easily. This offense is absolutely nothing without our QB1. Andrews and Brown are shrinking violets, capable of totally disappearing in games. We have a really good LT (IR) a really good RT, and a really good blocking TE (IR). We also have a promising rookie RB but he has yet to really take over a game. Call it scheme, call it personnel, but I can’t blame Lamar Jackson. Yeah his footwork could be better, yeah he has some errant throws but he is one of the few QBs in this league that truly can and does win games all on his own. It’s time to stop fucking around, get him some help, and really put him in a position to succeed. Overpay for Allen Robinson, or trade up for a big time receiver. This dragon needs to be slain at all costs. We have a window and it will close.

[LC_Ravens_87]

The solutions are that simple. Why do you think teams change offensive coordinators, if they are so godlike and all knowing?

I see your trying to take a “shot” or dig at me, but I’m sure my football knowledge is light years ahead of yours. So just keep quiet and learn.

Lol, defensive much? I'm only pointing out where you rank on the totem pole.

[Ravensblitzkrieg]

Lol, defensive much? I'm only pointing out where you rank on the totem pole.

Be a man bro. Stand on what you say. You were trying to take a “shot”, because one of my post put your panties in a bunch.

Passive aggressive isn’t a manly trait at all bro.

[FadeToBlack]

It’s time to stop fucking around, get him some help, and really put him in a position to succeed. Overpay for Allen Robinson, or trade up for a big time receiver. This dragon needs to be slain at all costs. We have a window and it will close.

This is probably what they should do, just to say "Hey, we did everything we could and he just couldn't make the leap" if things don't improve. This is actually a pretty solid take because there's no denying what we have from Lamar's legs, his MVP pedigree is something unique.