The Responsibility of Natural Gifts

**The Excellector** · 12-30-2020, 09:51 PM

You know, when Lamar was in his youth playing ball, everyone was likely wowed by his natural gift of running. The same with high school, and the same with Petrino at Louisville. There are even stories of how Jackson’s mom would call Petrino to make sure he stayed true to his word on Lamar and even then, there was just this awe in his natural gifts.

John Harbaugh made some statements that confirmed what many here have kind of suspected, that Lamar wants to be more of a pocket passer who runs when necessary and wants to emphasize his passing well over his running. Harbaugh intimated that Lamar’s turnaround was partly due to him being willing, mentally, to get back to what he does best.

But with guys like that, it makes me feel like that’s all they’re destined to be best at. Because at every stop, when you think a Coach is going to emphasize their development as a passer over anything else, they just fall in love with their legs, the short term wins that can pile up and their development as a passer takes a back seat to those legs. Whereas they could become much better passers who only run when necessary and rack up those wins for a much longer career. So, there’s this sense that they should stick to what they do best.

Has anyone ever truly seen past that to help them evolve? To help grow the idea of what they do best? Every coach that sees you just falls in love with your legs and tries to convince you to not want more than that being the focal point. That’s your ceiling.

I’m just talking out loud. It’s something that’s been on my mind for a while and it bothers me.
I just think about what guys like that could truly be if earlier in their careers, they weren’t pigeonholed into being running QBs. Some guys just don’t have it. Some just don’t have the work ethic. But there are others where it’s like, they could be so much more.......so much more.

**RavenXbio** · 12-30-2020, 10:05 PM

Agreed, ravens might need to grab a staff more interested in grooming a qb

**sflegend89** · 12-30-2020, 10:15 PM

It definitely factors in, football has short seasons filled with only meaningful games unlike baseball/basketball/hockey where there are 10,000's of more reps to go around over the course of a season. Plenty of moments for development & teaching over pure break-neck speed win, win, win mentality.

The NFL especially is a "what have you done for me lately" business. You coach for results in this league. It's incredibly easy to focus on what will win in the short term over what will ultimately be the most sustainable long term.

A big part of developing Lamar as a passer will fall on surrounding him with talented pass catchers who can make integrating a more balanced offensive approach a viable and effective option.

**edromeo** · 12-30-2020, 10:35 PM

Petrino did.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2662128-the-education-of-lamar-jackson-how-louisville-qb-went-from-project-to-superstar

**Julius486** · 12-30-2020, 11:42 PM

Was gonna make the exact same point Ed did; Lamar improved under Petrino. And under Harris.

What's inexcusable, I think, is how Harris can seem to get more out of Lamar than the QB coach of the Ravens. I don't even particularly care about Harbs here, as much as the coaches whose job it is primarily to at the very least make sure Lamar's fundamentals don't slip from one year to the next (let alone building them up...)

Harbs comes into this picture in so far as he has input on who gets hired, and on trying to focus priorities. For the record, he said all the right things during the offseason about where they wanted to go with Lamar. Obviously, some of it is on Lamar himself. But when someone isn't doing their job as effectively as they ought to be doing, and there are demonstrably other people who have done that job better, well...

EDIT: And again, I think we clearly did, as an offense, try and focus more on throwing the ball and limiting Lamar's runs. The problem with that, along with slippage of fundamentals, was the decline in O-line pass pro and no appreciable upgrade to receiving talent. That's more an issue with the front office than Harbs. Again, Harbs comes into this in so far as he participates in promoting a certain conception of our team culture and how we ought to play, but again, we had a year with Harbs (*shudders*) where we threw entirely too much. I don't think Harbs is as inflexible as you think he is. I think the NFL is, for good to great teams, win this year, every year. There's only so long you can push something that isn't working as well as an old way was, especially when that old way is only a year removed and was so damn effective.

**The Excellector** · 12-30-2020, 11:57 PM

Originally Posted by edromeo

Petrino did.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...t-to-superstar

In 2016, he literally had more runs than passing attempts, and it nearly happened again the following season.

**edromeo** · 12-31-2020, 12:12 AM

Originally Posted by The Excellector

In 2016, he literally had more runs than passing attempts, and it nearly happened again the following season.

...So you’re just gonna ignore the article?

**Culex** · 12-31-2020, 12:20 AM

Judging from the thread title I thought this thread was going to be about yours truly

**The Excellector** · 12-31-2020, 12:26 AM

Originally Posted by edromeo

...So you’re just gonna ignore the article?

Oh I read the article. In it, it talks about how Petrino falls in love with Lamar's athleticism first. It does go into him helping to develop Lamar as a passer. The reality is that he only does enough to improve Lamar as a passer to a point that he could start and be somewhat effective with his throws in that offense. All of that........................to still have the guy run more than he threw in 2016.

A story that isn't in that article is of Petrino putting Lamar at returner in practice. Now, in the article, Petrino claims that he knew from the first practice that Lamar was the QB for them. You don't put that guy at returner if you believe that. Lamar's mom found out and called Petrino and gave him a few words about it and Petrino never did it again.

There is a difference between putting in some effort and consideration to developing a QB's passing......................and making his passing the true focal point. Perhaps, you mis-read or misunderstood what I said. "Because at every stop, when you think a Coach is going to emphasize their development as a passer over anything else, they just fall in love with their legs, the short term wins that can pile up and their development as a passer takes a back seat to those legs. Whereas they could become much better passers who only run when necessary and rack up those wins for a much longer career. So, there’s this sense that they should stick to what they do best."

Petrino didn't work on Lamar's development as a passer "over anything else", it still took a back seat to his running ability.

**Raven Roller** · 12-31-2020, 03:04 AM

I like conversations like this, about running QBs. But I've read the original post twice, and I don't quite get what he's asking. Could you be more specific about your concerns, Excellector?

**GOTA** · 12-31-2020, 09:50 AM

Josh Allen hired Jordan Palmer to work with him all offseason since Covid screwed up what the team could do. Palmer usually works with college QBs to get them ready for the draft. He’s Carson Palmers brother and played for the WFT and Bengals. He’s kind of a Ricky Proehl for quarterbacks. Allen’s tremendous improvement this year showed that this coaching helped.

Maybe Lamar could do something similar? We all heard about how he spent a lot of time working with Marquise and Antonio Brown. Hire Palmer or someone else to be part of the process. The first thing Palmer did was digitally map Allen’s throws and show him how a change in mechanics could lead to significant improvement. Allen loves golf so he understood that right away and adopted those changes.

That’s the kind of coaching you can’t get on your own. Allen never would have thought of digital mapping. He said he never even heard of it. Lamar seems to really want to improve. Give him the tools and he will get better.

**Ravenswintitle** · 12-31-2020, 10:07 AM

Originally Posted by GOTA

Josh Allen hired Jordan Palmer to work with him all offseason since Covid screwed up what the team could do. Palmer usually works with college QBs to get them ready for the draft. He’s Carson Palmers brother and played for the WFT and Bengals. He’s kind of a Ricky Proehl for quarterbacks. Allen’s tremendous improvement this year showed that this coaching helped.

Maybe Lamar could do something similar? We all heard about how he spent a lot of time working with Marquise and Antonio Brown. Hire Palmer or someone else to be part of the process. The first thing Palmer did was digitally map Allen’s throws and show him how a change in mechanics could lead to significant improvement. Allen loves golf so he understood that right away and adopted those changes.

That’s the kind of coaching you can’t get on your own. Allen never would have thought of digital mapping. He said he never even heard of it. Lamar seems to really want to improve. Give him the tools and he will get better.

I've heard the guys on SiriusNFL raving about Palmer's work with Allen and how he changed perceptions. Troy Aikman said he always felt accuracy could not be coached up, but after seeing Allen this year admits he was wrong.

The heat of the battle is just not the time to teach fundamentals, you have to use the down time effectively.