Stock market crashing this week with Biden projected winner

[FloridaBasedFan]

Joe doesn't even know what city he's in. Get real. Yet you sit there harping about Joe this, Joe that. Funny shit, right there. If you weren't blinded by your TDS, someone might actually take something you say seriously.

Ok...what is his plan fr the economy? Ive asked here several times and gotten no answer.
What is his plan for immigration, ive asked that as well and gotten no response.

I have yet to hear about anyhting he is going to to his second term. He says the economy will be "greater". How? The virus will go away. How? Immigration is going to change..How? Can anyone give specifics, a plan thats written out??? I know he has endorsed the law enforcement commission that recommended greater qualified immunity, lets officers review there cams before giving a statement and endorses no knocks and phone access. Whats he going to do with that?

I keep hearing from you guys how bad Biden will be but no one here tells me what Trump is going to do in a second term other than make everything great...

[Vlad the lad]

Ok...what is his plan fr the economy? Ive asked here several times and gotten no answer.
What is his plan for immigration, ive asked that as well and gotten no response.

I have yet to hear about anyhting he is going to to his second term. He says the economy will be "greater". How? The virus will go away. How? Immigration is going to change..How? Can anyone give specifics, a plan thats written out??? I know he has endorsed the law enforcement commission that recommended greater qualified immunity, lets officers review there cams before giving a statement and endorses no knocks and phone access. Whats he going to do with that?

I keep hearing from you guys how bad Biden will be but no one here tells me what Trump is going to do in a second term other than make everything great...

Trump already laid the groundwork for a great economy. Just don’t change anything
The virus is going away on its own. We need to open the country. Open schools. And get everyone back to normal. This virus is really only impacting severally ill people. Biden’s plan is to shut down the country for 18 months until a vaccine. Which might never come. We can’t live scared of a virus that only impacts 1%
Immigration is doing well as always. Trump is focused on ILLEGAL immigration. I know that is a new word for liberals. But ILLEGAL immigration is the only problem
Trump has been locking down and building a wall. And this plan is working. Biden wants open borders and doesn’t know the phrase ILLEGAL immigration

[bacchys]

Where did the $865 figure come from, never saw it in either article and can’t believe that it’s honestly even 10% that high...

B. These articles are shite, partisan crap.
Biden will repeal Trump’s tax cuts. There is no maybe, taxes will go up for the middle class. They keep dancing around the maybe, but Trump’s tax cuts saved the middle class a LOT of money that they don’t want to admit.
Myself, I saved more than the $1300 per year, my effective tax rate declined three years in a row despite increased income.

Well, not everyone can link to such non-partisan cites as Red State, The Federalist, and The Epoch Times.

I haven't seen any proposal from Biden to "repeal Trump's tax cuts," though given they more than doubled the deficit they should be repealed. As taxes didn't go down very much for the middle class, they wouldn't go up very much for the middle class if he did. But he hasn't proposed that. He has proposed increasing taxes on those making $400,000 or more, which isn't the middle class.

As for the $865 figure, I believe it comes from calculating a per capita cost of the idiotic Trum tariffs, which are taxes on Americans. Since the middle class and the poor spend a greater share of their income on goods, including and especially imported goods, they are tax hikes on the middle class and the poor.

[Vlad the lad]

Well, not everyone can link to such non-partisan cites as Red State, The Federalist, and The Epoch Times.

I haven't seen any proposal from Biden to "repeal Trump's tax cuts," though given they more than doubled the deficit they should be repealed. As taxes didn't go down very much for the middle class, they wouldn't go up very much for the middle class if he did. But he hasn't proposed that. He has proposed increasing taxes on those making $400,000 or more, which isn't the middle class.

As for the $865 figure, I believe it comes from calculating a per capita cost of the idiotic Trum tariffs, which are taxes on Americans. Since the middle class and the poor spend a greater share of their income on goods, including and especially imported goods, they are tax hikes on the middle class and the poor.

tax cuts don't double deficits. Spending does.


Too many people get confused when numbers are big. If we taught basic budgets in school, more people would understand

When you have bills, and paychecks. and you increase your spending, you blow your budget. Think of tax cuts like adding to your savings account. If you make $1000/wk. And you want to save $100/wk, you don't also increase the amount you are spending on restaurants. you cut back on restaurants, so you can add to savings.

Not sure where you get that Trump tax cuts doubled the deficit. This article (Newsweek, clearly not a conservative point of view), states that the Trump tax cuts increased revenue by 12% for fiscal 2019. The reason we have deficits is because Military spending was drastically cut during Obama. To the point the military was in bad shape. Tax cuts have been proven time and time again, to increase revenue. We don't have a revenue problem, we have a spending problem

The deficit is around $300 billion in excess of what the CBO agency projected it would be prior to the Trump tax cuts in June 2017. The Treasury Department reported tax revenues amounted to $230 billion for fiscal year 2019, a 12 percent increase. Individual tax revenues bumped up 2 percent to $1.7 trillion. Year-over-year federal spending increased 8 percent by the end of September to $4.4 trillion while receipts totaled $3.4 trillion, a 4 percent increase.

https://www.newsweek.com/us-federal-...easury-1467936

[jonboy79]

Well, not everyone can link to such non-partisan cites as Red State, The Federalist, and The Epoch Times.

I haven't seen any proposal from Biden to "repeal Trump's tax cuts," though given they more than doubled the deficit they should be repealed. As taxes didn't go down very much for the middle class, they wouldn't go up very much for the middle class if he did. But he hasn't proposed that. He has proposed increasing taxes on those making $400,000 or more, which isn't the middle class.

As for the $865 figure, I believe it comes from calculating a per capita cost of the idiotic Trum tariffs, which are taxes on Americans. Since the middle class and the poor spend a greater share of their income on goods, including and especially imported goods, they are tax hikes on the middle class and the poor.

He has said it repeatedly! He said it in both debates, lol bury your head in the sand why don’t you.

Spending doubles the deficit and spending is set by Congress. Revenues rose despite tax rate cuts.

He’s proposed raising taxes above $400k in addition to repealing the tax cut, which he is not claiming to be raising taxes and instead considers it rolling back previous legislation. He is playing game with words, and you are falling for it.

The $865 figure is a joke until the math is shown, and context is added. It’s completely made up and ridiculous over-exaggeration until proven otherwise.


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[bacchys]

tax cuts don't double deficits. Spending does.

This is idiotic. Tax cuts do increase deficits. Taxes and spending aren't separate. Starting in the '80s, politicians separated the two in the minds of the people and we've watched the national debt climb bigly ever since.

Too many people get confused when numbers are big. If we taught basic budgets in school, more people would understand

When you have bills, and paychecks. and you increase your spending, you blow your budget. Think of tax cuts like adding to your savings account. If you make $1000/wk. And you want to save $100/wk, you don't also increase the amount you are spending on restaurants. you cut back on restaurants, so you can add to savings.

The government isn't a household or a business, but even within that flawed analogy if you decide to quit working as many hours but don't change your spending habits you're going to run a deficit. That's what cutting taxes without cutting spending does, and every round of tax cuts we've had since the '80s has not been accompanied by spending cuts. Trump's included. In fact, Trump and his Quisling Republican Congress increased spending as well as cut taxes.

Not sure where you get that Trump tax cuts doubled the deficit. This article (Newsweek, clearly not a conservative point of view), states that the Trump tax cuts increased revenue by 12% for fiscal 2019. The reason we have deficits is because Military spending was drastically cut during Obama. To the point the military was in bad shape. Tax cuts have been proven time and time again, to increase revenue. We don't have a revenue problem, we have a spending problem

This is bizarre since you insist spending causes deficits but are here insisting spending cuts to the military caused deficits. Except spending wasn't cut for the military under Obama. It went up. What also existed then- but was repealed for Trump- was sequestration, which mandated 20% cuts across the board without regard to need. We can thank the Tea Party/Freedom Caucus idiots for sequestration.

As for Newsweek, I don't know what numbers they're looking at. The article is titled that economists see Trump's tax cuts as the reason for the exploding deficit, and revenues didn't go up 12%. Revenues were also a lot more than $230 billion, unless they were talking about a single month and wrote it wrong. Revenues in 2017 according to OMB (Table 1.3) were (in billions of current dollars) $3,316.6 billion. In 2018 (after the cuts were in effect), they were $3,329.9 billion. In 2019, $3,464.2. From 2018 to 2019, that's a 4% increase, and, again, those are current dollars. In constant dollars, 2018 to 2019 went from $3,072.2 to $3,141.0, a 2% increase, not a 12% one. The economies were growing, and had the deficit been reasonably low or the budget balanced a tax cut would have been in order, but the latter two conditions didn't exist. Revenues would have been significantly higher had the tax cuts not been adopted, and coupling those tax cuts with spending increases is why we had the massive deficit even pre-pandemic we did. Now it's larger than the budget was just a decade ago.

[bacchys]

He has said it repeatedly! He said it in both debates, lol bury your head in the sand why don’t you.

Spending doubles the deficit and spending is set by Congress. Revenues rose despite tax rate cuts.

He’s proposed raising taxes above $400k in addition to repealing the tax cut, which he is not claiming to be raising taxes and instead considers it rolling back previous legislation. He is playing game with words, and you are falling for it.

The $865 figure is a joke until the math is shown, and context is added. It’s completely made up and ridiculous over-exaggeration until proven otherwise.

Biden has said he's going to increase taxes on those making over $400,000, which is also what he said during the debates if you're honest and not cherry-picking his words.

The Trump tax cuts themselves include tax increases starting next year for the middle class.

[Vlad the lad]

This is idiotic. Tax cuts do increase deficits. Taxes and spending aren't separate. Starting in the '80s, politicians separated the two in the minds of the people and we've watched the national debt climb bigly ever since.

The government isn't a household or a business, but even within that flawed analogy if you decide to quit working as many hours but don't change your spending habits you're going to run a deficit. That's what cutting taxes without cutting spending does, and every round of tax cuts we've had since the '80s has not been accompanied by spending cuts. Trump's included. In fact, Trump and his Quisling Republican Congress increased spending as well as cut taxes.



This is bizarre since you insist spending causes deficits but are here insisting spending cuts to the military caused deficits. Except spending wasn't cut for the military under Obama. It went up. What also existed then- but was repealed for Trump- was sequestration, which mandated 20% cuts across the board without regard to need. We can thank the Tea Party/Freedom Caucus idiots for sequestration.

As for Newsweek, I don't know what numbers they're looking at. The article is titled that economists see Trump's tax cuts as the reason for the exploding deficit, and revenues didn't go up 12%. Revenues were also a lot more than $230 billion, unless they were talking about a single month and wrote it wrong. Revenues in 2017 according to OMB (Table 1.3) were (in billions of current dollars) $3,316.6 billion. In 2018 (after the cuts were in effect), they were $3,329.9 billion. In 2019, $3,464.2. From 2018 to 2019, that's a 4% increase, and, again, those are current dollars. In constant dollars, 2018 to 2019 went from $3,072.2 to $3,141.0, a 2% increase, not a 12% one. The economies were growing, and had the deficit been reasonably low or the budget balanced a tax cut would have been in order, but the latter two conditions didn't exist. Revenues would have been significantly higher had the tax cuts not been adopted, and coupling those tax cuts with spending increases is why we had the massive deficit even pre-pandemic we did. Now it's larger than the budget was just a decade ago.

To summarize. You have an issue with Newsweek
You support that evidence that revenue actually went up

[bacchys]

If I have an issue with Newsweek, so do you. You also have one with OMB. I suppose Newsweek does as well since the numbers at OMB don't match theirs.

Revenue went up, but it went up less than it would have. It also went up a lot less than Trump and the GOP increased spending.

[Vlad the lad]

Biden has said he's going to increase taxes on those making over $400,000, which is also what he said during the debates if you're honest and not cherry-picking his words.

The Trump tax cuts themselves include tax increases starting next year for the middle class.

Ok. After reading this hot piece, I see why you are confused when it comes to finances.

Why didn’t the author point out what taxes are going up. Or by how much. If there is a written law, it has to be know. But your guy calls them “stealth taxes”. What are stealth taxes? In America, everyone is in a tax bracket. What bracket is changing? What deductions are going away for only low income?

I am sure if I searched looney blogs, I could find someone that thinks anything you wanted it to say.

[Vlad the lad]

If I have an issue with Newsweek, so do you. You also have one with OMB. I suppose Newsweek does as well since the numbers at OMB don't match theirs.

Revenue went up, but it went up less than it would have. It also went up a lot less than Trump and the GOP increased spending.

Not sure what this is? Are you playing a childish game of “I know you are but what am I”? I was responding to someone that said tax cuts decrease revenue. I showed that they do. You disputed that, by agreeing that revenue went up.

[bacchys]

Ok. After reading this hot piece, I see why you are confused when it comes to finances.

Why didn’t the author point out what taxes are going up. Or by how much. If there is a written law, it has to be know. But your guy calls them “stealth taxes”. What are stealth taxes? In America, everyone is in a tax bracket. What bracket is changing? What deductions are going away for only low income?

I am sure if I searched looney blogs, I could find someone that thinks anything you wanted it to say.

I don't think you actually read it. At least not for comprehension. I linked the AlterNet piece because the NYTimes has a paywall. Here it is if you'd prefer that:

Republicans, Not Biden, Are About to Raise Your Taxes https://nyti.ms/3kOea5q

Stiglitz isn't my "guy" and it's the CBO and the Joint Committee on Taxation, not Stiglitz, saying this. From the piece in the NYTimes:

Looking at the analyses of the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office and the Joint Committee on Taxation at the time the December 2017 tax bill was enacted, we see very clearly how different income groups are affected by the Trump tax plan. And it’s disturbing.

The current poverty line for a family of four is $26,200: People with incomes between $10,000 and $30,000 — nearly one-quarter of Americans — are among those scheduled to pay a higher average tax rate in 2021 than in years before the tax “cut” was passed. The C.B.O. and Joint Committee estimated that those with an income of $20,000 to $30,000 would owe an extra $365 next year — these are people who are struggling just to pay rent and put food on the table.

Of course, the poor have never mattered much to the Republican Party, but those on the edge of poverty have been particularly hard hit by the pandemic and the recession it has caused, so Trump’s planned tax increases seem especially heartless, and impractical, when you consider that their higher tax payments, while a huge burden for them, will add little to the budget.

By 2027, when the law’s provisions are set to be fully enacted, with the stealth tax increases complete, the country will be neatly divided into two groups: Those making over $100,000 will on average get a tax cut. Those earning under $100,000 — an income bracket encompassing three-quarters of taxpayers — will not.

He's calling them "stealth tax increases" because they weren't touted when the law was passed. Trump and the GOP didn't talk about how taxes were going to go up in 2021 on those making under $100,000.



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