Mad Dog Wink

**edromeo** · 09-30-2020, 09:11 PM

I think Wink needs to scale back the mad dog blitz.

I know, i know the pass rush isn't good enough and we can't get pressure with 4.

But the front end and the back end have to work together.

It seemed like a lot of blitz paired with off coverage.

But the blitz wasn't getting home and it forced rushers to cover like: Judon on Hardman.

And if forced some of the better coverage guys to blitz like Marlon to rush.

That helps no one.

One of the few times the defense generate adequate pressure was:

*I don't have the other vid/image angle that shows the coverage
1st Q - 1:00 {1st and 10}

Simple 4-man rush:

Bowser (stand-up) Rush from the R
Judon (stand-up) Rush from the L
Campbell DT (3tech) on the L
Ellis head-up on RG

It wasn't even a particularly good rush.
Judon does some weird quasi-stunt to the inside.
Campbell gets doubled but pushes the pocket from the inside
Ellis gets stalemated at the LOS
Bowser didn't immediately attack, seems to check contain w/ an arm lock out then easily beats the LT with an inside rip move

But the secondary is playing in a 2-deep shell and they CBs pick up the receivers quickly they're not pressing like I would want but they're not playing 10+ yards off the either.

(1) Rotate the DL so that Campbell and Madubuike/Wolfe are fresh for known or suspected passing downs
I think Madu can beat OGs one-on-one like Ellis got here and create pressure from the inside

(2) Play more 2-deep looks- I would prefer 2-deep press man but 2 deep zone works or even split the coverage and play man on Marlo's side and press zone of Peters side so he can jump routes

(3) Let the dogs hunt. Let Judon and Bowser rush. reduce their pass coverage responsibilities. Turn them loose on the pass rush.

What's the point of having great secondary talent if don't use them?
Why have them playing soft off coverage (or blitz) when they have size, speed and length to press/mirror/trail? (marlon/jimmy)
Don't ask Peters to play deep 3rd give him Safety help over the top and which frees him up to jump routes

Lets not be cute with the blitz. Sometimes I think Wink is in love with getting sacks off blitz because he kinda gets the credit for those.

If I have a great coverage unit I don't want to die because of the blitz.

If you want to beat my defense you have consistently beat tight coverage against one of the best secondary's in the NFL.

**Culex** · 09-30-2020, 09:13 PM

We would be better off with Pees against Mahomes. His defense was more capable of causing confusion and forcing turnovers.. hence why he bent us over last January

**PGCountyRaven85** · 09-30-2020, 09:22 PM

Originally Posted by edromeo

I think Wink needs to scale back the mad dog blitz.

I know, i know the pass rush isn't good enough and we can't get pressure with 4.

But the front end and the back end have to work together.

It seemed like a lot of blitz paired with off coverage.

But the blitz wasn't getting home and it forced rushers to cover like: Judon on Hardman.

And if forced some of the better coverage guys to blitz like Marlon to rush.

That helps no one.

One of the few times the defense generate adequate pressure was:

*I don't have the other vid/image angle that shows the coverage
1st Q - 1:00 {1st and 10}

Simple 4-man rush:

Bowser (stand-up) Rush from the R
Judon (stand-up) Rush from the L
Campbell DT (3tech) on the L
Ellis head-up on RG

It wasn't even a particularly good rush.
Judon does some weird quasi-stunt to the inside.
Campbell gets doubled but pushes the pocket from the inside
Ellis gets stalemated at the LOS
Bowser didn't immediately attack, seems to check contain w/ an arm lock out then easily beats the LT with an inside rip move

But the secondary is playing in a 2-deep shell and they CBs pick up the receivers quickly they're not pressing like I would want but they're not playing 10+ yards off the either.

(1) Rotate the DL so that Campbell and Madubuike/Wolfe are fresh for known or suspected passing downs
I think Madu can beat OGs one-on-one like Ellis got here and create pressure from the inside

(2) Play more 2-deep looks- I would prefer 2-deep press man but 2 deep zone works or even split the coverage and play man on Marlo's side and press zone of Peters side so he can jump routes

(3) Let the dogs hunt. Let Judon and Bowser rush. reduce their pass coverage responsibilities. Turn them loose on the pass rush.

What's the point of having great secondary talent if don't use them?
Why have them playing soft off coverage (or blitz) when they have size, speed and length to press/mirror/trail? (marlon/jimmy)
Don't ask Peters to play deep 3rd give him Safety help over the top and which frees him up to jump routes

Lets not be cute with the blitz. Sometimes I think Wink is in love with getting sacks off blitz because he kinda gets the credit for those.

If I have a great coverage unit I don't want to die because of the blitz.

If you want to beat my defense you have consistently beat tight coverage against one of the best secondary's in the NFL.

It would be good for the first 57 minutes then he’d drive down field for the game winning score. Lol.

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**Ravenswintitle** · 09-30-2020, 09:33 PM

They went there often against KC but they tried everything

**Ravensblitzkrieg** · 09-30-2020, 09:45 PM

Blitzes are effective if you sprinkle it in with 4 man rushes or even 3 man. Blitzing every day will just make you vulnerable to quick passes and screens.

Also there was a play where they went max protect and we got 0 pressure. They sent 3 receivers deep and burned us.

Winks defense is trash honestly. Will always work in the regular season against weak teams, but will suck against great QBs and offensive coordinators

**Culex** · 09-30-2020, 09:47 PM

Originally Posted by Ravensblitzkrieg

Blitzes are effective if you sprinkle it in with 4 man rushes or even 3 man. Blitzing every day will just make you vulnerable to quick passes and screens.

Also there was a play where they went max protect and we got 0 pressure. They sent 3 receivers deep and burned us.

Winks defense is trash honestly. Will always work in the regular season against weak teams, but will suck against great QBs and offensive coordinators

I may have to agree with this. It's too simplistic and I'm just not seeing any of our defenders besides Peters, Hump and Young with a very high football IQ

**edromeo** · 09-30-2020, 09:50 PM

Originally Posted by Ravenswintitle

They went there often against KC but they tried everything

I don't understand your comment here

**QtR Nevermore** · 09-30-2020, 09:52 PM

Originally Posted by edromeo

I think Wink needs to scale back the mad dog blitz.

I know, i know the pass rush isn't good enough and we can't get pressure with 4.

But the front end and the back end have to work together.

It seemed like a lot of blitz paired with off coverage.

But the blitz wasn't getting home and it forced rushers to cover like: Judon on Hardman.

And if forced some of the better coverage guys to blitz like Marlon to rush.

That helps no one.

I didn't mind the blitzing. It was a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. At least Wink stuck with the formula that made the Ravens successful. I wish Roman had done the same.

I think Wink's scheme is one of the best new NFL defensive schemes and I expect it to spread over the next few years. I think it works against 29 or 30 teams, it's just that one or two that's the problem.

Mahomes has the mobility to avoid the rush and the ability to throw from any angle to any player on the field. Couple that with 5 speedy pass catcing options who force defenders to play off and you have the perfect recipe for beating the system. The way Russell Wilson is playing, he might carve it up too, but otherwise who else has the combination of mobility and accuracy to make the Ravens pay?

It's going to make beating the Chiefs a problem but unless they find a couple of top pass rushers down the back of the couch what else can Wink do this season? Matching them score for score while hoping for a couple of stops or turnovers will have to be the Ravens recipe for beating KC in the playoffs.

**edromeo** · 09-30-2020, 10:05 PM

Originally Posted by QtR Nevermore

I didn't mind the blitzing. It was a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. At least Wink stuck with the formula that made the Ravens successful.

Wait, what? You didn't mind the blitzing against the Chiefs?
Even after it clearly wasn't working? I don't understand that mentality at all.

The blitzing isn't what made the Raven's successful historically and it certainly didn't make them successful Monday night. Blitzing is Wink's thing. But the Raven defense has always been good. They were good before Wink's scheme.

If Wink doesn't allow the edge rushers to rush consistently I'm not going to blame them for low pressure/sack numbers.
Rusher's need to rush just like backs need to have carries.

And more importantly the organization has built this defense through the coverage.
Wink's defense minimizes the coverage ability because the QB doesn't have to throw into tight coverage the QB only has to identify the whole in the defense that blitzing creates.

**houstonravensfan** · 09-30-2020, 10:23 PM

Originally Posted by edromeo

Wait, what? You didn't mind the blitzing against the Chiefs?
Even after it clearly wasn't working? I don't understand that mentality at all.

The blitzing isn't what made the Raven's successful historically and it certainly didn't make them successful Monday night. Blitzing is Wink's thing. But the Raven defense has always been good. They were good before Wink's scheme.

If Wink doesn't allow the edge rushers to rush consistently I'm not going to blame them for low pressure/sack numbers.
Rusher's need to rush just like backs need to have carries.

And more importantly the organization has built this defense through the coverage.
Wink's defense minimizes the coverage ability because the QB doesn't have to throw into tight coverage the QB only has to identify the whole in the defense that blitzing creates.

Agree. Furthermore, IMHO, the blitz is an "extra" or extraordinary play meant to surprise or overload an O line. It's something you do because you want to exert EXTRA pressure. Wink blitzes because he has to. He can't get even ordinary pressure without it.

**organizedchaos21** · 09-30-2020, 10:26 PM

Originally Posted by edromeo

*I don't have the other vid/image angle that shows the coverage
1st Q - 1:00 {1st and 10}

**QtR Nevermore** · 09-30-2020, 10:38 PM

Originally Posted by edromeo

Wait, what? You didn't mind the blitzing against the Chiefs?
Even after it clearly wasn't working? I don't understand that mentality at all.

The blitzing isn't what made the Raven's successful historically and it certainly didn't make them successful Monday night. Blitzing is Wink's thing. But the Raven defense has always been good. They were good before Wink's scheme.

If Wink doesn't allow the edge rushers to rush consistently I'm not going to blame them for low pressure/sack numbers.
Rusher's need to rush just like backs need to have carries.

And more importantly the organization has built this defense through the coverage.
Wink's defense minimizes the coverage ability because the QB doesn't have to throw into tight coverage the QB only has to identify the whole in the defense that blitzing creates.

It definitely failed on Monday but we'd be just as angry if Mahomes had had all day to throw. A great offense was on song that day. Wink tried everything but he had to pick his poison and he stuck with his tried and true formula because why not? Since the 2019 defensive turnaround what other team has really punished the Ravens for blitzing?

It's just the Chiefs. Going into the game we knew that, if their offense was playing well, the Ravens would have to score in the 30s. A few longer Ravens drives and the defense could maybe have held them to 30; they did make a couple of stops. That's a good result under the circumstances, especially since scoring will be higher across the board this season because the refs have practically legalised offensive holding. (I only wish the Ravens would notice and start to take advantage too.)