Harbaugh Is The Glass Ceiling

**Terpsfan82** · 09-30-2020, 08:59 AM

Originally Posted by Finisher

How does Harbaugh help us win?

Andy Reid helps his offense. Some help their defense. Some do a little of both.

Pretty much every meaningful game for over half a decade now Harbaugh has gotten completely abused by men who actually coach.

"Special Teams yo" - Spanky, Sunspot circa 2009

**Jazz1988** · 09-30-2020, 09:09 AM

Originally Posted by Finisher

How does Harbaugh help us win?

Andy Reid helps his offense. Some help their defense. Some do a little of both.

Pretty much every meaningful game for over half a decade now Harbaugh has gotten completely abused by men who actually coach.

John Harbaugh was a secondary and special team coach before he became The Ravens head coach. His dad Jack Harbaugh was once a defensive coordinator. It's not even hard to believe that he learned about defense from his dad. Andy Reid may be more accomplished than John Harbaugh but it only took Harbaugh like fours year of his coaching career to get super bowl as a head coach while it took Reid almost over 10 years to do so. I get Ravens fans are mad that we lost against The Chiefs but I think alot you guys are getting way too emotional in a early season.

**BcRaven** · 09-30-2020, 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by Whitty Hutton

I would compare Harbs to Mike D'Antoni in the NBA. Good coach that can get you a lot of wins and look convincing in the regular season, but will not get you the wins that matter most. D'Antoni is horrible at applying adjustments when they are needed (Rockets shooting horribly from 3, but he refuses to stop taking them and get easier buckets), and Harbs' in game adjustments are lacking. The success the Ravens had in the Flacco era was largely due to coordinators, veteran leadership and gritty players that are long gone

I guess you've forgotten that except for a couple of plays (dropped pass & missed chip shot FG) the Ravens would have been in the 2011/12 Super Bowl. Our team came back to win it all the very next year. John harbaugh was the Head Coach both of those years... Bc

**guymf4** · 09-30-2020, 10:49 AM

Originally Posted by BcRaven

I guess you've forgotten that except for a couple of plays (dropped pass & missed chip shot FG) the Ravens would have been in the 2011/12 Super Bowl. Our team came back to win it all the very next year. John harbaugh was the Head Coach both of those years... Bc

He also had like 4 hall of famers on that roster. I've always said, 2011 Ravens were better than 2012. Kc was better in 2018 than 2019 when they won, just like us in 2012.

Harbaugh worked for Andy Reid. Andy Reid doesn't fear Harbaugh and never will, and never should. Only thing I'll give him credit for is knowing his limitations and outsourcing game decisions to his analytics department.

So many comments I want to make on this thread but I agree with the majority of you. It's good analysis. This place is full of smart people.

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**edromeo** · 09-30-2020, 10:59 AM

Originally Posted by Finisher

How does Harbaugh help us win?

Part of the organizational decision to draft Lamar.
Part of the organizational decision to hand the franchise over to Lamar from Joe Flacco.

Part of the organizational decision to re-vamp the defense w/ Wink.

Part of the organizational to rebuild the offense w/ Greg.

**Uli2001** · 09-30-2020, 12:32 PM

Originally Posted by Desert Raven

Let’s not forget who the great Andy Reid was before Mahomes came along. He was constantly criticized for his inability to win big games, and was even fired.

His offenses were always top-notch. That's what I meant.

**Uli2001** · 09-30-2020, 12:37 PM

Originally Posted by QtR Nevermore

I like most of what Harbaugh does. I don't care at all that he doesn't have an offensive or defensive specialism. His role is to get the team organised, together and playing hard and, for the most part, he does that very well.

However that all falls apart when the team has to play a big game. They come into the game lacking confidence, they play scared and they panic when things go wrong. Roman, in particular, seems to fall to pieces and Harbaugh doesn't step in to right the ship.

He's more than earned another chance to sort this out but the psychological problems are now undeniable. If he hasn't taken serious steps to sort this out before the Ravens have to play the next high pressure game, then he's just denying reality.

Even though it might seem foolish to get rid of such a successful coach, it would then become clear that Harbaugh will never win another Super Bowl. With Lamar at QB, that's grounds for moving on.

TL;DR - Give him one last chance.

Another angle on this is that the Ravens are a young team. It's not a team full of seasoned veterans at most positions. Nerves are real before big games. It can only improve from here.

**GOTA** · 09-30-2020, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by Laxdad24

Well ya know GOTA we Ravens fans are ....Spoiled. We won a Super Bowl with Harbs and Co very quickly and haven’t had real success since. Now we have what most consider the “best offense we’ve ever had “ and we don’t seem to compete when the “Lights are Brightest “. I.E. Playoffs , PrimeTime against great teams.

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We ain't perfect but you don't have to be to win a Super Bowl. The team sucked and the coaches sucked. That's over. Now it's time to take it out on Washington

**guymf4** · 09-30-2020, 01:13 PM

This is a side note, and I don't always care what main stream sports media thinks. They've often been our biggest critic and I feel there are many more good minds on this board than out there in the press. And they've been fair to us as of late besides the Lamar haters. In fact, KC felt more slighted by the media than us recently. Swagu is a moron but he didn't even list Mahomes as a top 5 QB last week.

What they are saying, and why I'm posting, is that we got out coached. The Reid play calling is being referred to as innovative and creative. Yes, Mahomes played lights out. He always does. Everybody saw this for the coaching battle it was and the outcome it was. I really had more faith in Wink and Greg.

This is literally our only our only weakness. Scares the shit out of me. Grateful for the imperfect but amazing team we have, but we've now seen ourselves get out coached by Vrabel and Reid x 2 (I don't don't anything that happened under Morninwheg).

This is the only way we lose, and i really believed we were approaching something truly special. Something we haven't seen in this league.

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**guymf4** · 09-30-2020, 01:21 PM

And when it's 4th and goal on the opening drive, you look across the field at Andy Reid and you tell him

"He's going to run it in Andy, and there's not a fucking thing you can do about it. "

And you give Lamar the fucking ball.

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**Whitty Hutton** · 09-30-2020, 02:55 PM

Originally Posted by BcRaven

I guess you've forgotten that except for a couple of plays (dropped pass & missed chip shot FG) the Ravens would have been in the 2011/12 Super Bowl. Our team came back to win it all the very next year. John harbaugh was the Head Coach both of those years... Bc

Ummm...that was the Flacco era I was referring to, so my statement doesn't change. And actually a large reason for them not going to the SB that year is his coaching failure in rushing Cundiff out there with the clock running instead of using a timeout

**pslholder96** · 09-30-2020, 03:08 PM

This thread smh

We lose to the best team with the best qb with the best play caller and now Harbaugh is the problem LOL
They are better than us. Move on. Let's not forget Andy Reid underachieved much of his career until he won the big one last year. Harbaugh did something in 4 years that took Andy Reid 20 years to do.
And this assumption that Harbaugh doesn't have input in scheme is nonsense. It's his team. He has to be involved in everything the team does on the field.