FOOTBALL News/Rumors (Other teams)

[Shas]

People act like the player has no way of fighting back against franchise tags. They can sit out the entire year and accrue seasons like we watched Bell do. They can sit out as long as they want and hold that cap number hostage. We can’t use it while he is sitting on the sidelines.

And before people say “Stanley would never do that” let’s just stop it now because no one here actually knows. All that matters is he could. I wouldn’t expect him to on the first one but I would fully expect him to do something if they did it two years in a row.

So we agree. The one way Stanley could fight back is to sit out rather than put $15MM in the bank next year.

Where we don't agree is how real this threat is, and how much it justifies caving and carving out $22M in cap space for him going forward.

[Desert Raven]

People act like the player has no way of fighting back against franchise tags. They can sit out the entire year and accrue seasons like we watched Bell do. They can sit out as long as they want and hold that cap number hostage. We can’t use it while he is sitting on the sidelines.

And before people say “Stanley would never do that” let’s just stop it now because no one here actually knows. All that matters is he could. I wouldn’t expect him to on the first one but I would fully expect him to do something if they did it two years in a row.

The message being sent is, we’re interested in renting you from year to year as long as we can, but we find your asking price to be too much so we’d rather not make the financial commitment. But you still need to play at an All Pro level. Oh yeah, if you get hurt you’re pretty much out of luck. We don’t have enough faith in you to commit to you, but we have enough faith in you to protect our biggest asset, which is LJ.

I don’t care how much you make, nobody is going to want to give their best being treated like a commodity.

[L. G. Dupre]

Bills just relesed their starting guard Quinton Spain. Something must be up or is he that really that bad

https://twitter.com/BrettKollmann/st...472506880?s=20

Is he better than Fluker?


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[HotInHere]

You actually believe Stanley will sit there and let the team franchise tag him back to back years?

And you keep asking why it’s laughable?...

Now who's being laughable? You think Stanley has a choice?

Sure. He can sit out. Let's count the millions of dollars that that strategy cost Leveon Bell. That's his only other option. If the team franchises him twice, he can either a) play under the tag, or b) sit out, get two years older, and miss out on $35MM dollars and HOPE to recoup that with a big deal.

This has got nothing to do with what Stanley 'deserves.' It's about what the market will bear.

And to your second point, even if the tag is $20MM, Tunsil's cap number right now is $21MM. So how much less is Stanley's going to be on a long-term deal?

Like it or not, the franchise tag exists, and for EXACTLY this reason. The Ravens would be fools not to use it if it's in their best interests.

Of course, best case is to sign Stanley to a reasonable deal. But that takes both sides reaching agreement on what's reasonable. Fact is, in 2022 we will have a lot of flexibility *by design.* EDC is very aware of what contracts are coming up. They have a lot of levers they can move to adjust for their priorities -- and that includes keeping Stanley if they want to.

[HotInHere]

The message being sent is, we’re interested in renting you from year to year as long as we can, but we find your asking price to be too much so we’d rather not make the financial commitment. But you still need to play at an All Pro level. Oh yeah, if you get hurt you’re pretty much out of luck. We don’t have enough faith in you to commit to you, but we have enough faith in you to protect our biggest asset, which is LJ.

I don’t care how much you make, nobody is going to want to give their best being treated like a commodity.

Kirk Cousins played pretty well under the tag. Didn't Dak Prescott just throw for the most yards *in NFL history* in a 3-game span while playing under the tag? You want to tell me he wasn't giving his best?

Sure, all players -- hell, all PEOPLE -- would love to have someone give them long-term security and top dollar. But football players do understand when they join the league that the franchise tag exists, and that it might be used on them. Just as the player will use whatever leverage they can in contract negotiations (holding out, for example) the team will also use the leverage that it has.

[Shas]

Matt Judon doesn't seem to be pouting.

I could argue players play HARDER under the tag because they are auditioning for their next contract.

Sure, he can be insulted and "not give his best." How is that going to help him get the big deal he's looking for from the Ravens or someone else?

He's a player who already has missed starts every year, and then you're telling me that he's going to half-ass his way through the 2021 season, and someone is still going to give him Tunsil money?

If we want to talk about let downs, it's the player you give the big guaranteed deal to that I worry about.

No one here is saying they don't want to see him stick around. But the the money he is asking for is 50% higher than the money the Ravens are obliged to offer him. If I'm the team, I absolutely use that as leverage to get an in-between deal done that still makes him the highest paid tackle not named Tunsil.

[Ravens4Real]

Now who's being laughable? You think Stanley has a choice?

Sure. He can sit out. Let's count the millions of dollars that that strategy cost Leveon Bell. That's his only other option. If the team franchises him twice, he can either a) play under the tag, or b) sit out, get two years older, and miss out on $35MM dollars and HOPE to recoup that with a big deal.

This has got nothing to do with what Stanley 'deserves.' It's about what the market will bear.

And to your second point, even if the tag is $20MM, Tunsil's cap number right now is $21MM. So how much less is Stanley's going to be on a long-term deal?

Like it or not, the franchise tag exists, and for EXACTLY this reason. The Ravens would be fools not to use it if it's in their best interests.

Of course, best case is to sign Stanley to a reasonable deal. But that takes both sides reaching agreement on what's reasonable. Fact is, in 2022 we will have a lot of flexibility *by design.* EDC is very aware of what contracts are coming up. They have a lot of levers they can move to adjust for their priorities -- and that includes keeping Stanley if they want to.

So your entire post was dedicated to your initial condescending question.

He does, in fact, have a choice. And it’s one that could have a very big negative affect on this team. He also doesn’t need to sit out an entire year which you don’t even equate for so I already know you are already leaving scenarios out that don’t fit your narrative.

How about if he sits out all training camp? Sits out games into the season but comes back whenever he feels like it? Any nagging injury, guess who isn’t pushing to play? We already have a use case, teams are dumb enough to pay top dollar even if these guys take a year off. And guess what, if he sits out for however long, this team can’t use the cap space. He can hold us hostage just as much as we can to him.

[Desert Raven]

Kirk Cousins played pretty well under the tag. Didn't Dak Prescott just throw for the most yards *in NFL history* in a 3-game span while playing under the tag? You want to tell me he wasn't giving his best?

Sure, all players -- hell, all PEOPLE -- would love to have someone give them long-term security and top dollar. But football players do understand when they join the league that the franchise tag exists, and that it might be used on them. Just as the player will use whatever leverage they can in contract negotiations (holding out, for example) the team will also use the leverage that it has.

The two examples you provided are how a completely incompetent team handles a franchise QB, and a player chasing a record payday. For the record, I am not against tagging Stanley one time if they’re working on a deal in good faith. Stanley’s camp needs to be somewhat reasonable as well with their expectations. I’m not advocating for Stanley to be given a blank check.

So what other reason would he be tagged other than they want to get a deal on a player for a season? What does he need to prove to the Ravens that he’s worth a mega deal?

[Shas]

I think the point is that the franchise tag makes a lot of business sense if they can't reach a deal, and even back to back tags make business sense if they have to use it. If we can see that, Stanley's agent can see it, and it is legitimate leverage for the team.

We're not talking about the tag because it is the outcome we prefer. The preferred outcome is a reasonable long term deal that is close to $17-$18MM against the cap. Barring that, franchising him is far preferable to panicking and giving him Tunsil's deal.

[The Excellector]

The message being sent is, we’re interested in renting you from year to year as long as we can, but we find your asking price to be too much so we’d rather not make the financial commitment. But you still need to play at an All Pro level. Oh yeah, if you get hurt you’re pretty much out of luck. We don’t have enough faith in you to commit to you, but we have enough faith in you to protect our biggest asset, which is LJ.

I don’t care how much you make, nobody is going to want to give their best being treated like a commodity.

This is a good point. I think Stanley will continue to give his all, because he every sign shows he is a professional. That said, either pay the man's price, trade him or let him walk, but don't keep putting the man through this over and over when you know good and well that if he shreds his knee you won't look out for him at all.

[moose10101]

Jamon Brown was so bad that they cut this man.

https://twitter.com/LamarHeisman/sta...532525574?s=20

That was a mercy cut. He was in danger out there. Wentz probably offered to buy out his contract in self-defense.

[jhoff66]

I think the point is that the franchise tag makes a lot of business sense if they can't reach a deal, and even back to back tags make business sense if they have to use it. If we can see that, Stanley's agent can see it, and it is legitimate leverage for the team.

We're not talking about the tag because it is the outcome we prefer. The preferred outcome is a reasonable long term deal that is close to $17-$18MM against the cap. Barring that, franchising him is far preferable to panicking and giving him Tunsil's deal.

Oh how in the world will Stanley survive after earning 20 plus million dollars so far in his career (after playing on tag). I don't feel sorry at all for the players in this situation.

You are heavily compensated on the tag. If the player play tentatively for the year not giving their best, is that a player you would want long term anyway?

This is a business you do what's best for the organization as a whole not what's best for a single player.

Kick the rock as many times as you can....