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Thread: Wisconsin

  1. #13
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    Re: Wisconsin

    Quote Originally Posted by stevez51 View Post
    There are stories out calling the people with guns a militia & vigilantes.
    I certainly think it's possibly these were people watching this that got tired of seeing nothing being done to stop it and took matters in to their own hands.

    If it's the case, it was only a matter of time before it happened.





  2. #14

    Re: Wisconsin

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    I certainly think it's possibly these were people watching this that got tired of seeing nothing being done to stop it and took matters in to their own hands.

    If it's the case, it was only a matter of time before it happened.
    If you have a gun and try to use it while people are rampaging like this in our current times, you will have to use it. These people at night are pursuing people with guns. They are putting themselves in front of guns. They are looking for things to attack. It's like waving a red flag. They are flocking to any sort of resistance.
    -"You are about to enter a world of pain."





  3. #15
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    Re: Wisconsin

    Quote Originally Posted by Moe the Crow View Post
    If you have a gun and try to use it while people are rampaging like this in our current times, you will have to use it. These people at night are pursuing people with guns. They are putting themselves in front of guns. They are looking for things to attack. It's like waving a red flag. They are flocking to any sort of resistance.
    I’m not sure we’re talking about the same thing. We know nothing about the guy who shot a couple of people. He could have been on of the rioters, could have been a business owner, could have been someone from out of town who wasn’t going to stand for people destroying a city for no reason.

    If it’s the last one or some variation I wouldn’t be surprised.





  4. #16

    Re: Wisconsin

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    I’m not sure we’re talking about the same thing. We know nothing about the guy who shot a couple of people. He could have been on of the rioters, could have been a business owner, could have been someone from out of town who wasn’t going to stand for people destroying a city for no reason.

    If it’s the last one or some variation I wouldn’t be surprised.
    I don't know what happened either. So much disinformation but we know a couple people were shot and it's believed some people with long guns were involved. I don't know if it was business owners, protestors, counter-protestors... I don't know anything. From what's I've seen though guns are magnets for hostility. There was a video a few months back of some big guido looking guys with semi-automatics standing out in front of their pizza place just trying to send the signal to be left alone and a guy walked right up to them and knelt down like "shoot me" and a little kid was involved too and a bunch of people. It was probably the scariest moment in this entire thing i can recall. It was broad daylight. I think it's possible their business might have gotten some bricks through the window if they had not been there and who knows what else but they were approached/tested by the mob/protestors whatever you want to call them. I would call them protestors mixed with marxists and anarchists. It's a dangerous mix.
    -"You are about to enter a world of pain."





  5. #17
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    Re: Wisconsin

    Didn't the guy with the long gun try and surrender to the police and they didn't want any parts of it or was i seeing things?





  6. Re: Wisconsin

    As I heard it from interviews on the radio this morn: Last eve their were couple hundred people protesting peacefully. At 8pm which was the time of the curfew organizers told the group it was time to disperse and go home. The majority of the demonstrators did just that. A number of people stayed out in the streets, probably opportunists or people looking for trouble (speculation on my part), It was after the bulk of the demonstrators left that trouble broke out. It would seem that according to a police rep that their were also anti protestors, some with guns, and armed malitia present during the protests. Some of these armed people were protecting their property while others were roaming the streets after curfew. This incident apparently started at a gas station but no one could say what actually precipitated the shooting. The police are evidently looking at the armed anti protestors and malitia as the shooter(s). Have not heard anything indicating weather it was words or an action that started the shooting.

    This is getting out of control. Dont know about Wisconsin but here where I live we have a stand your ground law. That law does not allow a person to shoot another unless they feel they have been placed in imminent danger. Having a rock thrown thru a window, trespassing, spraying graffiti, and a multitude of other transgressions do not constitute the right to use lethal force. Guess we are going to have to wait and see what it was that set it off. Either way, the shooting that took place while the armed guy was running away from the gas station is going to be hard to justify IMO.

    This is really gonna get crazy if they term the shooting of the guy in the back justified. I could see that happening, with good reason. After showing up at a domestic dispute the guy tried to get away from the cops. It appeared to me the cop was trying to keep the suspect away from the car and it wasnt until the guy opened the door and looked to me like he was reaching for something that the cop shot him. I could easily see the cop saying he warned him not to try and get in the car, and not to put his hands out of sight while reaching in the car. That reaching in the car caused fear for his (the cops) safety/life. This appears much more nuanced that the shooting where the cop shot what he knew was an unarmed man who was guilty of being intoxicated and assaulting him.





  7. Re: Wisconsin

    Quote Originally Posted by Moe the Crow View Post
    Of course. So it's possible it is someone not wanting to have their business burned down that has some buddies with long guns and that makes it a militia.

    And as soon as you use the thing to defend yourself that makes you a vigilante.
    My gut tells me that this is gonna be a case of a wannabe who got himself into a situation he felt he had to shoot his way out of. This supposedly started at a gas station and he wasnt an employee of the station. If thats the case what was he doing out at a gas station, with a gun, after curfew?





  8. #20

    Re: Wisconsin

    Quote Originally Posted by FloridaBasedFan View Post
    Having a rock thrown thru a window, trespassing, spraying graffiti, and a multitude of other transgressions do not constitute the right to use lethal force. Guess we are going to have to wait and see what it was that set it off. Either way, the shooting that took place while the armed guy was running away from the gas station is going to be hard to justify IMO.
    Having a rock thrown through YOUR window ABSOLUTELY constitutes the right of using lethal force. This matter really isn’t up for debate. You may protect your property if you believe their is an imminent commission of a forcible felony likely to occur.

    “ An example of this would be if you pulled up in your driveway and someone comes to your window with a gun and tries to carjack you. In that situation, the attacker is attempting to take your property, but because he’s trying to take it by committing a forcible felony, you would be allowed to use deadly force.”

    Florida Statute 776.013

    If those persons has a weapon and you can make the case you thought they were going to enter while simultaneously believe a “forcible felony” was imminent you’re good. Which in this case given the context of looting and throwing a rock through the window, wouldn’t be a hard case to make.

    On a personal level, I think if you to try to deprive someone of what’s legally theirs, they should be able to defend it using whatever force they deem necessary.

    If this dude is some nobody it is now self defense as he tried to flee the situation. Damn near any way this happens the guy is walking.





  9. #21
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    Re: Wisconsin

    Quote Originally Posted by FloridaBasedFan View Post
    My gut tells me that this is gonna be a case of a wannabe who got himself into a situation he felt he had to shoot his way out of. This supposedly started at a gas station and he wasnt an employee of the station. If thats the case what was he doing out at a gas station, with a gun, after curfew?
    Apparently defending it. But it's all subject to change as more information is available.





  10. #22
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    Re: Wisconsin

    Quote Originally Posted by FloridaBasedFan View Post
    As I heard it from interviews on the radio this morn: Last eve their were couple hundred people protesting peacefully. At 8pm which was the time of the curfew organizers told the group it was time to disperse and go home. The majority of the demonstrators did just that. A number of people stayed out in the streets, probably opportunists or people looking for trouble (speculation on my part), It was after the bulk of the demonstrators left that trouble broke out. It would seem that according to a police rep that their were also anti protestors, some with guns, and armed malitia present during the protests. Some of these armed people were protecting their property while others were roaming the streets after curfew. This incident apparently started at a gas station but no one could say what actually precipitated the shooting. The police are evidently looking at the armed anti protestors and malitia as the shooter(s). Have not heard anything indicating weather it was words or an action that started the shooting.

    This is getting out of control. Dont know about Wisconsin but here where I live we have a stand your ground law. That law does not allow a person to shoot another unless they feel they have been placed in imminent danger. Having a rock thrown thru a window, trespassing, spraying graffiti, and a multitude of other transgressions do not constitute the right to use lethal force. Guess we are going to have to wait and see what it was that set it off. Either way, the shooting that took place while the armed guy was running away from the gas station is going to be hard to justify IMO.

    This is really gonna get crazy if they term the shooting of the guy in the back justified. I could see that happening, with good reason. After showing up at a domestic dispute the guy tried to get away from the cops. It appeared to me the cop was trying to keep the suspect away from the car and it wasnt until the guy opened the door and looked to me like he was reaching for something that the cop shot him. I could easily see the cop saying he warned him not to try and get in the car, and not to put his hands out of sight while reaching in the car. That reaching in the car caused fear for his (the cops) safety/life. This appears much more nuanced that the shooting where the cop shot what he knew was an unarmed man who was guilty of being intoxicated and assaulting him.
    THe initial shooting will be heard to justify, the others not so much. HE was running away and people chased him. When he fell he was surrounded and defended himself.





  11. Re: Wisconsin

    Quote Originally Posted by Ranger View Post
    Having a rock thrown through YOUR window ABSOLUTELY constitutes the right of using lethal force. This matter really isn’t up for debate. You may protect your property if you believe their is an imminent commission of a forcible felony likely to occur.

    “ An example of this would be if you pulled up in your driveway and someone comes to your window with a gun and tries to carjack you. In that situation, the attacker is attempting to take your property, but because he’s trying to take it by committing a forcible felony, you would be allowed to use deadly force.”

    Florida Statute 776.013

    If those persons has a weapon and you can make the case you thought they were going to enter while simultaneously believe a “forcible felony” was imminent you’re good. Which in this case given the context of looting and throwing a rock through the window, wouldn’t be a hard case to make.

    On a personal level, I think if you to try to deprive someone of what’s legally theirs, they should be able to defend it using whatever force they deem necessary.

    If this dude is some nobody it is now self defense as he tried to flee the situation. Damn near any way this happens the guy is walking.
    Big difference between coming at your car window with a gun and having a rock thrown thru a store window by a passerby. Or are you assuming that my reference to rock throwing was at the shooters window in his car? Because yes, that would make a huge difference. We will see.... it is gonna depend on what happened to set it off and why the shooter was there, after curfew, in the first place.





  12. Re: Wisconsin

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    Apparently defending it. But it's all subject to change as more information is available.
    Did you hear anything to indicate he was defending the station? I did not. If he was defending it why did he run away? Why not go into the station and call/wait for the police? It doesnt appear that anyone in the crowd of demonstrators/looters/rioters whatever was armed. Why run down a crowded street of protesters or whatever?
    Last edited by FloridaBasedFan; 08-26-2020 at 12:27 PM.





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