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  1. #289

    Re: Appreciate history!

    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    Just re-read the story you linked, and have concluded that it in no way supports your assertion.

    And that this is an example of exactly the disingenuous bullshit I really have no interest in.

    back on ignore.
    Wow... you are for real, arent you? Amazing, albeit sad.
    Choose your own sources then! There isnīt one news report that doesnīt say this is what happened. And its embarrasing as hell for NASCAR, so why the fcuk would they lie about it? Besides, like I said, the part about who found it and when was avalible on sunday too, thats when we knew Bubba hadnīr even seen it, and then everyone thought it was a threat. So you days later insinuating that he might have staged it is ridiculous. If you wanna stick to your story, sorry, you have an agenda. Theres zero reason to doubt this story.





  2. #290

    Re: Appreciate history!

    Quote Originally Posted by Barksdale View Post
    Wow... you are for real, arent you? Amazing, albeit sad.
    Choose your own sources then! There isnīt one news report that doesnīt say this is what happened. And its embarrasing as hell for NASCAR, so why the fcuk would they lie about it?
    Maybe you don't know much about NASCAR... but they have for years labored under the accusation that their sport was unfair to Black Americans because it did not have a proportional representation of Black Drivers. And the Sports governing family, the Frances, went to great lengths to broaden the appeal of the sport to Black Drivers, going as far as to pay professional black athletes from other sports to make appearances at NASCAR events. But their efforts have proven largely unsuccessful, and Bubba Wallace has really been the only black driver of note for decades, and it is considered a poorly kept secret that NASCAR essentially coerced an ownership team into accepting him.

    All that having been said... up comes this event. And it occurred to me (and in fact to MANY fans of the sport) that NASCAR (unbeknownst to Bubba Wallace) might be taking what was a "less than alarmed" bit of news that was flying around the pits about a noose, and amplified it into a full scale Black Lives Matter crusade, to project a more positive image with the Black Community as a result of their response to it. Thus potentially pulling in southern black viewers and fans of the sport.

    Now this might not have occurred to you... but that doesn't particularly surprise me. And if it were true, you certainly wouldn't expect to read it in an article on ESPN. But it is an entirely plausible scenario, and one that I think is every bit as likely true, as not (given the way events unfolded).

    The fact that you didn't grasp this possibility is not evidence of it's truth.. or of it's falsehood.
    Last edited by owknows; 07-02-2020 at 05:12 PM.





  3. #291

    Re: Appreciate history!

    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    Maybe you don't know much about NASCAR... but they have for years labored under the accusation that their sport was unfair to Black Americans because it did not have a proportional representation of Black Drivers. And the Sports governing family, the Frances, went to great lengths to broaden the appeal of the sport to Black Drivers, going as far as to pay professional black athletes from other sports to make appearances at NASCAR events. But their efforts have proven largely unsuccessful, and Bubba Wallace has really been the only black driver of note for decades, and it is considered a poorly kept secret that NASCAR essentially coerced an ownership team into accepting him.

    All that having been said... up comes this event. And it occurred to me (and in fact to MANY fans of the sport) that NASCAR (unbeknownst to Bubba Wallace) might be taking what was a "less than alarmed" bit of news that was flying around the pits about a noose, and amplified it into a full scale Black Lives Matter crusade, to project a more positive image with the Black Community as a result of their response to it. Thus potentially pulling in southern black viewers and fans of the sport.

    Now this might not have occurred to you... but that doesn't particularly surprise me. And if it were true, you certainly wouldn't expect to read it in an article on ESPN. But it is an entirely plausible scenario, and one that I think is every bit as likely true, as not (given the way events unfolded).

    The fact that you didn't grasp this possibility is not evidence of it's truth.. or of it's falsehood.
    I know quite a lot about NASCAR, as Iīve already mentioned. Iīm very aware of their Diversity Program(s).
    Iīm not surprised to hear that in some circles itīs a "poorly kept secret" NASCAR handcuffed RPM into taking on Bubba. It happens all the time with various drivers in all catergories of racing for various, often financial, reasons, but lets leave it at that Wallace is more than a capable enough driver to warrant him having a seat, OK?

    No, it didnīt cross my mind since there was absolutley no reason for it. Iīm not conspiratorial in general, and since itīs no secret at all that NASCAR scewed up and made quite fools of themselves as the story unfolded, during a time where they already had all the pulicity of that kind they could need thanks to banning the confederate flag etc, yeah.
    We also know, for a fact, that noose was made last october, when Wood Brothers had that garage. We know for a fcat Bubba then absolutley couldnt have staged it. We know that team member contacted NASCAR about it. And no doubt the concerns were real. Bubba hade been very vocal, in an evironment that certainly has its fair share of racists. He had recieved a huge amount of threats, NASCAR too Iīm sure.
    I say you cant use your "plausible" scenarios in this instance without being either ignorant or having an agenda, or both. It is that simple this time. It really is.





  4. #292

    Re: Appreciate history!

    Quote Originally Posted by Barksdale View Post
    We also know, for a fact, that noose was made last october, when Wood Brothers had that garage.
    No, in fact we don't know that. We know that this is possible, but not certain. It could have predated even that.

    We know for a fcat Bubba then absolutley couldnt have staged it.
    Yes... and we know that I stated that I found this unlikely in my progression of posts. (well before you entered the discussion)

    We know that team member contacted NASCAR about it. And no doubt the concerns were real.
    Do you KNOW that... or do you speculate it? There's really no doubt? There's a difference between fact and speculation. If you're going to be a stickler about speculation, you're going to have to hold yourself to the same standard.

    Bubba hade been very vocal, in an evironment that certainly has its fair share of racists. He had recieved a huge amount of threats, NASCAR too Iīm sure.
    Hmmm.. from an article on ABC news... maybe we get a different picture.

    "Make no mistake, though some will try, this should not detract from the show of unity we had on Monday and the progress we’ve made as a sport to be a more welcoming environment for all," Wallace added.

    Since the incident was reported and investigated, Wallace, who is the sport's only top full-time Black driver, received an abundance of support from his team, competitors and the racing community, as well as on social media.


    I say you cant use your "plausible" scenarios in this instance without being either ignorant or having an agenda, or both. It is that simple this time. It really is.
    I say that really isn't yours to judge.





  5. #293
    Join Date
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    Posts
    12,189

    Re: Appreciate history!

    Quote Originally Posted by BcRaven View Post
    I am a white male ("middle of the road" guy) and I think Obama was a good man. He had the kind of "class" that IMO American presidents aught to have. Sure, he wasn't perfect and made mistakes, but which president hasn't? I was appalled when the two candidates (Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump) were our choices in 2016. As a lad, my first introduction to politics was Dwight Eisenhower vs. Adlai Stevenson. IMO either would have been more than adequate. There's no comparison. What has happened to our political system? SMH... Bc
    And it seems that they aren't trying to go back to a better slate or candidates for this election either.
    Quote Originally Posted by Barksdale View Post
    Eh, that was no different from how "leftists" and "libtards" were described. None at all. I didnīt ascribe them views anymore then they do/did.

    It isnīt personal to me. But it is ignorant att classless to call for his suspension and calling him a liar, or implying he might have staged it himself, when we already knew he hadnt even seen the noose himself. Thatīs what I pointed out. And if you didnīt know that at the point of posting, thats on you, because that information was there at the exact same time that FBI released its statement. If you go here to comment on it on a public forum, you read up on it before you accuse someone of staging or lying about something of that magnitude. Simple as that. Common decency. If not, youre ignorant or worse, willfully spreding lies. It really was that simple in this case.
    I think it is important to accept that not everyone here is necessarily looking for the same things. This isn't the debate club where everyone has done rigorous preparation to get ready for the topic at hand. Some people may only have casually followed something or are interested in the discussion generated moreso than trying to follow every detail of a story in real time.

    Sent from my LM-G820 using Tapatalk





  6. #294

    Re: Appreciate history!

    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    No, in fact we don't know that. We know that this is possible, but not certain. It could have predated even that.
    As I understood it, there was video/photo that showed it not being tied up like that when that weekend kicked off, but it was like that later.

    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    Yes... and we know that I stated that I found this unlikely in my progression of posts. (well before you entered the discussion)
    Yes, you kind of slightly lets Bubba get off the hook while instead focusing in on NASCAR being the villains. Great job.


    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    Do you KNOW that... or do you speculate it? There's really no doubt? There's a difference between fact and speculation. If you're going to be a stickler about speculation, you're going to have to hold yourself to the same standard.
    I say we actually know that. Thatīs whats been reported from everyone everywhere. I it wasnīt the case, someone from Wood Brothers or NASCAR or whatever would have said "No, wait, it was like this". But by all means, you seem to have heard a different story from someone with first hand knowledge?

    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    Hmmm.. from an article on ABC news... maybe we get a different picture.

    "Make no mistake, though some will try, this should not detract from the show of unity we had on Monday and the progress we’ve made as a sport to be a more welcoming environment for all," Wallace added.

    Since the incident was reported and investigated, Wallace, who is the sport's only top full-time Black driver, received an abundance of support from his team, competitors and the racing community, as well as on social media.
    How many quotes would you like to have about the backlash BUbba got before this incident, and after it aswell? Theyre everywhere, and you prob know that.

    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    I say that really isn't yours to judge.
    I say even guys like BustofPallas, that hates my very existence, is on my side in this, even though he went bananas in defence of you, so donīt ruin it by sticking to your conspiracies and just sign off on his take of it instead.





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