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  1. #13
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    Re: Jadeveon Clowney = Missing Piece?

    Quote Originally Posted by xiao_ke View Post
    Would probably require Judon getting traded.
    IIRC weren't the Seahawks interested in him? ... Bc





  2. #14
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    Re: Jadeveon Clowney = Missing Piece?

    Quote Originally Posted by BcRaven View Post
    IIRC weren't the Seahawks interested in him? ... Bc
    That was the rumor a week ago.

    https://www.baltimoreravens.com/news...-matthew-judon





  3. #15

    Re: Jadeveon Clowney = Missing Piece?

    The Judon trade would work out pretty well for us if we were getting Clowney. At this point we are expecting either a really late comp pick next year or none at all, so signing Clowney wouldn't lose us a 3rd round pick or anything. Trade Judon for a 2 or 3 now and you're essentially getting that comp pick a year earlier.





  4. #16

    Re: Jadeveon Clowney = Missing Piece?

    I actually value Judon more than most, so my preference is to get him on a longer deal over Clowney on a one year deal.

    I just don't buy the hype. Clowney's best sack total season--from two years ago after having just three sacks last year--matches what Judon did last year while rushing on only 30% of the time. I've gone on and on debating his value, and no need to revisit that debate. But my mind is made up that I simply don't want Clowney short of some miracle-cheap prove it deal falling into our laps.





  5. #17
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    Re: Jadeveon Clowney = Missing Piece?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shas View Post
    I actually value Judon more than most, so my preference is to get him on a longer deal over Clowney on a one year deal.

    I just don't buy the hype. Clowney's best sack total season--from two years ago after having just three sacks last year--matches what Judon did last year while rushing on only 30% of the time. I've gone on and on debating his value, and no need to revisit that debate. But my mind is made up that I simply don't want Clowney short of some miracle-cheap prove it deal falling into our laps.
    Shas, I'm in your boat too. Sure trading Judon might land a 2nd or 3rd round draft pick, but would leave a defensive hole. How do we even know Clowney, who I'd rather not sign, would take a one-year offer when it looks like the Seahawks are offering more? I'll add that even conceding Clowney is the better player, Judon does know the Ravens defense well and his situation in it, plus he looked like he was becoming a leader on our "D" too... Bc





  6. #18
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    Re: Jadeveon Clowney = Missing Piece?

    Quote Originally Posted by BcRaven View Post
    Shas, I'm in your boat too. Sure trading Judon might land a 2nd or 3rd round draft pick, but would leave a defensive hole. How do we even know Clowney, who I'd rather not sign, would take a one-year offer when it looks like the Seahawks are offering more? I'll add that even conceding Clowney is the better player, Judon does know the Ravens defense well and his situation in it... Bc


    Clowney disappears far too often. I don't want to pay Judon top 3 pass rusher money, but also feel the same about Clowney even if he is a marginally better player.





  7. #19

    Re: Jadeveon Clowney = Missing Piece?

    I just feel like I’m smashing my head against a wall. Posting over and over in multiple threads why specifically sack totals are a poor way to evaluate Clowney and pointing to a number of other metrics that indicate that he is an elite player. But smart posters keep just saying “I don’t see it, his sack totals aren’t that high!”





  8. #20

    Re: Jadeveon Clowney = Missing Piece?

    Quote Originally Posted by xiao_ke View Post


    Clowney disappears far too often. I don't want to pay Judon top 3 pass rusher money, but also feel the same about Clowney even if he is a marginally better player.
    I just think this is off base. If you want to argue purely from an off the edge rushing the passer perspective, I think you could make the argument that Judon is better. But Clowney is ELITE against the run and has the versatility to play all along the front 7. He is a swiss army knife up there, not too different from prime McPhee and Zadarius as far as their ability to move aorund in different formations. I'd way rather have that type of weapon in our system.





  9. #21

    Re: Jadeveon Clowney = Missing Piece?

    Quote Originally Posted by NjRavensFan View Post
    I just feel like I’m smashing my head against a wall. Posting over and over in multiple threads why specifically sack totals are a poor way to evaluate Clowney and pointing to a number of other metrics that indicate that he is an elite player. But smart posters keep just saying “I don’t see it, his sack totals aren’t that high!”
    Exactly :)





  10. #22

    Re: Jadeveon Clowney = Missing Piece?

    Different reports on how much Seattle offered and if that Miami offer was legit.

    https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/...-asking-price/
    Although Walsh's system of offense can compensate for lack of talent; however, defense is a different story. According to Walsh, talent on defense was essential and could not be compensated for. What did Walsh do in 1981? He acquired physical and talented players on defense.





  11. #23
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    Re: Jadeveon Clowney = Missing Piece?

    Quote Originally Posted by NjRavensFan View Post
    I just feel like I’m smashing my head against a wall. Posting over and over in multiple threads why specifically sack totals are a poor way to evaluate Clowney and pointing to a number of other metrics that indicate that he is an elite player. But smart posters keep just saying “I don’t see it, his sack totals aren’t that high!”
    They are a poor way to evaluate any Edge. If people want sack totals that are mostly hollow go sign a Vic Beasley. I’ll stick with the Brandon Graham’s and Clowneys of the world myself. Sure, would be nice if they could finish more but what I want is consistent pressure. Also don’t know where this ‘Clowney disappears for games at a time’ narrative comes from.





  12. #24

    Re: Jadeveon Clowney = Missing Piece?

    Quote Originally Posted by NjRavensFan View Post
    I just feel like I’m smashing my head against a wall. Posting over and over in multiple threads why specifically sack totals are a poor way to evaluate Clowney and pointing to a number of other metrics that indicate that he is an elite player. But smart posters keep just saying “I don’t see it, his sack totals aren’t that high!”
    I agree. The analytics say he's elite...he may not be truly elite as there's a middle ground, but the guy beats blocks with the best of them and that's typically what you want.
    Although Walsh's system of offense can compensate for lack of talent; however, defense is a different story. According to Walsh, talent on defense was essential and could not be compensated for. What did Walsh do in 1981? He acquired physical and talented players on defense.





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