Trump

[blah3]

You talk about the freedom to make as much money as possible. At some point, it becomes about more than rich people making as much money as possible and the wealth inequality gap increasing by the second. The bottom 80% of this country owns something like 8% of the stock market and the bottom 50% of the country owns 0%, so only very limited amounts of people in this country are making any type of generational wealth.

We can do better.

So govt is going to do a better job of providing a higher quality of life??? I don’t think so.

[blah3]

2. Milton Friedman himself proposed a rearranging of the economy with a negative income tax which directly helped "special interest" poor people. No data EVER has shown a lack of motivation or loss of freedom with a negative income tax or UBI.
.

Friedman proposed that as a better alternative than welfare. Saying if you are going to have a welfare state, then a negative income would be more efficient and have less demotivating effects than another govt bureaucracy handing out money.

[RFChuck]

3. Yes! That is absolutely my point. When you are the richest country to have ever existed, there comes a point when you decide what benefits the well being of the country more. If the country has more than enough excess money to spend, would my neighbors be better off with the military having another war machine (along with the 740 billion budget in place?), or would my fellow countrymen be better off with better education, or better healthcare, or slightly higher wages? I'll take the latter every single time.

You talk about the freedom to make as much money as possible. At some point, it becomes about more than rich people making as much money as possible and the wealth inequality gap increasing by the second. The bottom 80% of this country owns something like 8% of the stock market and the bottom 50% of the country owns 0%, so only very limited amounts of people in this country are making any type of generational wealth.

We can do better.

Who decides what is enough? Is it a sliding scale, If my wife and I have 4 kids is my enough more than yours because you are single guy? How did you determine we are the richest country that ever existed? Is it based on our government owing some $21 TRILLION dollars? or are you measuring the number of individual billionaires and millionaires in the USA? If its the latter, are you talking about taking their money to redistribute? What happens when you run out of other people's money?

[bandc]

Who decides what is enough? Is it a sliding scale, If my wife and I have 4 kids is my enough more than yours because you are single guy? How did you determine we are the richest country that ever existed? Is it based on our government owing some $21 TRILLION dollars? or are you measuring the number of individual billionaires and millionaires in the USA? If its the latter, are you talking about taking their money to redistribute? What happens when you run out of other people's money?

Who decides what amount of money is good enough for the military (2 trillion, 3 trillion?), or who decides how much banks get bailed out? Answer those questions first, and then I'll tell you how much is good enough to be invested back into the working class.

[bandc]

Friedman proposed that as a better alternative than welfare. Saying if you are going to have a welfare state, then a negative income would be more efficient and have less demotivating effects than another govt bureaucracy handing out money.

I agree with that statement. I think Social Security and Disability benefits should still stay, but I don't have any issue with UBI replacing other welfare tools.

[ravenmaniac4life]

1. Protecting citizens from crimes, and not legislating morality are contradictory statements. If I'm missing something, please help me.

Huh?

Committing crimes (breaking the established laws) is one thing. Legislating morality means that if I call someone a mean word or commit adultery...I am held to task by the government. THAT is not freedom. That is government oppression over my inalienable rights. THAT is North Korea. THAT is the Soviet Union.

You talk about the freedom to make as much money as possible. At some point, it becomes about more than rich people making as much money as possible and the wealth inequality gap increasing by the second.

What an interesting take here...

Based on your answer, do you believe that rich people are and will always be rich and poor people are and will always be poor based on circumstances beyond their control? If you do...you're wrong. Economic mobility is higher now than at any point in this country ever. Poor people can achieve success that defines them as "rich." Also, rich people can lose their wealth and become defined as "poor." We're not pigeon held into our economic situation. It fluctuates everyday.

"Poor people" today have cell phones and $300 sneakers. Is that wealth inequality, or is it poor people making stupid monetary decisions?

We have the ability to become wealthy in the US economic system. I don't know if you believe that, but it's true.

The bottom 80% of this country owns something like 8% of the stock market and the bottom 50% of the country owns 0%, so only very limited amounts of people in this country are making any type of generational wealth.

It's interesting to hear the words "generational wealth" thrown around. Politicians use it to infer that all rich people are basically given their wealth and that's not fair to someone else who isn't given wealth.

EVERYBODY has every opportunity to become wealthy or successful in America. EVERYBODY. THAT is one of the many reasons people float on trash in shark infested ocean waters to come live here. THAT is one of the many reasons that people trek through thousands of miles of dangerous desert to come live here.

At some point in "generational wealth," somebody was poor and became wealthy. Wealth didn't just happen. I am a father and my plan is to set my children up for success so that they won't have to face economic hardships. My father's goal was the same for me. His father's goal was the same for him. That's not "generational wealth." That's called making good life decisions. At some point, someone has to get the ball rolling.

The government taking our money and then giving a % of it back IS NOT going to increase anyone's wealth.

We can do better.

Correct. Work harder.

[RFChuck]

Who decides what amount of money is good enough for the military (2 trillion, 3 trillion?), or who decides how much banks get bailed out? Answer those questions first, and then I'll tell you how much is good enough to be invested back into the working class.

2 of the 3 branches of government work to decide the numbers you asked about above. Not sure why that matters in your "enough is enough" world?

[BustOfPallas]

2 of the 3 branches of government work to decide the numbers you asked about above. Not sure why that matters in your "enough is enough" world?

Enough is enough always sounds pretty good when your looking up and not down.

[Vlad the lad]

Who decides what amount of money is good enough for the military (2 trillion, 3 trillion?), or who decides how much banks get bailed out? Answer those questions first, and then I'll tell you how much is good enough to be invested back into the working class.

Congress. You should know this

[bandc]

Huh?

Committing crimes (breaking the established laws) is one thing. Legislating morality means that if I call someone a mean word or commit adultery...I am held to task by the government. THAT is not freedom. That is government oppression over my inalienable rights. THAT is North Korea. THAT is the Soviet Union.



What an interesting take here...

Based on your answer, do you believe that rich people are rich and poor people are poor based on circumstances beyond their control? If you do...you're wrong. Economic mobility is higher now than at any point in this country ever. Poor people can achieve success that defines them as "rich." Also, rich people can lose their wealth and become defined as "poor." We're not pigeon held into our economic situation. It fluctuates everyday.

"Poor people" today have cell phones and $300 sneakers. Is that wealth inequality, or is it poor people making stupid monetary decisions?

We have the ability to become wealthy in the US economic system. I don't know if you believe that, but it's true.




It's interesting to hear the words "generational wealth" thrown around. Politicians use it to infer that all rich people are basically given their wealth and that's not fair to someone else who isn't given wealth.

EVERYBODY has every opportunity to become wealthy or successful in America. EVERYBODY. THAT is one of the many reasons people float on trash in shark infested ocean waters to come live here. THAT is one of the many reasons that people trek through thousands of miles of dangerous desert to come live here.

At some point in "generational wealth," somebody was poor and became wealthy. Wealth didn't just happen. I am a father and my plan is to set my children up for success so that they won't have to face economic hardships. My father's goal was the same for me. His father's goal was the same for him. That's not "generational wealth." That's called making good life decisions. At some point, someone has to get the ball rolling.

The government taking our money and then giving a % of it back IS NOT going to increase anyone's wealth.




Correct. Work harder.

1. YOU are establishing where morality begins and ends, you personally have no say as to where morality begins or ends. We deem new things new things to be crimes every day. There is no standard as to where the government steps in regarding morality and law. For anyone to suggest otherwise is a nonstarter.

2. Yes, it is demonstrably true that there are hundreds of thousands of people in this country who are rich beyond their control and poor beyond their control. This whole entire country was built on the backs of unpaid labor!! Have you ever heard of slavery, jim crow laws, redlining, distribution of crack in black neighborhoods, the phony war on drugs, the destruction of black wall street, Marcus Garvey, etc...???? This country has done damn near irreparable harm to a lot of people for 400 years.

3. You think people don't work hard???? This is where you lose me. GDP and stock prices go up because of the working class. Americans work hard as hell. If an increase in GDP and economic growth don't reflect in the wealth gap, or wages, or even the life expectancy of its people (America has dropped for 3 straight years), then working hard isn't the problem. The problem is the structure itself.

[bandc]

Enough is enough always sounds pretty good when your looking up and not down.

Economically, I'm far from looking up, and so I'm blessed. But thankfully there are tons of people who can have compassion and call a spade a spade even when they have made it.

[bandc]

Congress. You should know this

Which is exactly why the draining of the swamp needs to happen. Trump promised this would happen, but alas, here we are, still spending money on bs.