Can RG3 Still Run?

[John Reglarperson]

LJ ran a 4.3 or 4.33 at his pro day. He was asked the other day what he would have run at the combine and he said 4.3 which is in line. But it is. It just straight line speed. His ability to stop, change directions and return to top speed instantly, along with his total body control is a one in a million skill set.

Is Lamar's yards per carry really that high? You would think that if he had this extra speed, he would've proven it at the combine, and if he had this extra speed, it would be all over NFL next gen stats. Talking about this "His ability to stop, change directions and return to top speed instantly, along with his total body control", he has this. Players how I'd argue are probably faster, or were faster, RGIII and Pryor, don't have that. Pryor, since the start of NFL next gen stats, has a higher top speed than Lamar. somewhere around 20.35 or so. But Pryor doesn't start and stop all that much, or even change directions.

[John Reglarperson]

The ESPN article from today about Lamar and Harbs plainly states that Lamar ran a 4.34 at Louisville. That’s a pretty specific number. I’m gonna say he did it if ESPN is reporting it.

But, no, that doesn't work. Lamar could run the 40 50 times, and his best one would be 4.34. That's cherry picking. It's also handheld. Lamar had 2 chances to run and get timed, officially, and that was the combine and the pro day. And he chose not to. So, we don't have a real time for Lamar. Although we all love Lamar, and we all recognize he's a great runner, he doesn't get to have his cake and eat it too.

[rhapsody]

What is this Lamar is hurt scenario? I'd have RGIII running as hard as Lamar, because if you're not going to have RGIII running hard, why did you choose RGIII? How badly is Lamar hurt? Is he out? Is he out for a long time? If so, you bring in another running QB. If you aren't comfortable running RGIII full out because something, you need to add another running QB, so that you can be cool with running RGIII full out.

I don't see any reason not to run RGIII full out in any particular situation. If Lamar goes out, and then RGIII goes out then it's next man up, and that's Trace, and if both Lamar and RGIII are out, and you're playing Trace out of necessity, maybe it's Kaepernick time, or Terrelle Pryor time, or a long list of other running QBs you can put out there and have run 26 times a game.

Relax. If you want to have a running backup QB, you might be better off with Josh Johnson. But there isn't anybody who will come close to what Lamar gets out of this offense.

RGIII is a good backup, who can occasionally run to buy time to throw or run to move the chains. He also knows what he is doing. But you won't get 34 ppg with the Ravens' offensive personel with him or any backup you can think of. We don't have to lose sleep over that.

[JimZipCode]

When Lamar said "oh, I'm not going to run because I don't want to be seen as a project WR" or something like that, many said "1) they don't take project WRs in the 1st round, and it isn't that uncommon for there to be WRs running 4.33, and 2) it's much more likely that Lamar is not running because his numbers are going to fall short of where people think those numbers are going to be, and Lamar would rather have people think he runs in the 4.3s than prove that he doesn't."

You would think that if he had this extra speed, he would've proven it at the combine

Stop that.

We understand that you would have run the 40 at the combine, if you had 4.39 or better speed and a platform to showcase it. And that you think Lamar should have. Can you understand that Lamar had a different thought process going into the combine, than yours?

Whether he was well-advised or not, whether he made a good decision or not, it's abundantly clear Lamar's reasoning was completely different from what you laid out.

[John Reglarperson]

Relax. If you want to have a running backup QB, you might be better off with Josh Johnson. But there isn't anybody who will come close to what Lamar gets out of this offense.

RGIII is a good backup, who can occasionally run to buy time to throw or run to move the chains. He also knows what he is doing. But you won't get 34 ppg with the Ravens' offensive personel with him or any backup you can think of. We don't have to lose sleep over that.

RGIII has run for 815 yards in a season and had a yards per carry of 6.8, that was his rookie season. With the Browns in 2016, after the injury, he didn't run as much, but had a yards per carry of 6.1. There's really no reason to think that he can't still do that. And since the Ravens are built to do that, I'd assume that the reason why RGIII is on the Ravens is because they think he can do that, maybe, and the reason Trace is on the Ravens is that he, too, would be able to run well. Each of the Ravens backups should be able to pick up where Lamar left off, from a running perspective. They might not be as good as Lamar (if they were, why wouldn't they be starting) at either running or passing, but RGIII's 815 yards rushing in a season is probably top 10 all time. I see no reason to rule out the idea that RGIII can't do the kind of running, ballpark, that Lamar can do, and maybe Trace. I wonder about the durability of RGIII and Trace, I don't think RGIII has the moves of Lamar, Trace has 4.58 combine 50, which is better than Watson, and we don't know what Lamar's numbers are, Trace only weighs 200 as well.

You're not going to be limited in what you can do with RGIII or Trace. They might not do it as well as Lamar (probably can't), but you really don't know whether RGIII or Trace are going to have a bigger gap between them and Lamar at running or at passing. They're all running QBs. It's interesting to look at the combine numbers, 40 time and 10 split, of the guys who are running the fastest this year. They're not all 4.3 guys who are running over 21 mph.


Here's the data I was looking at.

mecole hardman 4.33 combine 1.54 10
21.87, 21.74


matt brieda 4.39/1.53 pro day
22.3

cordarrelle patterson 4.42/1.60
22.23

nick chubb 4.52/1.62
21.95

christian mccafferty 4,48/1,55
21.95

saquon barkley 4.49/1.54
21.76

odell beckham 4.43/1.57
21.7

leonard fournette 4.51/1.59,
sammy watkins, 4.43/1.55
tyreek hill, 4,29/1.50 pro day
desean jackson, 4,35/1.55
tarik cohen 4.42/1.54

- all 21.31 or better

marcus peters 4.53/1.60 - 21


we don't have any nfl next gen for rgiii and trace, but here is their combines

RGIII - 4.41 / 1.53 combine
Trace - 4.57 / 1.62 combine

And here's some more data on Lamar v RGIII v other running QBs

280 total carries, career, RGIII
2 longest runs, career
76, 46
career ypc 6.0

262 total carries, career, Lamar Jackson
2 longest runs, career
47, 39
career ypc 5.7

career ypcs of other QBs
Vick 7.0
Douglass 6.5
Cunningham 6.4
Pryor 6.3
Kaepernick 6.1
S Young 5.9
Wilson 5.6
Taylor 5.6
Tarkenton 5.4
Tebow QB 5.4
V Young 5.2
Newton 5.1

[John Reglarperson]

Stop that.

We understand that you would have run the 40 at the combine, if you had 4.39 or better speed and a platform to showcase it. And that you think Lamar should have. Can you understand that Lamar had a different thought process going into the combine, than yours?

Whether he was well-advised or not, whether he made a good decision or not, it's abundantly clear Lamar's reasoning was completely different from what you laid out.

We don't really know what Lamar's reasoning was. I know that, because I follow the top running QBs closely, I pay close attention when it's happening. We know what he said. His argument was that his numbers were going to be so good that some team was going to take him as a WR project, and he didn't want to be a WR project, so by not running, he wouldn't be taken as a WR project, and only as a QB. And, he's a QB and not a WR project.

We can say that his decision at this point looks great. The outcome is great at this point. And it looks great going forward.

But we can't give him any 40 time. His 40 time is unknown. And, of course, whether we know or don't know his 40 time has no effect on what he does on the field, and he's doing great running out there.

[mmi16]

I feature RG3 can still run, however, in comparison to LJ8 he looks slow. LJ8 makes Tyrek Hill appear a step slow.

[Roll Tide]

I hope we find out with the Heisman package.

We saw him a few times last year in games when Lamar was hurt. I don't think RG3 has any interest in runnIng the football anymore.

[John Reglarperson]

We saw him a few times last year in games when Lamar was hurt. I don't think RG3 has any interest in runnIng the football anymore.

I would bet that Greg Roman, RGIII's boss, or one of them, has an interest in a backup QB who can keep the offense running the way Lamar runs it. That's why it's RGIII in the backup spot and some non running QB. RGIII went to Dan Snyder directly and said "I don't want to be a running QB anymore" and Snyder said "ok" and they told the coaching staff. And instead of developing the run first offense with running QBs, they backed away from it, and RGIII never reached the peak he reached his rookie year. Maybe RGIII now understands, by watching Lamar, that teams want the running. RGIII is not in a position to 2nd guess Greg Roman and the Ravens system. RGIII went without a team in 2015 and 2017. Wasn't injured, just without a team. RGIII is going to have to run, and going to have to try his best to run well, if he sees the field. That is why he is with the Ravens, and some non running QB isn't there.

I'm of the opinion that RGIII gets it, that he's going to want to look as close to a Lamar clone as he can, and I think that the Ravens will be able to get good quality Lamar-like stuff out of RGIII if need be.

The Heisman package could have a whole bunch of stuff. We've seen speed option. That worked well, and there is a lot more. RGIII certainly could've learned enough WR to run routes out of the Heisman Package. RGIII in motion before the snap, he takes a handoff, a pitch, runs a route. Similarly, he can run in pitch position to Lamar. When RGIII gets a handoff or pitch, he can run or throw. It is said that RGIII is excellent at throwing from a dead run. Lamar generally likes to stick in the pocket, and when he leaves the pocket, it's to run. Someone like RGIII would be more suited for outside of the pocket run/throw. Something like that might be something that the Ravens roll out heavy in the playoffs, if necessary, and if not necessary, just a little bit of flavor of it in the Super Bowl.

[JimZipCode]

We don't really know what Lamar's reasoning was. ... We know what he said.

Yes exactly: we know what he said. He was unambiguous, and consistent; and what he stated was consistent with his actions and attitudes in the weeks before & after the combine.

So stop implying that the fact that he didn't run is somehow evidence that he knew he wouldn't have clocked as fast as people expected. That he would have run if he were really that fast. That's an assumption that is at-odds with everything Lamar said & did that offseason. Also doesn't jibe well with what we've seen from him on the field.

(Even with the insane change-of-direction, what we've seen from him doesn't imply time any slower than, say, 4.45 or so.)

But we can't give him any 40 time. His 40 time is unknown.

Sure.

But I think we have grounds for some inferences. Lamar looks faster than several players whose 40 times are known. We can put some kind of floor on his speed (or if you prefer, ceiling on his 40 time), even if only generally. For example:

• Seems pretty clear that Lamar is faster than Hayden Hurst & Mark Andrews.
• Seems likely that Lamar is at least about as fast as Mark Ingram.
• Seems clear that Lamar is faster than most every opposing LB we've faced.
• Seems likely that Lamar is at least as fast as most every opposing safety we faced.

We've got no evidence whatsoever that Lamar is faster than Marquise Brown. I think we've seen hints that Lamar is faster than Justice Hill. But maybe not: maybe what I'm seeing on the field is that Lamar is just more decisive, not actually faster in a straight line. So: fine. Let's leave them off the table. Likewise Marlon Humphrey & Marcus Peters.

Still, there's a lot of "circumstantial evidence" to indicate where Lamar's timed speed probably falls. There's some 40-time where we can say, Lamar is probably not slower than THAT, just based on who we've seen him run away from. Don't you think? Even though it's just an estimate.

[edromeo]

Assuming the absolute worst, that Lamar were to be injured - can RG3 still run? Obviously no Lamar, but still a mobile QB?

Yes

[one eyed bird]

Any body notice how RG bunny hops every time he receives the shotgun snap, , very strange