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  1. #25
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    Re: Why does the identity of the whistle-blower matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by JimZipCode View Post
    Is there anything I'm missing there?
    Yes, by your own admission, a lot actually.
    "Don't let your happiness depend on something you may lose." - C.S. Lewis





  2. #26
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    Re: Why does the identity of the whistle-blower matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    Yes, by your own admission, a lot actually.
    Ok: so why would the identity of the whistle-blower matter?





  3. #27

    Re: Why does the identity of the whistle-blower matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by JimZipCode View Post
    Ok: so why would the identity of the whistle-blower matter?
    Hey Jim youíve been accused of fraud and grand larceny. But you donít get to know who accused you. Seems pretty against US jurisprudence doesnít IT?





  4. #28

    Re: Why does the identity of the whistle-blower matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by JimZipCode View Post
    Ok: so why would the identity of the whistle-blower matter?
    Hmmmm

    A whistleblower claims that Biden , warren , and Sanders are Russian spies. They had a secret meeting with Putin. The whistleblower claims these four are planning to rig the election. This whistleblower also claims the four put together a plan to have a special chemical placed in the water system that could kill millions. Biden, sanders, and warren need to be arrested for attempted murder

    The whistleblower claims they all conspired
    All four of the accused deny this. And claim they have a right to face their accuser

    What do you suggest we do zippy? Should we take the word of an unnamed whistleblower? That wasnít part of the meeting? Arrest these four? Or should we ask for a little more info?





  5. #29
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    Re: Why does the identity of the whistle-blower matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vlad the lad View Post
    What do you suggest we do zippy? Should we take the word of an unnamed whistleblower? That wasn’t part of the meeting? Arrest these four? Or should we ask for a little more info?
    thats exactly what is happening. Nobody is indicted here. Theres no formal charge or accusation. The "right to face your accuser" clause only applies when there actually is an indictment. Its part of the trial process. This isnt a trial, its the investigation phase, where questions are being asked to figure out the merits to the claim.

    Rape cases continually dont go through because of this reason. They dont have the right to face them based on them coming forward to police, and allowing police to investigate. they only have the right to face them when it goes to trial. most dont want to go through that trauma, so no charges are brought, because the word of the accuser typically makes up the majority of the evidence.
    -JAB





  6. #30
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    Re: Why does the identity of the whistle-blower matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by JAB1985 View Post
    thats exactly what is happening. Nobody is indicted here. Theres no formal charge or accusation. The "right to face your accuser" clause only applies when there actually is an indictment. Its part of the trial process. This isnt a trial, its the investigation phase, where questions are being asked to figure out the merits to the claim.

    Rape cases continually dont go through because of this reason. They dont have the right to face them based on them coming forward to police, and allowing police to investigate. they only have the right to face them when it goes to trial. most dont want to go through that trauma, so no charges are brought, because the word of the accuser typically makes up the majority of the evidence.
    It's not an investigation JAB. We have the transcript of the call, we know what was said. This is a show trial "for the public to hear and make up their own mind". Nothing more.
    "Don't let your happiness depend on something you may lose." - C.S. Lewis





  7. #31
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    Re: Why does the identity of the whistle-blower matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    It's not an investigation JAB. We have the transcript of the call, we know what was said. This is a show trial "for the public to hear and make up their own mind". Nothing more.
    that can be your opinion, but it most definitely is an investigation for all intent and purposes. theyre looking for more than what they have currently, and im not sure how thats even debatable. the transcript was only part of the complaint, so im not sure why that seems to be where some want to start and stop. this is a public view of an investigation that is typically private, but thats what congressional hearings are, fact gathering. and just like any other investigation, an indictment is not inevitable.
    -JAB





  8. #32
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    Re: Why does the identity of the whistle-blower matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by JimZipCode View Post
    Which opening statement? False in what particulars?
    I've taken the time to listen to the youtube video and transcribe the call that Schiff describes. You can check my work here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GN4CJ8MYLTY It is after the 3:30 mark.
    Schiff describes the call as such, and pretends like he is reading the actual transcript as he is saying the below:

    "Weíve been very good to your country, very good, no other country has done as much as we have, but you know what? I donít see much reciprocity here. I hear what you want. I have a favor I want from you though.. and Iím going to say this only seven times, so you better listen good. I want you to make up dirt on my political opponent.. understand? (lotís of Ďits on this and on that) Iím gonna put you in touch with people and, not just any people. Iím gonna put you in touch with Attorney General the US, MY Attorney General Bill Barr. Heís got the whole weight of the American law enforcement behind him. Iím gonna put you in touch with Rudy. Youíre gonna love himÖ trust me. You know what Iím asking and so Iím only gonna say this a few more times in a few more ways. And by the way, donít call me againÖ Iíll call you when youíve done what I askedĒ

    Here is the actual transcript: https://www.politico.com/story/2019/...xt-pdf-1510770

    At NO point does Trump even closely say "I don't see much reciprocity here", "I want you to make up dirt on my political opponent", "He's got the whole weight of the American Law Enforcement behind him", "You know what I'm asking and so I'm only gonna say this a few more times in a few more ways", And by the way, don't call me again... I'll call you when you've done what I asked" There were other falsehoods, but I'd say these make up the bulk of the most salacious lies...
    "Always remember that you are absolutely unique. Just like everyone else." -Margaret Mead





  9. #33

    Re: Why does the identity of the whistle-blower matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by DitkasSausage View Post
    I've taken the time to listen to the youtube video and transcribe the call that Schiff describes. You can check my work here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GN4CJ8MYLTY It is after the 3:30 mark.
    Schiff describes the call as such, and pretends like he is reading the actual transcript as he is saying the below:

    "We’ve been very good to your country, very good, no other country has done as much as we have, but you know what? I don’t see much reciprocity here. I hear what you want. I have a favor I want from you though.. and I’m going to say this only seven times, so you better listen good. I want you to make up dirt on my political opponent.. understand? (lot’s of ‘its on this and on that) I’m gonna put you in touch with people and, not just any people. I’m gonna put you in touch with Attorney General the US, MY Attorney General Bill Barr. He’s got the whole weight of the American law enforcement behind him. I’m gonna put you in touch with Rudy. You’re gonna love him… trust me. You know what I’m asking and so I’m only gonna say this a few more times in a few more ways. And by the way, don’t call me again… I’ll call you when you’ve done what I asked”

    Here is the actual transcript: https://www.politico.com/story/2019/...xt-pdf-1510770

    At NO point does Trump even closely say "I don't see much reciprocity here", "I want you to make up dirt on my political opponent", "He's got the whole weight of the American Law Enforcement behind him", "You know what I'm asking and so I'm only gonna say this a few more times in a few more ways", And by the way, don't call me again... I'll call you when you've done what I asked" There were other falsehoods, but I'd say these make up the bulk of the most salacious lies...
    It's hoax/coup #2. Russian Collusion was hoax/coup #1 and failed spectacularly. I'm sure when this peters out there will be hoax/coup #3 lined up. Same cast of conspirators at the heart of both.





  10. #34
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    Re: Why does the identity of the whistle-blower matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by JAB1985 View Post
    that can be your opinion, but it most definitely is an investigation for all intent and purposes. theyre looking for more than what they have currently, and im not sure how thats even debatable. the transcript was only part of the complaint, so im not sure why that seems to be where some want to start and stop. this is a public view of an investigation that is typically private, but thats what congressional hearings are, fact gathering. and just like any other investigation, an indictment is not inevitable.
    An investigation into what? Whether Trump blackmailed, strong armed or offered a quid pro quo to a foreign country to dig up dirt on a political opponent?

    That was the initial complaint, and the transcript determined that was a lie.
    "Don't let your happiness depend on something you may lose." - C.S. Lewis





  11. #35

    Re: Why does the identity of the whistle-blower matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    An investigation into what? Whether Trump blackmailed, strong armed or offered a quid pro quo to a foreign country to dig up dirt on a political opponent?

    That was the initial complaint, and the transcript determined that was a lie.
    Also, Biden is not just "some guy" running against Trump. He was Trumps predecessors VP and he is on tape bragging about how he "quid-pro-quo'd" the very same country into doing something he wanted done." . That made it fair game. This isn't asking the Ukraine to break into Biden's house or come up with a fake dossier. They are asking about something Biden did to their country as VP that he brags about that is precisely QUID PRO FUCKING QUO. The entire thing is ridiculous.





  12. #36
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    Re: Why does the identity of the whistle-blower matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    An investigation into what? Whether Trump blackmailed, strong armed or offered a quid pro quo to a foreign country to dig up dirt on a political opponent?

    That was the initial complaint, and the transcript determined that was a lie.
    the transcript isnt the only evidence, conversations, texts, etc there is to collaborate that. The complaint talked about more than just the phone conversation and thats why its incorrect to limit it to just that.

    So yes, its an investigation into those complaints.
    -JAB





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