2019 OTAs

**JimZipCode** · 05-22-2019, 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by edromeo

If we’re his coaches(scary thought) why would you allow him to do part of the throwing process incorrectly during a drill? And just to be clear I’m only talking about during the drills. Of course there situations where the ability to throw from different arm angles and platforms is a strength.

Because the concept of "correct form" is a dangerous one.

It's one thing to preach "correct form" to a baseball pitcher, who (a) is operating near the limit of human performance in terms of the forces operating on his rotator cuff & elbow, and (b) has the luxury of repeating the same move every single rep. A deviation from whatever the "biomechanically perfect" motion is, will fuck up the pitcher with a quickness; and there's no reason to. The pitcher is throwing from the same spot, to the same spot, with no interference, every single time.

Football passing has a little more in common with what infielders do, than with what pitchers do. An infielder can't predetermine where he throws FROM, and has limited control over his body position on receiving the ball. He has to hurry to plant & throw from wherever he is, to beat a runner to first. Huge carry-over to a QB going to his third read and delivering; or rolling away from pressure and delivering. This is why I wanted Lamar taking some infield practice this offseason, as part of his training routine.

Passing in football has much more in common with passing in basketball. It's a solution to a complex spatial problem:

"How do I get the ball from me to that teammate, without letting a DB knock the ball away or grab it, before the pass rushers take me down?"

Moving bodies in space (thrower is moving, receiver is moving, defenders are moving), and the solution has to be derived and executed in about 3 seconds (or 4?). And it's not a buzzer that goes off: you're informed that time's up by the 300# dudes who slam you.

A lot of bad basketball coaching emphasizes "perfect form" on passes. But you look at an actual game; there is not one "perfect form" pass in any game. You put together a cutup tape of the top 20 passers in the NBA or college in-game, you won't see a single "perfect form" pass from any of them. Not ever. A "perfect form" pass has no applicability to the game whatsoever.

Remember Eddie Murray, with the Orioles? When taking batting practice, he used to practice "being fooled" by a pitch. Off balance swings, reacting late, protecting the strike zone. He wasn't worried about "perfect form": he was practicing solutions for the problem, "How do I stay alive with two strikes if I realize mid-swing that the pitcher fooled me?" Genius.

Steph Curry has had to get his shot off against bigger defenders all his life. He's got all sorts of whacky releases: hurries, up-&-unders, high moon balls, etc etc. He didn't get to where he is by worrying about "perfect form". He developed solutions to the problem of getting the ball to where he wanted it.

I want Lamar to have the discipline to reset his feet prior to every throw, and I want him to engage his hips with every release, and I don't give a shit about anything else. Rehearsing "perfect form" is how we get passers who look good and can't play. Philip Rivers is 100 times better than Blake Bortles. Rivers' throwing motion hurts my eyes and my feelings; but I'd fire on the spot any QB coach who was so fucking retarded that he tried to mess with it.

Originally Posted by edromeo

One of the areas I want Lamar to improve on is arm angle slot/mechanics. Over the top or 3/4 at most is what I want to see during drills. I felt that some of throws Lamar missed were due to careless arm angle slotting.

I thought that almost none of Lamar's incompletes were due to arm slotting. I thought pretty much all of them were due to failing to involve his hips / lower body in his throws. I know that several posters here, in game threads or the week after a game, would talk about "that sidearm shit" when Lamar missed one of those throws. I thought pretty much all of those hot takes were misinformed and flat wrong.

Some of Lamar's COMPLETIONS were due to his intelligent use of different arm slotting, adjusting to the situation. I don't want to do a thing to diminish that.

Set your feet and drive the ball. Otherwise, don't over-coach this kid. He has a great feel for what he's doing. Make him set his feet and drive, and then let him play, as many reps as he can take in OTAs and camp etc. He's going to experiment with different arm slots because he can. He's crazy talented; he's going to mess around a little to see what he can do. Like a skateboarder practicing tricks. I'm fine with it: develop as many "solutions" as you can. Fill up your metaphorical golf bag with different clubs: use them appropriately.

But set your damn feet, and use your hips when you throw.

**BMORERavens** · 05-22-2019, 09:39 AM

Originally Posted by edromeo

If we’re his coaches(scary thought) why would you allow him to do part of the throwing process incorrectly during a drill? And just to be clear I’m only talking about during the drills. Of course there situations where the ability to throw from different arm angles and platforms is a strength. You’re preaching to the preacher on that note. But that’s not what I’m talking about here. Here I’m talking about his form during drills.

One of the areas I want Lamar to improve on is arm angle slot/mechanics. Over the top or 3/4 at most is what I want to see during drills.
I felt that some of throws Lamar missed were due to careless arm angle slotting. I thought he was much sloppier/had more poor arm angles last year then he did at Louisville and I want to see that cleaned up.

I guess it depends on how often he’s doing those different throwing motions in the drills. Also, it could be something the coaches want him to continue to develop, but I’m speculating at this point. Good thoughts, maybe someone can ask the coaches and Lamar this question.

**BMORERavens** · 05-22-2019, 09:48 AM

Originally Posted by JimZipCode

Because the concept of "correct form" is a dangerous one.

Some of Lamar's COMPLETIONS were due to his intelligent use of different arm slotting, adjusting to the situation. I don't want to do a thing to diminish that.

Set your feet and drive the ball. Otherwise, don't over-coach this kid. He has a great feel for what he's doing. Make him set his feet and drive, and then let him play, as many reps as he can take in OTAs and camp etc. He's going to experiment with different arm slots because he can. He's crazy talented, and is going to mess around a little to see what he can do. Like a skateboarder practicing tricks. I'm fine with it: develop as many "solutions" as you can. Use them appropriately.

But set your damn feet, and use your hips when you throw.

I agree with this. Let’s not over coach this guy. If we do, he’ll be Kyle Boller all over again and I do not want any parts of that.

**BcRaven** · 05-22-2019, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by JimZipCode
Because the concept of "correct form" is a dangerous one.

Some of Lamar's COMPLETIONS were due to his intelligent use of different arm slotting, adjusting to the situation. I don't want to do a thing to diminish that.

Set your feet and drive the ball. Otherwise, don't over-coach this kid. He has a great feel for what he's doing.

Originally Posted by BMORERavens

I agree with this. Let’s not over coach this guy. If we do, he’ll be Kyle Boller all over again and I do not want any parts of that.

I agree with both of you. If LJ has too much to think about it could impede his natural talents. Bring him along slowly, just as QBs used to sit on the bench for a year or two learning the position. I am not advocating his sitting on the bench, only that he doesn't get overwhelmed by stuffing his head with too much, too soon. We have a diamond in the rough, let's polish it and watch it shine... Bc

**GreatWhiteNorthRaven** · 05-22-2019, 10:16 AM

Honestly I'm not even that concerned about his throwing motion.

I persoanlly thought the majority of his problems were from not setting his feet.

I understand the issues with the ball ducking, but there's so many different opinions out there of what the proper arm motion actually is. The Scouting Academy looks at this.

If he sets his feet, he'll be fine.

**BirdfaninNebraska** · 05-22-2019, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by bmorebirds_24

Who’s the player we fall in love with this preseason that does absolutely nothing in the regular season. We have one every year. Who we got this year?

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Charles Scarff and Markus Jones

**The Excellector** · 05-22-2019, 10:49 AM

The throwing motion largely depends on the person. Rivers has long had a bad one, but he'd proven to be so effective with it that they only tinkered with it, but so much. Mahomes and Wilson have baseball backgrounds where they are accustomed to side-armed throws on the move and off balance. It might just be something that doesn't work for Jackson. Then again, once they get his lower half straightened out, it might be. Time will tell.

**esmd** · 05-22-2019, 11:03 AM

Originally Posted by Ravskins

From Ravens OTA photos, good to see Brown catching passes. Will be exciting to see him in the offense. Boykin as well....

I thought Brown wasn't going to be cleared until TC? Or is he just catching balls while stationary?

**Mmcclend** · 05-22-2019, 11:05 AM

Originally Posted by esmd

I thought Brown wasn't going to be cleared until TC? Or is he just catching balls while stationary?

It looks like he was on the Juggs machine.

**757RavensFan** · 05-22-2019, 11:16 AM

https://www.instagram.com/p/BxxM9PsH...=1a1opn6zanjlq

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**GreatWhiteNorthRaven** · 05-22-2019, 11:27 AM

Lamar throwing compilation is the hype video of the day.

Spiral is loose. Would like to see his elbow a little higher at the 'load' point. I think one thing that's standing out is his natural motion is more of a sidearm. It may always look a little funny compared to traditional technique. I think ti's more important if he can make that motion consistent.

**Mmcclend** · 05-22-2019, 11:29 AM

Originally Posted by GreatWhiteNorthRaven

Lamar throwing compilation is the hype video of the day.

Spiral is loose. Would like to see his elbow a little higher at the 'load' point. I think one thing that's standing out is his natural motion is more of a sidearm. It may always look a little funny compared to traditional technique. I think ti's more important if he can make that motion consistent.

His spiral doesn’t seem as tight as I wanted it to be, but it’s still OTA’s. The ball seems to be on target and his release seems better. Can’t wait for the reports tomorrow.