Redskins also having attendance problems.

**camdenyard** · 11-19-2018, 01:02 PM

These things have been discussed over and over for a few years now. But I first noticed the attendance drop in early 2013. Immediately after the SB win. The Ravens legends departing was a big blow.

But the loss of fans is NFL-wide. I see the same issue in Pittsburgh...lots of empty seats. I really think as the older fans (who looked at attending games was as important as attending church) dropped off, the millennials either don't see the NFL as a compelling product or just don't look at attending games live each week as that desirable.

Same for other sports.

It's maybe not as hard yet for hockey and basketball, which have smaller arenas. But I'll bet those sports are looking very hard at demographics and see trends starting that are troubling.

How the Ravens for example reverse the trend is unknown. Obviously they need to put a superior product on the field that is exciting. Maybe Jackson develops into a passing threat and a big star. That would help. But the stadium experience vs. the benefits of home viewing with friends...a much harder nut to crack. Tailgating is still a plus for the stadium experience.

**HbgPARavenfan** · 11-19-2018, 01:08 PM

Originally Posted by Gjennings85

Do Raven fans get wild at the stadium. You guys seem much more laid back then Philly or NYG fans.

its super mild

**HbgPARavenfan** · 11-19-2018, 01:10 PM

Originally Posted by camdenyard

But the loss of fans is NFL-wide. I see the same issue in Pittsburgh...lots of empty seats. I really think as the older fans (who looked at attending games was as important as attending church) dropped off, the millennials either don't see the NFL as a compelling product or just don't look at attending games live each week as that desirable.

millenials have less disposable income then previous gens. student loans, increase in rent and housing, etc

**saintmatthew** · 11-19-2018, 02:04 PM

The whole league is having issues and it started before the Anthem protests. I STILL think it's due to the safety issues and penalties derived from them. I think the NFL has peaked and will go the way of MLB. Big hits and defenses crushing players was a visceral attraction to the game for many fans, ESPECIALLY in Baltimore. I get that safety studies and lawsuits forced the NFL's hand, but in the end the changes take that aspect that appeals to people's love of violence away. And before anyone throws the ratings numbers out, those are TV numbers. More people probably ARE watching on TV, but it's the live in person numbers that are going down. TV is free and worth the time for a track meet with some pitch and catch for most people but the outlay for a day at the stadium comes with a desire to get caught up in the collective bloodlust. Obviously there are other factors like economics, fans aging out and the anthem and product quality excabarates the decline, but I feel the fundamental nature of the sport has been changed to it's detriment.

**Mista T** · 11-19-2018, 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by Gjennings85

Do Raven fans get wild at the stadium. You guys seem much more laid back then Philly or NYG fans.

Define "wild". We have a few nut-jobs, and at the other end of the spectrum: a few millenials playing fantasy on their smartphones. Then about 99% of Ravens fans are typical East Coast NFL mentality. I don'get your comparison to NYG or Philly. I've been to many NFL games all along the I-95 corridor from Landover to Foxborough. I don't see a dime's worth of difference between the average home fan at any of the East Coast NFL stadiums.

Originally Posted by HbgPARavenfan

its super mild

Sure, it has dropped off in intensity a bit since Lewis & Reed retired and Boldin shit-canned. However, the crowds of 2018 are not even close to "super mild"

**HbgPARavenfan** · 11-19-2018, 02:19 PM

Originally Posted by Mista T

Sure, it has dropped off in intensity a bit since Lewis & Reed retired and Boldin shit-canned. However, the crowds of 2018 are not even close to "super mild"

The fans at the Drake Concert I went to were more hyped than the last game I went to and that was in 2012 after Ray got injured

**Brtnder81** · 11-19-2018, 05:35 PM

Originally Posted by PeterB58

Until the Ravens return to a more competitive team, we will not know if the drop in attendance / fan support is due to the boring and inconsistent product they have been putting on the field the last 5 years, or if it is due to the other factors you mentioned (aging fan base, ease of watching at home, etc.). I suspect it is combination of both but the primary driver in attendance is the team winning on a consistent basis (with legitimate playmakers), going to the playoffs and - here's a novel idea - actually hosting a playoff game or even an AFCCG (we can dream).

you dont think this team has been competitive the past 5 years? We are not the Browns. Have we competed for a SB, no, but we are a .500 team since SB 47. We have played with the big boys and won some games, that is competitive, but not great!

**Brtnder81** · 11-19-2018, 05:37 PM

Originally Posted by Gjennings85

Do Raven fans get wild at the stadium. You guys seem much more laid back then Philly or NYG fans.

Not much anymore, This new breed of fan doesnt really understand when to cheer and not to

**WrongBaldy** · 11-19-2018, 07:00 PM

Originally Posted by Brtnder81

you dont think this team has been competitive the past 5 years? We are not the Browns. Have we competed for a SB, no, but we are a .500 team since SB 47. We have played with the big boys and won some games, that is competitive, but not great!

yup weve been mediocre

**beavery** · 11-19-2018, 07:35 PM

Originally Posted by WrongBaldy

yup weve been mediocre

I agree We have been mediocre and a boring football team. In addition, since Ray and Ed left, we have no larger than life players. In the 50's and 60's we had Unitas, Donovan, Parker, Berry, Moore, Marchetti, and had a high profile coach in Shula. In the 70's we had Bert Jones. You paid to see these guys play. There was less teams so the teams were more talented...…..In the 80's all we had was a drunk ass Irsay.

I also think that moving the training camp from Westminster was a huge mistake. It gave fans more of a chance to connect with the team/players. We really have become a very corporate team and the PR has been generic to say the best.

Finally, kids are being dissuaded from playing football. As a result we have a generation of kids who have only a passing interest in the game. Unfortunately their game day experience is usually playing Madden. I guess that is the millennial thing.

**Baltimore35** · 11-19-2018, 07:50 PM

Originally Posted by HbgPARavenfan

The NFL game is too much for average people who dont live immediately near the stadium to attend consistently when the at home product is so good

No way Im driving 1-1.5 hours, paying for parking, for tix scond hand, beer, food, traffic, drive home. I could buy the NFL ticket for the cost of 1 game

When I hear people say that I just can't relate at all. I would drive from California to spend a Sunday in the same seats I've been sitting in for year with family and friends. That's just all part of the great experience for me, and it's totally worth it.

I do think the Ravens should put ticket prices back to the way they were when the stadium first opened. That'd be big for a lot of fans.

**Baltimore35** · 11-19-2018, 08:02 PM

Originally Posted by beavery

I agree We have been mediocre and a boring football team. In addition, since Ray and Ed left, we have no larger than life players. In the 50's and 60's we had Unitas, Donovan, Parker, Berry, Moore, Marchetti, and had a high profile coach in Shula. In the 70's we had Bert Jones. You paid to see these guys play. There was less teams so the teams were more talented...…..In the 80's all we had was a drunk ass Irsay.

I also think that moving the training camp from Westminster was a huge mistake. It gave fans more of a chance to connect with the team/players. We really have become a very corporate team and the PR has been generic to say the best.

Finally, kids are being dissuaded from playing football. As a result we have a generation of kids who have only a passing interest in the game. Unfortunately their game day experience is usually playing Madden. I guess that is the millennial thing.

I agree. I personally can't stand how many people vilify football at the youth level. Many of these soccer moms have never even touched a football in their lives and refuse to let their kid play such a great game. I'm just barely a little older than today's younger kids and I can't stand how all they care about is individual players instead of teams. They'd rather play madden then go throw a football outside. I think it's just a societal thing that we will cycle out of. I really hope that's the case