Johnny Unitas

[PalladinInNC]

Who was the first QB you remember knocking on the door of Unitas' stranglehold on greatness at the position?

Good Question! If I had to think of someone although a lot of people might pick Terry Bradshaw or Dan Marino or John Elway, I might pick Joe Montana. They were about the same size and they both were known for dissecting a defense and for late game comebacks!

[HotInHere]

Good Question! If I had to think of someone although a lot of people might pick Terry Bradshaw or Dan Marino or John Elway, I might pick Joe Montana. They were about the same size and they both were known for dissecting a defense and for late game comebacks!

I doubt anyone would ever think Terry Bradshaw. (Well, Steeler fans would, but...) Bradshaw just didn't have dominant numbers at all. That team was running game and defense. Bradshaw's contributions to those championships was somewhere between Dilfer and Flacco.

Marino was the guy who started breaking the records. Elway was -- and probably still is -- IMO the most talented QB to ever play the position. And I say that even though I absolutely hate the guy.

But it was Montana that for me first entered into the conversation about the GOAT. Before him, it was John and everybody else in my eyes. Montana had numbers, he had championships, but most of all, he was the guy who could run his team with the game on the line. He was the ice-in-his-veins guy who never lost -- he just ran out of time.

[Dragon King Onaga]

Does anyone remember who was considered the top Legend at the position BEFORE Unitas?

[PalladinInNC]

Does anyone remember who was considered the top Legend at the position BEFORE Unitas?

Maybe Otto Graham of the Browns! Or maybe Sid Luckman before him!

[bst3975]

Maybe Otto Graham of the Browns! Or maybe Sid Luckman before him!

Others (if we're talking pre-Unitas):

Sammy Baugh (also a DB and punter). I think he stands head and shoulders over everyone pre-Unitas (or at least pre-Otto Graham)

Y.A. Tittle (the '59 Giants game was regarded as a passing of the QB torch by some)

Edit: Found this article written 10 years ago - hits the names: http://www.espn.com/nfl/playoffs07/c...eff&id=3199634
(Oddly, while we liked him in Baltimore, no mention of Bert Jones.....)

[HotInHere]

...
(Oddly, while we liked him in Baltimore, no mention of Bert Jones.....)

Naturally. Nor should there be.

Look, I loved Bert, and he was Elway before Elway. But he only managed to actually play five seasons. And even if he had managed to stay in Baltimore and stay healthy, that team was headed down the shitter with or without him.

Bert had two great years, but to consider him on a list of all-time greats is ludicrous. He is 119th in career passing yardage, behind guys like Dan Pastorini and Danny White. (And Trent Dilfer.)

[Ravenswintitle]

Does anyone remember who was considered the top Legend at the position BEFORE Unitas?

[JimZipCode]

Bert had two great years, but to consider him on a list of all-time greats is ludicrous. He is 119th in career passing yardage

Football Outsiders lists his MVP season as one of the ~5(?) greatest single seasons for a QB. Some of it has to do with their adjustments for the era: in the 70s the game was utterly dominated by defense. That's why the first rule changes to open up the passing were made at the end of the 70s.

Bill Belichick famously mentioned Bert Jones as possibly the greatest passer he ever saw play.

That shoulder injury really fucked things up. It's one of the dominoes that ultimately led to the Colts leaving town; and it cut short a career that should have been historic.

[PalladinInNC]

Others (if we're talking pre-Unitas):

Sammy Baugh (also a DB and punter). I think he stands head and shoulders over everyone pre-Unitas (or at least pre-Otto Graham)

Y.A. Tittle (the '59 Giants game was regarded as a passing of the QB torch by some)

Edit: Found this article written 10 years ago - hits the names: http://www.espn.com/nfl/playoffs07/c...eff&id=3199634
(Oddly, while we liked him in Baltimore, no mention of Bert Jones.....)

My God, I completely forgot about Sammy Baugh! You’re right, Baugh or Luckman would be hard to chose who was better before either Graham or Unitas!

However, Y.A. Tittle I’d never consider even close. All he was was John Brodie with a better supporting cast. He never won a championship. He had more interceptions than TDs. And IMHO the only reason back then reporters fawned over him so much was because he played on the NY Giants and any NY City pro athlete was always over glorified.

[steelerhater]

Who was the first QB you remember knocking on the door of Unitas' stranglehold on greatness at the position?

I would say that Roger Staubach was the first to knock on the door. Not saying he was better than Unitas, but he was knocking before Montana, Elway, and Marino.

[filthflarnfilth]

It’s 2008, and Unitas,Flacco, and Bert Jones have a qb competition and all three guys are 25 years old. Unitas is gonna get cut or be third string.

[bst3975]

However, Y.A. Tittle I’d never consider even close. All he was was John Brodie with a better supporting cast. He never won a championship. He had more interceptions than TDs. And IMHO the only reason back then reporters fawned over him so much was because he played on the NY Giants and any NY City pro athlete was always over glorified.

Can't argue his stature was helped immensely by playing in NYC and objectively that he was never quite at the same level, but still that game came as a shock to the national pundits (some things never change). Should not have mentioned him in that context. But while not in that discussion, he was regarded as a major player (and of course played for the Colts in their pre-Unitas Baltimore Colts iteration).

That photo of him kneeling in the end zone is iconic.