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Thread: Savage on scouting and drafting
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02-27-2018, 12:08 PM #49Four-eyed Raven
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02-27-2018, 07:20 PM #50
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02-28-2018, 09:50 AM #52
Re: Savage on scouting and drafting
It's odd, though - the big name scouts who left were still here for the bad 2013 and 2015 drafts. They left. The new scouts were in place for the great 2016 draft. Maybe Ozzie and Eric just did a great job or the new scouts are not as bad as people think. Our haul of good UDFAs seems to be getting better, too.
I don't understand Bisciotti on this."Flacco is driving the ball in that wind....."
(AFCCG, January 2013)
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02-28-2018, 12:36 PM #53
Re: Savage on scouting and drafting
I don't buy it either. The areas where scouts show most of their worth is the later rounds and finding gems in the smaller schools. We've still been fairly successful with that.
The real bombs have been in the earlier rounds where I think a certain somebody has a little bit more influence than he should on who is being picked. The scouts didn't tell Ozzie/Harbuagh to pass on Myles Jack to pick Correa and convert him to ILB. That was a collective effort from those 2.
Steve B. blaming the scouts is nothing more than attempting to deflect blame from his boy.
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Re: Savage on scouting and drafting
For the record, all three were still with the team through the 2016 draft. Douglas and Weidl left after the 2016 draft. Cunningham left after last year's draft.
But I don't think Ozzie is blaming bad drafts on young, inexperienced scouts. You're right, that conclusion wouldn't make sense, given what I just said above.
The way I envision it, per my original post, is that Bisciotti was demanding an explanation for the recent misses amongst top 60 picks, as he termed it. I imagined, in my original post here, that Ozzie and Eric candidly suggested to Steve that Harbaugh and likely some of his coordinators had forced picks the scouting department didn't agree with.
If you try to imagine that conversation further, the coaches in turn--being guys who have been doing this their entire adult lives--probably bristled at the suggestion they aren't qualified to evaluate players. Telling them to back off becomes doubly annoying when they are being told to defer to the opinions of 25 year olds, now.
So, the way I see it, is that Bisciotti realized that if he is going to ask his coaches to step away from player evaluation, he better be able to promise them he's handing the job over to the very best evaluators he can find. If you are going to tell Harbaugh that his very job security will no longer be entirely in his own hands, you better be able to sell him on the hands that are replacing his.
Another way to say it is, if you are going to stop overanalyzing players, with so may opinions in the room, and narrow it down to just a very few opinions, then you want the best-informed opinions his money can buy.
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05-11-2018, 04:00 PM #55Four-eyed Raven
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Re: Savage on scouting and drafting
Unfortunately, I think there were too many voices in this draft as well. Also, Ozzie and Eric relies on their scouts and coaches too much. I’m not saying you shouldn’t rely on your talent department, but when they continue to have draft misses, you might want to second guess or reevaluate their work.
I believe, going forward Eric may need to add experienced scouts to help identify talent and limit the number of opinions on draft day. If that means certain coaches or scouts canÂ’t enter the draft room on draft day so be it.
If an influential scout or coach misses on a talent because of inexperience, and Ozzie and Eric trusts that scout or coach opinion, then that’s how we get a Perriman or a Elam. And that’s how we get the statements “Ozzie lost his mind.” Well Ozzie never lost it in regards to evaluating talent, his mistakes was given the talent department (the scouts) too much trust on draft day. It’s worked before, like with Phil and Eric, but it’s not really working now. Like our coaches of the past, our scouts usually get promoted elsewhere. That leaves a whole that sometimes doesn’t get filled properly or efficiently. If you go young, you run the risk of inexperience.
In addition, it appears the system the Ravens use has some flaws that resulted in some pretty bad drafts. Too many strong voices and differing opinions on talent, plus the owners renowned pleasure to bring in choir boys to please ticket holders is why we draft safe now (see Ray Rice).Last edited by BMORERavens; 05-11-2018 at 05:05 PM. Reason: Correcting Errors
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05-11-2018, 05:01 PM #57
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05-11-2018, 11:50 PM #58Regular 1st Stringer
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Re: Savage on scouting and drafting
When Derwin James and Tremaine Edmunds are on the board (both acknowledged as top 12 non-QB talent) and the Ravens pass on both -- that tells us that this isn't the 2003 Ozzie/Phil war room.
When the Ravens, Titans, and Steelers all need an ILB, and the Steelers and Titans were playoff teams, and the Ravens decide to trade with...the Titans and give them the chance to select the ILB -- that tells us that the "Defense Wins Championships" mindset may be under reevaluation.
When, years ago, the owner chides DeCosta to not be a "pick whore" but this year the team trades down at least three times -- that tells us that maybe the red lantern was in the window.
When the Ravens sign three veteran WRs and draft an older tight end in the first round, all in a win-now mode but then trade away a second round pick for a QB who can't help you win now -- that tells us there is some conflict, some hedging.
When the Ravens have a head coach who is notorious for bleeding cloying coach speak, but the team selects a WR who was suspended and an OL who had a head-scratching, red-flag raising Combine performance -- that tells us a change in power or outlook may have happened.
The Ravens did a lot in this draft.
Did the new guy get to pull more strings?
Are they competing, rebuilding, reloading?
Will the focus change from being a defense-oriented team with a run/pass balance to a QB-centric team?
I don't know much, but I know this: I don't recognize the 2018 Ravens War Room.
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05-12-2018, 02:35 PM #59Four-eyed Raven
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Re: Savage on scouting and drafting
Overstated.
The draft seems "incoherent" because you're trying to reconcile the 2 top picks with each other. But the top 2 picks were driven by different "processes". The Hurst pick was the output of Ozzie's "need" process, which was really well showcased in the 2008 draft with the Flacco pick. The Lamar pick was the usual Ozzie process, grab a falling potential diamond.
(I mean philosophically. I reallize that the "mechanics' of the LJ draft choice were like Flacco, in terms of trading away a future pick to get back into the late first. But the decision to use that mechanic was usual Ozzie.)
More on my view of it here:
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05-12-2018, 06:18 PM #60
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