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  1. #49

    Re: PSL watch - over 4000 seats for sale and rising

    I have 2 PSL seats in Section 107 / 12 rows from the field

    make me an offer





  2. #50
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    Re: PSL watch - over 4000 seats for sale and rising

    Quote Originally Posted by Goode05 View Post
    It's fake outrage Smoove. It's just the right wing media hiding the fact the clown in the White House brought this all on himself. The "thugs" are outta control look what they have done to this great sport type shit.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    It's President Trump's fault the attendance in Baltimore is hurting. LOL





  3. Re: PSL watch - over 4000 seats for sale and rising

    I don't think crime in Baltimore is an issue when it comes to stadium attendance. Most of these games take place during the day. The cops are out in force on the streets in a several block radius before and after games, and you have huge crowds of people walking in and out with you, essentially- and people are less likely to commit a crime in front of a bunch of witnesses. I know people who've attended games for 20 years, parked in bad neighborhoods far from the stadium without parking passes, and have never had any auto damage or violent behavior against them to report (Granted, they don't drive flashy vehicles and are friendly with the locals- willing to high five or pass along a score if asked). Has there ever really been a violent crime committed against a fan walking from the stadium before or after games? I've felt less in some neighborhoods I've lived in that haven't been major cities than I've felt at games.

    I would say that while I am sure some people are staying away because they don't like the players kneeling during the anthem at a game or two as a protest against police brutality, I don't think that accounts for the crowds staying away to the extent that they are. A lot of people like to cite the anthem protests as a reason for not going to games they wouldn't be at anyway.

    Further, I think there is a whole different audience that is alienated by the team failing to sign Kaepernick and bending over backwards to disassociate themselves from players who are simply choosing not to participate in a patriotic display when people are getting killed execution style by cops who are rarely convicted of a crime for doing so. The owner reportedly overrode his GM and owner in refusing to sign Kap, and then Dick Cass wrote that letter to season ticket holders apologizing for players who didn't ask him to apologize for them. Just like some people get upset when the players take a political stance they oppose, I get upset when I perceive the team as taking a different political stance that *I* oppose at the expense of making the right football moves on the field and of honoring the players' freedom of conscience.

    I would guess there are a lot of economically lower-class African-American and Hispanic fans who are alienated by the owners kissing up to Trump and, though one might say that they mostly can't afford the tickets and thus aren't the ones buying them anyway, I do think fans who watch on television and wear the merchandise and chat up the team and maybe go to a game once in a blue moon and are overjoyed to get tickets when they can disappearing can lessen the general "buzz" around a team and make the games feel more skippable for the people who are financially able to attend for reasons they can't quite put their finger on. People see fewer Ravens caps on the streets and fewer people talk about the previous day's game, and it just slowly subconsciously starts to feel like less of a "thing".

    I definitely think lower ticket prices would fill the stadium. If you paid $20 a seat for 10 games, $200 a year per seat, and there were $5 beers and $2 hot dogs, you'd be there, wouldn't you? It's when the stuff gets completely out of reach for some fans and is a financial sacrifice for others who maybe are in an income bracket where they are used to making financial sacrifices for housing and transportation, but not for luxury items, that I think attendance gets more variable. At $20, some people will come just for a change of scenery and to drink beer, and maybe even do the whole paper bag with eye holes on the head thing if the team goes in the toilet, but still show. When tickets are more expensive than a down payment on a car, it's a whole different ballgame, so to speak. Also, people who can afford what the NFL charges today have a ton of competition for their entertainment dollar, they aren't just competing against going to the movies or whatever in that price range.

    But I think overall the idea that we are stuck with the same front office, the same coaching staff, the same QB, and the same way of doing things that's kept us out of the playoffs 4 out of the last 5 years in the biggest thing. Our record isn't as bad as some teams, but fans like to have hope. Like, alright the Redskins typically suck, and they in part suck because of these type of antics, but their fans are almost unfailingly excited and willing to spend money, because almost every off-season it seems like there are big changes designed to give them hope- a new head coach, a new quarterback, new coordinators with inventive systems, etc.. Then the Redskins collapse, but the organization already has the fans' money and gives them more changes and new reasons to show the next year.

    Continuity is good if it results in winning more often than not, but if it doesn't, it can be a huge drag on attendance and fan interest even relative to teams that have objective worse records on the field. If you have a miserable time watching losing football several years in a row and see it'll be the same crew the next year, it's sometimes hard to justify coming back for that at the prices they charge.

    Attendance stayed high in the Billick years because he basically did an every other year thing towards the end. One year would be like 13-3 with a playoff run, then we'd go 5-11, then we'd go 12-4, then we'd go 7-9, etc.. You rarely if ever had two losing seasons in a row, and people can more easily accept a team that is awesome half the time and sit through a bad season if it's sandwiched between two good ones. People don't want to feel like sunnyweather fans and can deal with a bad season or two here and there, but I think it some ways fans tend to view all bad years as equal- like I am not sure there is a *ton* of perceptual difference for me between a team that had a worse record in 2016 and a better record in 2017 when the 2017 resembled the 2016 team very closely, won those extra games primarily because of a weak schedule and QB injuries to other teams, and still missed the playoffs in the end. There is no sense of momentum or change. There's not even the "We'll do better next year", because why would we think that we would? We can't cling to changes and think they'll make a difference because there are no changes.

    I also just think the rising gap between rich and poor is having an impact. Poor people can't afford to go to games. And that actually also effects rich people because those poor fans making noise and filling seats and getting excited created atmosphere that can't be replaced by bigger jumbotron screens. In the long run, the NFL might be well served by creating cheap ticket sections with some low cost food and drink vouchers and do something like tie it to people showing ID and personally showing up to, say, at least 7 of the 10 games. You give away the tickets to more than 3 games or otherwise miss more than 3 games, you lose your spot and go to the back of the waiting list to get back in the section when a spot opens up. No scalpers because they'd have to actually attend the games to keep the tickets the next year. Just a thought. Better than empty seats, right? You'd get your most loyal or would-be-most-loyal fans into the stadium and not let them be priced out, which makes the atmosphere better for everyone and keeps some money where there might otherwise be none if the sellout streak ends.

    I'll tell you, there is no way in this world a lot of the blue collar people who attended Baltimore Colts games can afford to be Baltimore Ravens season ticket holders. Buy tickets to a game or two a year? Maybe.
    Last edited by CharmCityCrab; 01-05-2018 at 09:36 PM.





  4. Re: PSL watch - over 4000 seats for sale and rising

    Quote Originally Posted by Goode05 View Post
    Well of course it's all over the media "thugs" are ruining football. "Thugs" are running wild in Baltimore. "Thugs" burned down the city."Thugs" when are they just going to stop using "thug" and start using what they really mean?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Meh... I don't know man. There are a lot of good people living in the slums of Baltimore who have been dealt a shitty hand but just go about their lives and grind it out everyday. Then there is a smaller percentage, mostly misguided younger males who are making life miserable for everyone who lives, visits or works in Baltimore. The media definitely exacerbates the situation to profit from, which is deploarable, but that ain't changing.

    I don't think it will ever happen, but Baltimore needs an old school military type persoanlity to come in and run the show. Believe me, when that dipshit DA charged those cops for Freddie Gray's murder for political gain, that resonated with a lot of blue collar white people. Many of those cats in their 40's, 50's & 60's grew up in the city but now live in Balt Co. and Harford Co. Having been a PSL owner for 15+ years I can tell you that a large portion of the Ravens fan base who show up on Sunday's at the stadium are white, blue collar people from places like Dundalk, White Marsh, Glen Burnie, Pasadena, etc.





  5. #53

    Re: PSL watch - over 4000 seats for sale and rising

    Guys, I'm going to say it one more time, take out the right or wrong or reasons aspect of the protests in this thread or it will be moved to the political board.
    Although Walsh's system of offense can compensate for lack of talent; however, defense is a different story. According to Walsh, talent on defense was essential and could not be compensated for. What did Walsh do in 1981? He acquired physical and talented players on defense.





  6. #54
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    Re: PSL watch - over 4000 seats for sale and rising

    -JAB





  7. #55
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    Aug 2011
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    Northern Ireland, UK
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    Re: PSL watch - over 4000 seats for sale and rising

    Ive been over 3 times firm the uk in about 6 years at massive expense. Wouldn't dream of it at present with the product on the field





  8. #56
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    Re: PSL watch - over 4000 seats for sale and rising

    Who the hell wants to watch a boring assed Ravens game. It used to be that the offense sucked, but that the defense would annihilate people and score TDs on top of it. Fans couldn't wait to get the ball to the defense with a lead. Now, the offense is even worse and you have to bite your fingernails hoping the defense doesn't do what you honestly know its going to do.
    "Please take with you this final sword, The Excellector. I am praying that your journey will be guided by the light", Leon Shore





  9. #57
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    Re: PSL watch - over 4000 seats for sale and rising

    I got my 2 original upper end zone seats in 513 for $500 a piece and sold them for $12,000 total (you read that right) when the market was hot . Bought a single seat next to my friend in the same section for $2000 so I'm way ahead.

    No way would I attempt to sell now and take a loss with the market flooded.
    Baltimore Football Championships
    Ravens 2000, 2012
    Stallions 95 CFL
    Stars 85 USFL
    Colts 58, 59, 70





  10. #58
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    Oct 2010
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    North Carolina
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    Re: PSL watch - over 4000 seats for sale and rising

    If I didn't live in NC, I would look into buying. One day, I might actually pull the trigger, but not today.





  11. Re: PSL watch - over 4000 seats for sale and rising

    I think that's what the Ravens ownership wants to believe, and what it wants us to believe, and what some fans want to believe, but I don't think it's true. Sure, some fans really are staying home or dropping tickets due to the protest, but I would argue that it's probably a very minimal number. There is a larger number that in reality were not there in the first place or would have dropped them for other reasons who enjoy making a political cause out of them in reality just being sick of watching this offense and this defense at sky high prices in the cold. I guarantee you if this team were on it's first round playoff bye after going 13-3, coming off a Super Bowl last year, the stadium would be packed and there would be 20,000 people on the waiting list. Heck, the same would be true if ticket prices were halved or something. There are a lot of factors in play- and I don't think the anthem backlash is in the top 5.





  12. #60
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    PSL watch - over 4000 seats for sale and rising

    Quote Originally Posted by ERey View Post
    It's President Trump's fault the attendance in Baltimore is hurting. LOL
    I don't recall a Raven protesting before his moronic tweet do you?


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