Stat comparison updated, 2006 QBs only

**StingerNLG** · 10-19-2006, 12:51 PM

The first pass was in Mason's catchable range. Sorry, but it was. Hell, even the TV announcers going back and watching said it was a good throw. So you can absolutey give Boller credit for the first tipped pass because the throw was there. The second one of course you give to Clayton. It was a lucky catch.

That said, I doubt anyone would be reacting so different if they were simply incomplete passes because you don't know 1) What would have happened on the next down, or 2) We still would have lost and instead of a 97 Boller would have had a mid-80's rating which STILL would have been acceptable for a backup coming off the bench with no reps in practice.

**Greg** · 10-19-2006, 01:26 PM

I think the dink and dunk says more about the Fassel play selection than the QBs ability to throw down field.

Then why the six verticals attempted once Boller came in? Obviously we went downfield a lot more, and even the 20 yard passes were more in evidence. The push downfield was a lot more evident with Boller than it was with McNair.

**Purpleguy** · 10-19-2006, 02:43 PM

I was on the fence as far as bringing in McNair. I wanted Brees, and definitely didn't want Collins or Culppeper.

After seeing McNair play 5 games, I'm now all for letting Boller have at it. I knew McNair wouldn't have the best arm, but I expected his accuracy to be top notch. He is off in every aspect of the game. If we are going to use the excuse that he came into camp late, then let's blame Ozzie for again pussyfooting around and not giving up the 4th rounder on draft day.

I really don't think his late arrival is an excuse. He is getting worse as time goes on as opposed to better. One way or another we will end up with KB as our QB this season, and we'll be all the better for it. If the Lewis brothers have a problem with that then they can hit the bricks next season.

**FHRaven** · 10-19-2006, 03:01 PM

Originally Posted by Purpleguy

I really don't think his late arrival is an excuse. He is getting worse as time goes on as opposed to better.

Quiet, you'll confuse people with facts. I guess as McNair is learning the offense more each week his skills are declining at a more rapid rate!

**highwater** · 10-19-2006, 05:14 PM

Originally Posted by Tex Ritter

I could be wrong on this but I thought I read a post back this summer during pre-season where a Titan fan stated that McNair is usually slow starting out in a game but comes on as the game progresses.

Oh, well, if ONE Titans fan said that, it must be true. :grbac:

**AZRAVEN** · 10-19-2006, 05:38 PM

Starting out slowly is one thing, but he can't continue to save it all for last two minutes of the game.

**Mobtown** · 10-19-2006, 05:48 PM

Originally Posted by Greg

Then why the six verticals attempted once Boller came in? Obviously we went downfield a lot more, and even the 20 yard passes were more in evidence. The push downfield was a lot more evident with Boller than it was with McNair.

Because the Carolina D brought less heat and Boller had time to setup...

Because the Oline managed to give KB enough time to find an open LB to bounce a pass off of...

Because that was the gameplan from the beginning, but Mac was injured before we could see him make any long ball attempts...

Because that's what playing from behind will do to ya...

Because Fassel was playing more to Mac's strength, which is the short game...

I don't really know...but since Mac left the game before the end of the first quarter...we may never get the real answer.

The first pass was in Mason's catchable range. Sorry, but it was. Hell, even the TV announcers going back and watching said it was a good throw. So you can absolutey give Boller credit for the first tipped pass because the throw was there. The second one of course you give to Clayton. It was a lucky catch.

I didn't say that the pass wasn't on target to Mason...but the guy was double covered and the pass was tipped. The ball being catchable isn't the point, lots of catchable balls get tipped and they are NOT counted as completions. The point is that it was fortunate that Clayton came up with the ball and that it was not incomplete or worse.

That said, I doubt anyone would be reacting so different if they were simply incomplete passes because you don't know 1) What would have happened on the next down, or 2) We still would have lost and instead of a 97 Boller would have had a mid-80's rating which STILL would have been acceptable for a backup coming off the bench with no reps in practice.

With the exception of those two passes, let's assume that the game otherwise goes exactly as it did. If those passes were incomplete, KB's completion percentage would have fallen bellow 50% (48.4)...are you seriously saying that is an acceptable completion rate?

The number without those two balls look like this:

Comp Att Yards INT TD Rating
15 31 150 1 1 59.8

Looks pretty McNair-ish to me...

Let me say again, I am pleased with how KB looked coming in and playing having had no 1st team snaps all week...but he did not look like the barn stormer you guys are making him out to be.

Since the chances of a tipped ball being caught by our guy (though, you have to admit that the chances of BOTH going for TDs has to be freaking astronomical) and being intercepted are the same (33.3%), lets also look at how the numbers would have looked in the worst case scanario:

Comp Att Yards INT TD Rating
15 31 150 3 1 33.7

Now look at those numbers and tell me that we would not be having a completely different conversation had Clayton not made KB look like a rock star.

**Greg** · 10-19-2006, 05:58 PM

The first one to Mason didn't appear to be double coverage, one defender got his hand from behind Mason into his guy and deflected a very well thrown ball that took a very good defensive play to stop. The bounce after that was lucky but the ball was very well thrown.

If we start changing stats can we give him a completion and the big yardage lost when Mason didn't catch his toss on the hot read? Mason had a huge open field in front of him and obviously didn't expect the ball which hit him in stride.

**Mobtown** · 10-19-2006, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by Greg

The first one to Mason didn't appear to be double coverage, one defender got his hand from behind Mason into his guy and deflected a very well thrown ball that took a very good defensive play to stop. The bounce after that was lucky but the ball was very well thrown.

If we start changing stats can we give him a completion and the big yardage lost when Mason didn't catch his toss on the hot read? Mason had a huge open field in front of him and obviously didn't expect the ball which hit him in stride.

A tipped ball is very different than a simple incompletion...and you know it. Double covered or single covered makes no difference, the pass was defended.

**Greg** · 10-19-2006, 06:10 PM

Thanks for telling me what I know. Here are some other things I also know. Boller looked better than McNair, he threw a better ball and did a better job getting the ball downfield. And this wasn't just looking at McNair's one horrible day, he hasn't looked good for weeks and only looked good sporadically outside of that.

Boller's completion numbers were low for a few reasons. One, a couple of drops, two, no snaps with the first team thus no timing (he JUST missed Heap and Clayton for huge plays) and three, he was actually pushing the ball downfield and trying to make big plays.

I could have a 65% completion rate if I dinked and dunked like McNair.

**Mobtown** · 10-19-2006, 08:01 PM

Originally Posted by Greg

Thanks for telling me what I know. Here are some other things I also know. Boller looked better than McNair, he threw a better ball and did a better job getting the ball downfield. And this wasn't just looking at McNair's one horrible day, he hasn't looked good for weeks and only looked good sporadically outside of that.

Boller's completion numbers were low for a few reasons. One, a couple of drops, two, no snaps with the first team thus no timing (he JUST missed Heap and Clayton for huge plays) and three, he was actually pushing the ball downfield and trying to make big plays.

I could have a 65% completion rate if I dinked and dunked like McNair.

I hear all of that Greg...but Boller did not produced any better than Mac. Your subjective assesment not withstanding. This teams philosophy is about moving the chains and controlling the clock. That philosophy is realized by using the dink and dunk passing game and a strong dose of run, run, run. I can see that you don't agree and that's cool, we can agree to disagree.

**StingerNLG** · 10-19-2006, 08:14 PM

This teams philosophy is about moving the chains and controlling the clock.

Well then you can't say Boller did not produce any better than Mac, because McNair and this offense has NOT been good at moving the chains. Boller moved the chains better than McNair has been able to do. It was very evident on Sunday.

And if you want to take away Boller's tipped passes, then take away Mason's circus catches in Cleveland. I mean, if we're going to punish one QB for the receiver making a lucky or good catch, let's be fair.