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  1. #16
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    Re: Leach versus Grubbs



    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Silver View Post
    Grubbs got overpaid by New Orleans, cut and dry.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  2. #17
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    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    OK, a slightly different slant: Since we are "stuck" (LOL!!!) with the best FB in football, can we not make use of him in the passing game?

    Pass to Rice, Boldin, Torry, and Jacoby or Pitta (depending on yardage needed). Play Leach in the backfield, bolstering Flacco's pass protection -- with our O line, Leach will be plenty busy! He is no great threat as a runner, but he's good for a few yards and he's not hopeless as a check-off receiver. Not being totally facetious here -- Leach might be able to get Flacco that extra half second he needs. And I'll bet he wouldn't hesitate to plant a leaping D lineman.




  3. #18
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    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    Quote Originally Posted by houstonravensfan View Post
    OK, a slightly different slant: Since we are "stuck" (LOL!!!) with the best FB in football, can we not make use of him in the passing game?

    Pass to Rice, Boldin, Torry, and Jacoby or Pitta (depending on yardage needed). Play Leach in the backfield, bolstering Flacco's pass protection -- with our O line, Leach will be plenty busy! He is no great threat as a runner, but he's good for a few yards and he's not hopeless as a check-off receiver. Not being totally facetious here -- Leach might be able to get Flacco that extra half second he needs. And I'll bet he wouldn't hesitate to plant a leaping D lineman.
    They are already doing it.

    He was in the slot numerous times against the Texans and I believe he caught a pass out of the slot once or twice.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  4. #19
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    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    It is clear that Ravens fans have been so spoiled by draft success that they undervalue players who provide stability. Since Grubbs wasn't an All-Pro caliber player, like most of the Ravens' first round picks, he was overrated. However, they now lack stability at the position and could be looking at their third LG already (Osemele).

    The same went with Jarret Johnson and Cory Redding.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  5. #20
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    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    Ben Grubbs was always so overrated, and was only an average run blocker. Yes he was a good pass blocker, but I don't think he's worth the money that New Orleans are currently paying him. He was a solid pick by Ozzie, but his 3rd round pick that same year has been a better player than him and that's why they paid Yanda and not Grubbs.

    I remember that draft well. OZ coveted Joe Staley to replace JO who would have had a year to groom him. Perfect scenario until former Raven assistant, Mike Nolin under Billick, knew Oz wanted Staley and traded above Oz to get him. Nolan left the Ravens to coach SF.

    But it was a costly move because he gave up a future #1 and that cost him his job later when he was fired and didn't have enough talent.

    But Ozzie's press conference was like a morgue. The company line said they were satisfied
    with Grubbs, the next best player on Ozzie's board but you could tell by their body
    language they were livid about losing Staley.

    And we wouldn't have all these probs moving Oher back and forth.




  6. #21
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    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    Grubbs also had a turf toe which we know linger. I was glad they didn't overpay for him.




  7. #22

    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    Agree that Grubbs was overrated and not worth what he received from New Orleans. On the other hand...

    No disrespect to Mr. Leachisabeast, and clearly Leach is indeed a beast, but fullback is a dead position in the NFL and I don't think he's worth 3.5m. I love his physicality and he certainly improves the run game, but I don't think he fits the direction this team is going at all.

    So far in 2012, Ray Rice is only averaging 4.5 yards per carry out of the I-formation and 5.8 out of 3-wide sets. Statistically, Rice is running the football better WITHOUT Leach on the field than WITH. (stats from ProFootballWeekly's splits section)

    I think this needs to be a single-back offense that spreads you out and then hits you with the run. We can still be a Ray Rice-centric offense without being an I-formation, fullback friendly offense.
    Good post. I do think Rice is more effective when the offense is spread out. With Leach in the game that goes away. Rice is not a power running back. If the Ravens had Jamal Lewis of old back there with Leach the offense would awesome.
    Last edited by srobert96; 10-25-2012 at 08:40 AM.




  8. #23

    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    Not sure if you guys remember, but we did want Grubbs and offered him a pretty similar deal by most reports. He didnt want to play here anymore and went to play for his hometown team. I agree with Jonboy though, its not really one for one situation. If Grubbs did choose to sign that deal and stay we would have had issues and no Jones. I certainly would have been fine with that before the season, but hes been a nice surprise and im not sure what we lost with Grubbs isnt made up for by Jones, Williams, and Leach.
    -JAB




  9. #24

    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    Grubbs was overpaid and not having a stellar year, but he's not awful either.
    Scoring as the 24th ranked OG while allowing 2 sacks, 2 hits and 2 hurries as per PFF.com.
    (Yanda scores at the 2nd ranked OG, just a hair behind Alex Boone)

    Paying $65M to your OGs is just a bit crazy, so for that reason alone, I favor Leach.
    However, I'd be fine with a 3WR/1TE (byebye Dickson) + Rice and Pierce platooning the single back position, if we'd put Leach's $3M into the OL.




  10. #25
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    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    I like Leach as a player but I hated that contract when he got it and that hasn't changed. The Ravens overpaid big time for Leach.

    Having said that Leach and Williams didn't cost the team Grubbs. They could have kept Grubbs if they really wanted to. In fact they came really close to doing so. Grubbs left because Grubbs wanted to leave not because the Ravens couldn't afford to keep him.

    G is not a position that I worry about. I believe Osemele would make a tremendous G. But if you push him to G, you leave the T spots in shambles. Thats where the Ravens need to focus their attention and money.




  11. #26
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    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    I don't think the Ravens overpaid for Leach at all, I think it was a bad signing because of what the Ravens do offensively. Leach is worth every penny of what he makes to a team that is run oriented, a team that puts him out there and lets him maul linebackers all game long, but on this team, that wants to chuck it all over the field 40+ times a game, he has almost no value.




  12. #27
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    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    Quote Originally Posted by Bhcforlife View Post
    I don't think the Ravens overpaid for Leach at all, I think it was a bad signing because of what the Ravens do offensively. Leach is worth every penny of what he makes to a team that is run oriented, a team that puts him out there and lets him maul linebackers all game long, but on this team, that wants to chuck it all over the field 40+ times a game, he has almost no value.
    Yes. Imagine how good the 49ers or the Seahawks would be with Leach lead blocking for Lynch or Gore.




  13. #28

    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    Quote Originally Posted by Bhcforlife View Post
    a team that puts him out there and lets him maul linebackers all game long, but on this team, that wants to chuck it all over the field 40+ times a game, he has almost no value.
    Think about that for a moment. With a league that is devaluing big physical linebackers and allowing bigger more athletic TE's to be the new weapon of choice, Leach could be crushing all these new faster but significantly lighter LB'ers the 1st half of games, then come late 3rd quarter when the opposing team is on the 3rd and 4th string ILB's the whole middle of the field would be opened up for Boldin, Rice, Leach, Dickson and Pitta....




  14. #29
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    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    I've said it before, and backed it up with stats, that Rice would be just as good if not better in a singleback set. Soeone else mentioned his yards per carry with and without Leach in proving the point.

    Now that being said, the truth has been said. Grubbs wasn't staying here, period. And I doubt if you added on Leach's salary to what we offered that it would've changed his mind. HOWEVER I would've gladly paid that to say a starting caliber LT, or even another LG. I'd even throw in McKinneys salary(which I'm SHOCKED we're paying).

    Really the OL woes start and end with the drunk. Other teams are starting far less talented players and are having much more success. It also points at Cam who needs to gameplan better and realize the line just isn't giving Joe time. You need to slow down that 4 man rush and give Joe another second, which is about the average he's behind in time for the league average. Actually think it's almost closer to 1.5 but still.




  15. #30

    Re: Leach versus Grubbs

    I would gladly trade Leach for an upgrade on the oline. That does not mean overpaying for Grubbs. Bottom line is that more successfuly running teams like the 49ers and do not see it necessary to pay for a Leach. In fact the Texans who are probably the best running team have moved away from the traditional fullback to more of TE/HB type of player. They use a low cost traditional full back on short yardage plays. The issues with the Ravens like in scheme, oline coaching and play calling. Plenty of well coached offensive teams have overcome youth, injuries and questionable talent to field a decent to above average oline.




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