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  1. #205

    Re: Officiating (Merged Threads)

    Quote Originally Posted by Haloti92 View Post
    Now you have circled back to the actual issue. And that is the extent to which the "product" has been "sacrificed." To me and many, you haven't even moved the needle towards proving there has been any sacrifice at all. This is especially true when you not only consider the minor effects of an increase of temporary errors that take a little extra time to sort out, but also consider the effects of having crews that do not go out of their way to (perhaps are afraid to) call any and all borderline, ticky-tack fouls regardless of their unbalancing effect on the outcome of the game.
    I'll grant you that you are skilled with the keyboard in arguing your point. You can overstate your own argument and mischaracterize mine, but it's subtle.

    But to me it's as simple as this: An NFL team with 52 rookies is going to go 0-16; is the learning curve that much lower for a ref to expect all these guys off the street to be as good as guys who have done this at the highest level for 5, 10, 15, 20 years.

    Hell, it takes some fry cook at McDonalds time to get up to speed compared to someone with experience...why would this be any different?





  2. Re: Officiating (Merged Threads)

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    They just showed the reply on Football Night in America ....

    Jones definitely pushed off with his left hand. Hate to say it, but that was a good call as well.
    Ha... This thread is getting good. It's almost if you think you're the Peter King of the Ravens 24x7 forum by showing all of us "less knowledgable" fans you're opinion is right because its something all the media elites would say.

    I don't know whether or not the refs cost the Ravens the game today. We had the ball last and didn't convert. What I do know (from the 15 yrs of playing & 30+ yrs of watching) is that they were not very good and had a difficult time w/ the basic intangibles of officiating a football game and all the chippiness by the players was a result of inexperienced refs that they knew could be taken advantage of. Even the common viewer could have witnessed that. The call on Jacoby Jones would not have been called 9 times out of 10 by regular refs. Offensive PI is hardly called in the NFL these days and that play was very subjective.

    Even though you're right 110% of the time according to you, people on here reserve the right to vent on what was clearly a poorly officiated game.

    If that doesn't work, maybe you and the three others you always agree w/ can have your own forum? Or maybe you can forward your resume to SI?





  3. #207
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    Re: Officiating (Merged Threads)

    Quote Originally Posted by Knox Harrington View Post
    Ha... This thread is getting good. It's almost if you think you're the Peter King of the Ravens 24x7 forum by showing all of us "less knowledgable" fans you're opinion is right because its something all the media elites would say.

    I don't know whether or not the refs cost the Ravens the game today. We had the ball last and didn't convert. What I do know (from the 15 yrs of playing & 30+ yrs of watching) is that they were not very good and had a difficult time w/ the basic intangibles of officiating a football game and all the chippiness by the players was a result of inexperienced refs that they knew could be taken advantage of. Even the common viewer could have witnessed that. The call on Jacoby Jones would not have been called 9 times out of 10 by regular refs. Offensive PI is hardly called in the NFL these days and that play was very subjective.

    Even though you're right 110% of the time according to you, people on here reserve the right to vent on what was clearly a poorly officiated game.

    If that doesn't work, maybe you and the three others you always agree w/ can have your own forum? Or maybe you can forward your resume to SI?
    Umm. Wow.

    For one, I never once said the refs called a good game. In fact, I said just the opposite. It was a mediocre game from an officiating standpoint, IMO, but it was mediocre on both sides of the ball.

    Second, I never prevented anyone from giving their opinion or called out anyone as being "less knowledgable". If that's how you view a debate, then I am sorry you feel that way. This is a message board and people will debate. It's the engine of a message board.

    If you have a point to which you'd like to debate, I welcome your thoughts. Otherwise, I'll just chalk your insults up to, as you put it, venting.





  4. #208
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    Re: Officiating (Merged Threads)

    Blaming the officials is the Pees (cowards) way of trying to explain the loss. Ravens had ample opportunities to make that Jacoby play NOT matter as much as it did, and couldn't do it. Look at Flacco going 7/24 or whatever it was in the second half or Cameron constantly dialing up passes when Flacco was hurt and Rice was on fire. Look at the defense getting no pressure and deciding that Celek wasn't worth covering.

    It's the Ravens fault that they left it in the referee's hands to make that call and for it to matter as much as it did. Right call or wrong call, it shouldn't have been that critical. Both teams play with the same officials and there were some iffy calls on the Eagles too.





  5. #209

    Re: Officiating (Merged Threads)

    Quote Originally Posted by Knox Harrington
    Even though you're right 110% of the time according to you, people on here reserve the right to vent on what was clearly a poorly officiated game.

    If that doesn't work, maybe you and the three others you always agree w/ can have your own forum? Or maybe you can forward your resume to SI?
    Some of the posters tonight are a little testy. Hope it passes quickly.





  6. Re: Officiating (Merged Threads)

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    Umm. Wow.

    For one, I never once said the refs called a good game. In fact, I said just the opposite. It was a mediocre game from an officiating standpoint, IMO, but it was mediocre on both sides of the ball.

    Second, I never prevented anyone from giving their opinion or called out anyone as being "less knowledgable". If that's how you view a debate, then I am sorry you feel that way. This is a message board and people will debate. It's the engine of a message board.

    If you have a point to which you'd like to debate, I welcome your thoughts. Otherwise, I'll just chalk your insults up to, as you put it, venting.
    Really, so your first post on this thread wasn't along the lines of "this is a stupid thread" in a condescending way to the OP?

    And your second post wasnt along he lines of "the officials weren't bad today and made no difference in the outcome"? We can pull those up if you want?

    We can debate all you want, but when you're constantly talking down to the good fans that post here, it becomes obnoxious to the casual poster like myself.

    We don't need you telling us that the shit show we saw today was normal (w/ or without replacement refs). They sucked, but so did he play calling and the execution by the Ravens. So when you tell us that Jones pushed off cause the talking heads at NBc said so (even though I watched the play 2 dozen times and I don't really see that), I call BS cause your trying to align your opinion w/ the "experts" which to you makes yourself automatically right.

    The refs sucked today





  7. Re: Officiating (Merged Threads)

    Quote Originally Posted by highwater View Post
    Some of the posters tonight are a little testy. Hope it passes quickly.
    I couldn't care less at this point. The Ravens lost a game they should have won, but thats football man. Maybe they play a good game sun vs the pats and maybe they don't and sit at 1-2 next Monday. They have some flaws at this point that might not make them a contender. Not a whole lot I can do about it other then watch.

    My frustration is w/ über moderator and his constant know it all attitude.





  8. Re: Officiating (Merged Threads)

    Are any of you watching Sunday Night Football on NBC? Did you catch their halftime show? Because Tony Dungy explained that since they don't call illegal contact on DB's against WRs at the college/high school level, these replacement officials don't know to call it when it's happening in NFL games. So, naturally some teams (apparently not the Ravens) are taking full advantage of this by having their DBs mug WRs long after they've past 5 yards downfield.

    I don't think it's a coincidence that Flacco & the WRs looked elite in the 1st half and then looked like crap in the 2nd?

    Guess what the Eagles DBs started doing constantly in the 2nd half that they didn't do in the first?

    Which really exposes Cameron's incompetence/Harbaugh's inexperience--they didn't seem to realize this and kept sending WRs on deeper patterns were that sort of interference affects the timing between WR and QB even more. Should have relied on Rice and used the pass to compliment the run. And the pass routes should have been mainly comeback routes, short digs & curls and quick slants--the type of routes were timing isn't as crucial and that sort of PI is more noticeable.

    EDIT--
    Comment from Aaron Rodgers on this subject from 3 days ago:
    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...the-right-way/

    DAMMIT CAM & JOHN, YOU SHOULD OF SEEN THIS COMING





  9. #213
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    Re: Officiating (Merged Threads)

    Quote Originally Posted by Knox Harrington View Post
    Really, so your first post on this thread wasn't along the lines of "this is a stupid thread" in a condescending way to the OP?
    No, it wasn't ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Knox Harrington View Post
    And your second post wasnt along he lines of "the officials weren't bad today and made no difference in the outcome"? We can pull those up if you want?
    No. I think you're reading into my words and not taking what I said in the proper context of the rest of the thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Knox Harrington View Post
    We can debate all you want, but when you're constantly talking down to the good fans that post here, it becomes obnoxious to the casual poster like myself.

    We don't need you telling us that the shit show we saw today was normal (w/ or without replacement refs). They sucked, but so did he play calling and the execution by the Ravens. So when you tell us that Jones pushed off cause the talking heads at NBc said so (even though I watched the play 2 dozen times and I don't really see that), I call BS cause your trying to align your opinion w/ the "experts" which to you makes yourself automatically right.

    The refs sucked today
    I never once said what we saw today was normal. What I did say and have been saying was the officiating was iffy on both sides, thus it was a fair game.

    I am not trying to align myself with anyone. I saw the play in question and the replay confirmed what I saw. Nothing more, nothing less. If not following the emotional group think makes me some sort of contrarian in your eyes then that's on you. Nothing I can do about that.

    Might I suggest you stick to the words and try to read into (inaccurately) anything I am saying?





  10. Re: Officiating (Merged Threads)

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    No, it wasn't ...



    No. I think you're reading into my words and not taking what I said in the proper context of the rest of the thread.



    I never once said what we saw today was normal. What I did say and have been saying was the officiating was iffy on both sides, thus it was a fair game.

    I am not trying to align myself with anyone. I saw the play in question and the replay confirmed what I saw. Nothing more, nothing less. If not following the emotional group think makes me some sort of contrarian in your eyes then that's on you. Nothing I can do about that.

    Might I suggest you stick to the words and try to read into (inaccurately) anything I am saying?
    Nah, you've never lost a debate here and appear to have more time to kill ants then anyone. I dont really have the time to pontificate w/ someone whose never been wrong it 11k posts. I'll just add you to my ignore list and move on.





  11. #215
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    Re: Officiating (Merged Threads)

    I saw it too, and I maintain it was a bad call. Even with Jones putting his hand out, the defender still never looked for the ball, and in that case Jacoby had every right to make a play on the ball. If the defender turns to play the ball, it's a good call.

    And I will remain in the camp that despite all else, this was a game changing moment that could have altered the entire rest of the game and in effect changed the outcome of the game. Offense and defense sucking aside, it's 4 points that could have made a complete difference in whether the game was won or lost.





  12. #216

    Re: Officiating (Merged Threads)

    Quote Originally Posted by PerpetuallyBored74 View Post
    Are any of you watching Sunday Night Football on NBC? Did you catch their halftime show? Because Tony Dungy explained that since they don't call illegal contact on DB's against WRs at the college/high school level, these replacement officials don't know to call it when it's happening in NFL games. So, naturally some teams (apparently not the Ravens) are taking full advantage of this by having their DBs mug WRs long after they've past 5 yards downfield.

    I don't think it's a coincidence that Flacco & the WRs looked elite in the 1st half and then looked like crap in the 2nd?

    Guess what the Eagles DBs started doing constantly in the 2nd half that they didn't do in the first?

    Which really exposes Cameron's incompetence/Harbaugh's inexperience--they didn't seem to realize this and kept sending WRs on deeper patterns were that sort of interference affects the timing between WR and QB even more. Should have relied on Rice and used the pass to compliment the run. And the pass routes should have been mainly comeback routes, short digs & curls and quick slants--the type of routes were timing isn't as crucial and that sort of PI is more noticeable.

    EDIT--
    Comment from Aaron Rodgers on this subject from 3 days ago:
    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...the-right-way/

    DAMMIT CAM & JOHN, YOU SHOULD OF SEEN THIS COMING
    Is that really the issue here though? It just seems like a farce for a pro sport to have an integral Rule (one that essentially pushed the NFL into hyperdrive when it came into play in the early 1980s) that its "refs" just dont/cant/wont/ call.





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