McKinnie back at LT

**wickedsolo** · 08-14-2012, 01:59 PM

Originally Posted by BcRaven

Alright, here's a vet (BW) who's almost 36, and already has (according to you) "his ankle swelling up." KO is 23, versatile, 6' 3" 335 lbs. You and I are on opposite side of the same page... Bc

*cough*6'6"*cough*

:D

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 08-14-2012, 02:02 PM

I'm not debating that Williams may go down later in the year. History suggests that.

I am not however willing to give up a starting spot based on the likelyhood of a future injury.

There will be injuries on the line. That is not debatable. KO likely will be the first guy off the bench and showing that he can handle multiple spots is a huge plus.

If Bobbie Williams is better than KO 'right now' at OG, how is that holding the team back?

The fact is that it doesn't hold the team back one iota. Just as there is something to be said for youth, there is something to be said for experience and a proven track record.

**JAB1985** · 08-14-2012, 02:08 PM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

I'm not debating that Williams may go down later in the year. History suggests that.

I am not however willing to give up a starting spot based on the likelyhood of a future injury.

There will be injuries on the line. That is not debatable. KO likely will be the first guy off the bench and showing that he can handle multiple spots is a huge plus.

If Bobbie Williams is better than KO 'right now' at OG, how is that holding the team back?

The fact is that it doesn't hold the team back one iota. Just as there is something to be said for youth, there is something to be said for experience and a proven track record.

well i think youre right in that the better player will play, which if Williams ends up being that to start the season so be it. The question lies if its equal. you go with youth and upside or vet experience. KO is proving to be more than capable of starting there so what drives that decision for Harbs. Experience might be the winner at first and give you the stronger line week 1, but by not letting KO on the field you may have a worse line at the end of the year than you could have by plugging KO in at the beginning and getting him the experience hes lacking.

**BcRaven** · 08-14-2012, 02:10 PM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

I'm not debating that Williams may go down later in the year. History suggests that.

I am not however willing to give up a starting spot based on the likelyhood of a future injury.

There will be injuries on the line. That is not debatable. KO likely will be the first guy off the bench and showing that he can handle multiple spots is a huge plus.

If Bobbie Williams is better than KO 'right now' at OG, how is that holding the team back?

The fact is that it doesn't hold the team back one iota. Just as there is something to be said for youth, there is something to be said for experience and a proven track record.

IMO OK is not the 1st guy off the bench, but one of the best 5 Olinemen right now ! Remember Yanda's early work? Yes, let's have 3 older vets (McKinnie, B. Williams, Birk) manning the left side. See what happens mid/later in the the schedule or in the playoffs. Guys like OK (and IMO Boren) will punch out the opposing defenses come December/January... Bc

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 08-14-2012, 02:11 PM

Originally Posted by JAB1985

well i think youre right in that the better player will play, which if Williams ends up being that to start the season so be it. The question lies if its equal. you go with youth and upside or vet experience. KO is proving to be more than capable of starting there so what drives that decision for Harbs. Experience might be the winner at first and give you the stronger line week 1, but by not letting KO on the field you may have a worse line at the end of the year than you could have by plugging KO in at the beginning and getting him the experience hes lacking.

Coaches always go with experience if all things are equal. Fewer blown assignments, fewer penalties, better communication in general.

That's just how it is.

**B-more Ravor** · 08-14-2012, 02:12 PM

Originally Posted by TheJoeFlaccoShow

Bobbie Williams has only been at Guard due to the charade of a "competition" at tackle with McKinnie in Harb's dog house.

Gotta disagree. You don't give give a $800K bonus and a $925K base salary (for 2012) to a guy you expect to be a back-up. That is the kind of money you give to an older veteran that you - at least - expect to compete for the starting job.

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

KO and Williams are not competing.

KO was only there yesterday because they were giving Bobbie Williams some rest due to his ankle swelling up (he will be resting today too). By all accounts, the team is more than happy with Williams there and pretty much is set as the starter

Exactly. Williams was signed to start - or, at the very least, be the starting at the beginning of the year. If KO passes him later on, then I'm sure they would be fine with that.

Plus, I'm not really sure how anyone can say that KO is better than Williams at G right now, when KO hasn't been playing that - save, yesterday - during TC?

**JAB1985** · 08-14-2012, 02:15 PM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

Coaches always go with experience if all things are equal. Fewer blown assignments, fewer penalties, better communication in general.

That's just how it is.

and at what point is that to the detriment of the team in the long run? thats really what were debating here.

i could easily see both scenarios, i dont think theres one that doesnt end with KO starting this year. One he has more games under his belt than the other, and assuming were a playoff team, itll be best to get as many games as he can under his belt.

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 08-14-2012, 02:16 PM

Originally Posted by BcRaven

IMO OK is not the 1st guy off the bench, but one of the best 5 Olinemen right now ! Remember Yanda's early work? Yes, let's have 3 older vets (McKinnie, B. Williams, Birk) manning the left side. See what happens mid/later in the the schedule or in the playoffs. Guys like OK (and IMO Boren) will punch out the opposing defenses come December/January... Bc

You, nor I or anyone else is really qualified to say KO is one of the 5 best. How many practices or games have you watched with KO? The coaches are going with the 5 best they see everyday (as they have said) and since Williams was signed, even back in OTA's, Williams has run with the 1st team.

You can say that KO will give you an extra push...the team could think they would blow assignments or wear down due to hitting the rookie wall (which many rookies who start off well in OTA's and camps do...we saw that with Pernell Mcphee last year).

**B-more Ravor** · 08-14-2012, 02:19 PM

The good thing about McKinnie's issues (and Reid's injury) is that it did allow them to get a look at KO at RT and by all reports he played very well, which gives them more options going forward.

If McKinnie reports on time and/or Reid/Harwood are healthy, they may never have moved KO from G and gotten such a thorough look at KO at RT.

**BigPlayReceiver** · 08-14-2012, 02:19 PM

We have depth, so we have options.

Too early for me to try to shake out the OL, but we know that DET's strength is up front, so we'll get some good evals this Friday.

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 08-14-2012, 02:20 PM

Originally Posted by JAB1985

and at what point is that to the detriment of the team in the long run? thats really what were debating here.

i could easily see both scenarios, i dont think theres one that doesnt end with KO starting this year. One he has more games under his belt than the other, and assuming were a playoff team, itll be best to get as many games as he can under his belt.

How are 2 guys that are equally good, just one is older and a vet and the other is a rookie a detriment?

Do you really think...really think that if KO is the first guy off the bench, and lord forbid...bides his time like most rookies do on the bench in year one, and proves himself, that it is going to hurt him and the team? Through NFL history, rookies generally do not start...especially right off the bat. And it doesn't hinder performance.

**BcRaven** · 08-14-2012, 02:23 PM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

You, nor I or anyone else is really qualified to say KO is one of the 5 best. How many practices or games have you watched with KO? The coaches are going with the 5 best they see everyday (as they have said) and since Williams was signed, even back in OTA's, Williams has run with the 1st team.

You can say that KO will give you an extra push...the team could think they would blow assignments or wear down due to hitting the rookie wall (which many rookies who start off well in OTA's and camps do...we saw that with Pernell Mcphee last year).

While you are correct, I wonder how many Ravens fans believe that KO should be on the bench (?) Jah Reid (3rd round 2011 draft choice) showed he wasn't a starter in 2011, but KO (2nd round 2012 draft choice) has shown that he's qualified to start @ OG or OT IMO. Let's not sit him on the bench for an old veteran, who may never live up to KO's potential now or later... Bc

P.S. - Same as I feel about Cundiff and Tucker (my choice).