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  1. #31

    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?



    Quote Originally Posted by The Excellector View Post
    There seems to be some air that needs to be cleared here. Let's start with Jim Caldwell. Jim Caldwell not only worked with Peyton Manning, but laid the ground work for Brad Johnson. Although, neither he nor Tony Dungy were able to truly enjoy the fruits of their labor, in that situation.

    Yes, Jim Caldwell does have experience calling plays and did so as the Head Coach of Indianapolis, at least, last season.

    The system that Indianapolis runs has similarities to what Baltimore runs. The differences are that Indianapolis' system 'was' more pass heavy, and that they used more quick slants and 'ins' to set up their deep passing. The second difference that I mentioned is something that some fans feel has been missing here.

    The relationship between Cam Cameron and John Harbaugh is overblown. First off, Steve Bisciotti and Ozzie Newsome have both made it clear that they prefer to win with emphasis on defense and running the football, rather than becoming a pass heavy team. That is a call that is coming from the top fellas.

    Second, if Norv Turner hadn't been retained by San Diego, the Ravens would have seriously pursued him to be the Offensive Coordinator here. There was a lot going on with teams giving/withholding permission for other teams to speak to their guys. They wouldn't have had to go through that with Turner, but Turner was kept. They didn't have to go through that with Caldwell and that is how they were able to bring him in.

    Personally, I do think that Caldwell is the bridge between Cameron's time and the new time on the horizon. Now, they don't have to search for anybody if they want to let Cameron go. They have someone within the organization who represents a similar fit to the offensive system they want to run.
    Nothing wrong with that, but when we do pass, let's have some decent plays. When there's an obvious blitz, let Flacco change the play. When the line is struggling to stop the blitz, let's employ some quick slants, screens, etc. to counter the blitz. Cameron seems to just run his gameplan and if it doesn't work, then he blames the players. Sure, the players do drop passes, miss assignments, etc, but it would be nice to have an offensive coordinator who actually has a feel for what's going on in the game. It always seems that, as the game progresses, the other teams make better adjustments on defense than we make on offense.




  2. #32

    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by steelerhater View Post
    I'm not so sure about that. There've been several times where Harbaugh stated that the offense has to get better, while admitting that he has never attended an offensive meeting. I'm not sure that he has any idea what Cameron's gameplan consists of. Its one thing for a head coach to let his assistants coach, but when something isn't working, he should become involved. Over the last 4 years, the Ravens defense has taken us to the playoffs. If the defense slips this year due to Suggs injury or loss of veterans, does anyone really think that the offense can pick up the slack?
    You have to look at what the coaches are actually saying. The "coachspeak" sometimes actually DOES mean something. The two things you most commonly hear said about the offense when it isn't working is: 1) "we have to get better" and 2) "we need to execute." What do the coaches mean when they say "we need to execute?" It's simple--it means "the players are at fault."

    Go back and read interviews from Cam and Harbaugh. Over and over again a theme emerges: Cam is doing great, but the players aren't executing. Our coaching staff is one of the very worst in the league at accepting blame and deflecting praise. When things go well it's good coaching; when they go bad it's the players letting the coaches down.

    I've come to this conclusion over the past few years while paying close attention to the little things our coaches say and do. From the post-game interviews, to Harbaugh giving Cam Cameron the game ball and all the credit after our week 1 dismantling of the Steelers last year, and on and on... this coaching staff, while it does much well, is not at all adaptable and receptive to criticism.




  3. #33
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    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by GOTA View Post
    What's the cause of that? It sure looks like a general lack of faith in Flacco. The fear is that opening things up will lead to mistakes. Each year I hope that changes but so far that hasn't been the case.
    I agree. Hopefully though the NE playoff game was the start of something bigger this year. The 1st quarter was painfully conservative and we got pounded. After giving Joe more rope, we saw success.




  4. #34
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    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by steelerhater View Post
    I'm not so sure about that. There've been several times where Harbaugh stated that the offense has to get better, while admitting that he has never attended an offensive meeting. I'm not sure that he has any idea what Cameron's gameplan consists of. Its one thing for a head coach to let his assistants coach, but when something isn't working, he should become involved. Over the last 4 years, the Ravens defense has taken us to the playoffs. If the defense slips this year due to Suggs injury or loss of veterans, does anyone really think that the offense can pick up the slack?
    Wasn't this past season the season where Harbaugh would become more involved with the offensive gameplanning? Something has to change to get this offense to step on the gas and score more points. I know they've been saying that's the plan for this year, I suppose it's a wait-n-see.
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  5. #35
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    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by GOTA View Post
    What's the cause of that? It sure looks like a general lack of faith in Flacco. The fear is that opening things up will lead to mistakes. Each year I hope that changes but so far that hasn't been the case.
    Would you really want to change a game plan that gets us to the play offs year in year out? I understand opening things up for Flacco, but It's hard to argue with 11-5, 9-7, 12-4, and 12-4 in all of his years in Baltimore so far. Two AFC Championship appearances, two divisional round games, and one dropped pass away from a SB. I think Baltimore are always going to be built around a conservative yet effective game plan while Harbaugh is here.




  6. #36

    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    Would you really want to change a game plan that gets us to the play offs year in year out? I understand opening things up for Flacco, but It's hard to argue with 11-5, 9-7, 12-4, and 12-4 in all of his years in Baltimore so far. Two AFC Championship appearances, two divisional round games, and one dropped pass away from a SB. I think Baltimore are always going to be built around a conservative yet effective game plan while Harbaugh is here.
    Agreed. If Joe improves, this offense is great. If this offense is great, how could you fire the OC?




  7. #37

    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    Would you really want to change a game plan that gets us to the play offs year in year out? I understand opening things up for Flacco, but It's hard to argue with 11-5, 9-7, 12-4, and 12-4 in all of his years in Baltimore so far. Two AFC Championship appearances, two divisional round games, and one dropped pass away from a SB. I think Baltimore are always going to be built around a conservative yet effective game plan while Harbaugh is here.
    Martyball works like that. You can play conservative on offense and tough defense and you will beat all the bad teams and most of the mediocre teams on your schedule. But come crunch time you can't put up enough points to hang with the big dogs. Your players and your play calls just aren't up to that level. Always the bridesmaid, never the bride...




  8. #38
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    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    Cam Cameron will be with this team as long as John Harbaugh is. Same with Jerry Rosburg. Those are "His Guys"--they're not going anywhere.
    I don't know if I 100% buy that.
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  9. #39
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    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    You have to look at what the coaches are actually saying. The "coachspeak" sometimes actually DOES mean something. The two things you most commonly hear said about the offense when it isn't working is: 1) "we have to get better" and 2) "we need to execute." What do the coaches mean when they say "we need to execute?" It's simple--it means "the players are at fault."

    Go back and read interviews from Cam and Harbaugh. Over and over again a theme emerges: Cam is doing great, but the players aren't executing. Our coaching staff is one of the very worst in the league at accepting blame and deflecting praise. When things go well it's good coaching; when they go bad it's the players letting the coaches down.

    I've come to this conclusion over the past few years while paying close attention to the little things our coaches say and do. From the post-game interviews, to Harbaugh giving Cam Cameron the game ball and all the credit after our week 1 dismantling of the Steelers last year, and on and on... this coaching staff, while it does much well, is not at all adaptable and receptive to criticism.
    You are reading way too much into it.

    If Bisciotti and Ozzie come down to Harbs and say this offense is going nowhere slow. Make a change or it's your ass, guess what he'll do? Make a change.

    Cam wanted to be the QB's coach as well as the OC last year. They let him and it was statistically one of Flacco's least impressive seasons and the offense was still really off target at times during the regular season and in the post game.

    So, they brought in Caldwell to be the QB's coach.
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  10. #40

    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    You are reading way too much into it.

    If Bisciotti and Ozzie come down to Harbs and say this offense is going nowhere slow. Make a change or it's your ass, guess what he'll do? Make a change.

    Cam wanted to be the QB's coach as well as the OC last year. They let him and it was statistically one of Flacco's least impressive seasons and the offense was still really off target at times during the regular season and in the post game.

    So, they brought in Caldwell to be the QB's coach.
    Pretty much agree, but I think the set-up is more like...

    Bisciotti/Oz: John, we have the pieces together to get this done, but we believe (*show data*) that Cam is holding us back, so let's put our heads together for a replacement.

    John: Um, hold on now... (*defends Cam, but loses*)


    I don't think they'd come at Harbs with a "him or you" type of stance.




  11. #41
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    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    keep in mind there was no offseason last year and they still were in position to win the AFCC.
    World Domination 3 Points at a Time!




  12. #42
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    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravenswintitle View Post
    keep in mind there was no offseason last year and they still were in position to win the AFCC.
    Yet lost, with arguably far more talent at every position except QB and TE, and really TE is almost a wash as Gronk was hurt. they had Brady and thats really it.




  13. #43

    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by BigPlayReceiver View Post
    Pretty much agree, but I think the set-up is more like...

    Bisciotti/Oz: John, we have the pieces together to get this done, but we believe (*show data*) that Cam is holding us back, so let's put our heads together for a replacement.

    John: Um, hold on now... (*defends Cam, but loses*)


    I don't think they'd come at Harbs with a "him or you" type of stance.
    But I think Harbaugh would tell them that they'd have to fire him as well.




  14. #44

    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravenswintitle View Post
    keep in mind there was no offseason last year and they still were in position to win the AFCC.
    Because of our defense. If we'd of had a little help from our offense, we'd have been in at least 2 super bowls over the last 4 years.




  15. #45
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    Re: If Flacco improves, could Caldwell replace Cam in 2013?

    players have to execute the plays - make the catches, make the kicks... but if you want to blame someone else, go ahead
    World Domination 3 Points at a Time!




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