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  1. #1

    For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread



    I'll bring up the #s one more time... this is not to say Boller is the future, or that he's even a good QB. But it's to disprove the "all backup QBs stats are misleading" bs that I hear spewed. I gathered his stats from the last 9 games he saw significant action in (the 2 games he played all but 1 series last year: carolina and cleveland, plus every game after his injury last season except his first game back)...

    The results:

    Over his last 9 games (significant action, not starts)...he has:

    a 57.8% completion percentage (not bad, not great)

    An average of 220 yards per game

    a 6.85 yards per attempt and 11.86 yards per completion

    16 TDs to 10 INTs...

    Pretty damn good for a backup, if you ask me.


    Not advocating that he starts over McNair (though, I do believe there should be more competition than there will be)...but i'll throw this out there as a point of discussion.

    McNair's Y/A last season was 6.5. Boller, over the aforementioned 9 game stretch, had a Y/A of 6.85. He had a Y/Completion of 10.33 compared with Bollers 11.86. He threw the same number of TDs (16) in essentially 14 games that Boller has thrown in the last 9.

    Again, just a point of discussion.

    There's a lot of blind hate for Boller. I understand some of it, he was god awful for a while. But the organization stuck this guy, who was largely a one year wonder, in to a starting role (they had no option at that point, anyway), on a team who's only wide receivers were Travis Taylor, Marcus Robinson, Frank Sanders, and Ron Johnson. I **** you not.

    He was awful, but who'd expect otherwise? He wasn't a "polished" product coming out of college, he was the type that would need help to succeed, and the organization gave him none. The next year, his supporting cast was even MORE dwindled...he was throwing to Kevin Johnson (now out of the NFL), Travis Taylor (no one wants to sign him--plus he was hurt for a good chunk of that year), Clarence Moore (will be out of the NFL soon, most likely), Randy Hymes (out of the NFL), and, yes, even Deion Sanders. Todd Heap was injured for most of this season, so he was throwing to Darnell Dinkins and Dan Wilcox at TE...I mean, honestly, not to have blind support for the guy, but come on...thats just ridiculous. Tom Brady he is not. Even so, he finished the last 8 games of the 2004 season with 10 TDs to 5 INTs, a marked sign of progress, even with missing the playoffs (due to a large factor of reasons that had NOTHING to do with Boller, by the way).

    The bottom line is, he's made progress. It's undeniable. Sure, he makes blunders. But the way people talk about him, you'd think he's Ryan Leaf or Akili Smith, and he's not. In fact, over his last full season, he's play has been about that as a POOR MAN'S version of Brett Favre.

    Great QB? Nope. Good QB? maybe not. Better than he gets credit for?? Absolutely. In fact, there's no real question about it.




  2. #2
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    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    I agree especially about the last part as being better than he gets credit for. That said it is still tough to watch Kyle. His acts like a frightened squirrel in the pocket and he makes a lot of dangerous throws. He is improving, but is it at a rate that will get him to be a playoff winning caliber starter in the next 2 years?

    I actually think Kyle's best chance for future success is to take the cheapest deal possible to stay here in a system he is getting comfortable in. I don't think it will go well for him if he has to learn a totally different system again. Unfortunately for Kyle, I have a gut feeling that the team is not going to make him an offer of any kind and that they want a fresh start. Only if the coaches see a good amount more progress this year, that sitting behind McNair is really turning him into a QB that can win in the playoffs (or hell even consistently on the road) do I think we make him a token offer.

    I supported Kyle for a long time as a wait and see guy. I've had beers with him before and he really is a good guy. But in the NFL it comes down to this: would you bet your life on Kyle Boller winning a road playoff game in Foxborough?

    I sure wouldn't.




  3. #3
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    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    Has he learned to read defenses yet? If option 1 doesn't come open in time, does he go through his progressions? or does the check down option 4 (running back) get the ball and immediately get blown up?

    He is capable of some great throws (D Williams vs. Cleve 06) but he just isn't consistent enough. He'll be expecting cover 2, safety will instead roll down to a hook zone, and Kyle hits him right in the numbers. Still can't find linebacker underneath coverages either. I love his toughness, heart, and big arm, but there is still a lot of improvement needed to be the fulltime starter.




  4. #4

    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    He's also good friends with Bisciotti and Neuhesial...




  5. #5

    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    Boller averages more yards per game than any QB in the NFL besides Brees, Manning, Bulger, Kitna, and Palmer over that 9 game stretch.

    Mannings yards per completion is about 12.1, while Boller's is very close.

    .......................................

    What's the point of this thread?

    What discussion do you want to make?

    Everyone knows Boller has been a good backup.

    But also, most people know he hasn't shown enough consistency to become an NFL starter.

    I'm wondering why there aren't more teams beating down the door with Boller's "impressive 9 game stretch" and overall winning record...

    Hmmmm.... because he's a backup, and unfortunately, he will stay that way.

    Really, was this just to stir the pot? You posted the same exact thing on the YBR. What discussion do you want out of it?

    For the most part, Boller hasn't performed well, regardless of the circumstances, and frankly, why exactly would I/others want him to be the starter if he's basically sucked 60% of the games he's played in? I don't condone all the shit that's said about him, among other things; but why exactly can people not let Boller shit go? Really, I don't mind the guy at all, and I know he had potential, and I understand the situation he was thrown into, but...

    Frankly, I don't care if he's made progress in his backup role, because he failed to meet the expectations of the TEAM when it mattered. It's great he's getting better, but I think he missed the train already.

    Frankly, why does Boller need a thread made in his honor every time he wipes his ass in the correct direction?
    Season over, guess I'll have to start drinking beer again...




  6. #6

    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    1. It's called "the great QB debate" it is its own special board...what did you expect??

    2. It IS a relevant point of discussion. Sure, Boller was terrible his first two years. He was a rookie, the youngest QB in the NFL (remember, he was younger than Roethlisburger when Roethlisburger was a rookie), and he was given a supporting cast of shit. Honestly. And when the supporting cast improved, so did his performance. That is undeniable. The numbers can't like all that much.

    The way people talk about him is like he is Ryan Leaf.

    And, there's a good chance he starts several games this year...but again, who knows.

    The reason it's a point of discussion is b/c most people just say things like "boller sucks, he can't stand in the pocket, he stares down recevier, he just sucks, he's terrible, blah blah blah" yet the NUMBERS indicate somewhat otherwise.




  7. #7

    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    Quote Originally Posted by RavensNTerps View Post
    1. It's called "the great QB debate" it is its own special board...what did you expect??

    2. It IS a relevant point of discussion. Sure, Boller was terrible his first two years. He was a rookie, the youngest QB in the NFL (remember, he was younger than Roethlisburger when Roethlisburger was a rookie), and he was given a supporting cast of shit. Honestly. And when the supporting cast improved, so did his performance. That is undeniable. The numbers can't like all that much.

    The way people talk about him is like he is Ryan Leaf.

    And, there's a good chance he starts several games this year...but again, who knows.

    The reason it's a point of discussion is b/c most people just say things like "boller sucks, he can't stand in the pocket, he stares down recevier, he just sucks, he's terrible, blah blah blah" yet the NUMBERS indicate somewhat otherwise.


    It gets tiring to hear the "Boller sucks" - "he trips over his feet" arm-waving statements while ignoring the facts. RavensNTerps - you have made some good factual points, but many of those who just have it out for this kid will just ignore them and come back with the arm-waving bullshit.

    In a nutshell: it normally takes 2 or 3 years to develop a starting NFL QB, and longer in Boller's case due to his late college start. The game has slowed down for him, and his most recent performances have been among the better in the entire league - and the last two even better than those of the starter, McNair.

    One of the worst mistakes this team could make in 2008 would be to let Boller walk next season, after he is finally seasoned and knows our system, while placing its future in the hands of a 35-year old near-retiree and an inexperienced, undersized 5th rounder.
    In a 2003 BBC poll that asked Brits to name the "Greatest American Ever", Mr. T came in fourth, behind ML King (3rd), Abe Lincoln (2nd) and Homer Simpson (1st).




  8. #8

    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    I agree. I'd hate to see the Ravens give up on Boller now. I respect how he has maintained his poise. It's one thing to trip and fall down, but it's another to stand back up, brush yourself off, and just when the world is expecting you to fold like a tent, throw a 77 yd TD pass(Cleveland game). Boller will never be Unitas.....but I have no problem rooting for a guy like him.




  9. #9
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    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    Tsk tsk...Tex got kicked off the Sun board (again) as 'Slewfoot', but is merrily posting Boller-hate on the crayon board as 'Spike Marlin' and has again graced us with his wisdom here - as 'Tex Ritter'. Cybil can only wish she had as many names.

    You are on my ignore list, Tex, but it's not too difficult to puzzle out what you have to say in threads like this one. (or any other thread)
    ENFORCE THE 1ST AMENDMENT WITH THE SECOND, NEVER DISARM




  10. #10
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    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    Ah, some good "old" Boller talk.

    This season will be interesting, as I think Boller will see a good amount of action. McNair's record with injuries suggests that it's inevitable.

    Kyle still has a ways to go, but I think he has what it takes, no matter what oldsugarslewghostnobletexspikefoot says.
    Never get in a fight with a pig; you both get muddy, and the pig likes it...





  11. #11

    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    Art, be glad you have Tex on your ignore list.

    I don't have Tex on ignore, but then again, I stop and stare at forest fires, too.

    Tex, rest assured nobody *ever* forgets the point of your post(s).
    Festivus

    His definitions and arguments were so clear in his own mind that he was unable to understand how any reasonable person could honestly differ with him.




  12. #12
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    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    Quote Originally Posted by festivus View Post
    Art, be glad you have Tex on your ignore list.

    I don't have Tex on ignore, but then again, I stop and stare at forest fires, too.

    Tex, rest assured nobody *ever* forgets the point of your post(s).
    Forest fires? Truly warped...unless you have a fondness for charcoal-broiled bears with mountie hats. Mmmmm, with maybe a side order of fries and a bottle of vintage Tuesday MD 20-20. Can't beat it.

    Tex is a phenomenon of nature, much like gerbils, or Ebola.
    ENFORCE THE 1ST AMENDMENT WITH THE SECOND, NEVER DISARM




  13. #13

    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    Or forest fires.
    Festivus

    His definitions and arguments were so clear in his own mind that he was unable to understand how any reasonable person could honestly differ with him.




  14. #14

    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    Thing is, Boller is soooo young. He's young, has physical attributes most QBs not named Michael Vick would kill for, and just getting seasoned. He is younger than Rothlesberger, and he was drafted a year before.


    You look at his performances over the last 10 games and its pretty impressive.


    The arm waving BS and people saying its scary to watch him . . . is just plain retarded. You know its scary to watch most QBs not named Manning or Brady play. Because they're going to take a bad sack eventually, or fumble and lose the ball. Plenty of QBs make that 1-2 bad mistakes a game, forced or unforced. But other coaches and other teams fans get over that cause they let their QB play real football and a real offense and they make explosive plays, more than enough to make up for a mistake or two.


    Thats what I saw out of Boller's last 10 games. He's a Brett Favre type. You'll need to let him throw it around and take the good with the bad in the hopes that the good outweighs the bad.


    The cleveland game. It wasn't the smoothest ride, but his deep pass to Clayton for 40 or so yards and his 77 TD pass to D Will are the kind of game changing plays a team like ours needs, to let the defense be inspired, and to put points on the board.


    Finally, I'll say that what bothers me about McNair is 3 things 1) taht I don't feel like he makes enough big plays to make up for his mistakes 2) he's older and only getting older by the minute 3) that he doesn't seem to have the competitive fire he once had, like when I watched him live at M&T bank stadium beat the Ravens as a Titan


    If we let Boller go, we're resetting the team's whole QB situation, and it will be a shit storm unless Troy Smith pans out.


    And in the end, thats what this season's QB situation comes down to:

    1) How much time does McNair miss, and does Boller do well in relief

    2) How good does Troy Smith look in camp / preseason / practices

    3) How good does McNair look, or does he look rather pedestrian (like much of last year)

    4) How does the O-line perform for all the QBs abvoe




  15. #15

    Re: For old times sake, a good old fashioned Boller thread

    I definately can agree with Ravens&Terps.

    Some of the other stuff...is just pure Boller colored glasses.

    Boller is not Ryan Leaf, he is not Brett Farve either.

    He needs to produce on the road...that has ALWAYS been his problem.

    And some of the shots at McNair are a joke...The team has stated McNair has maybe 2 years left, including this year...he isn't going to be starting when he is 38, and to question his heart or desire is a joke.

    Will it be a mistake letting Boller go after this year, maybe, but the team did it to themselves by rushing him, and basically forcing them to go with the vet during the years he should be blossoming instead of the vet when he was obviously very raw.

    Hopefully, the team can get a young QB next year to learn as I'm not a big Troy Smith is the answer guy either...I see Jeff Blake w/o the attitude...not a bad player, but a franchise guy?...naw.

    Either way, I think you can't just say the team has to keep him...Boller has to want to stay here, I doubt he sees a future here.




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