Dickson and Pitta: I was wrong.

[BleedPurple92]

Let me put it in a different way.... Because oddly, i don't hate you(Even though you've made me pull a couple of these :grbac: ).

Think of Pitta as a Wide Receiver, which he started as on Sunday vs the Bengals. Think of him Playing both Receiver and Tight End.

He comes in on 3 WR sets, in his reciever role in place of Evans.... Meanwhile still holding up his Job as the 2nd TE.

Its really simple, I just really don't like Evans, and judging by how well Pitta played sunday when he played Receiver, i would feel a lot better with him at Receiver instead of Evans. He has shown his versatility. Just think of him as another reciever..

Fact is, Evans still plays, and he comes in and drops passes thrown his way and doesn't get open, you cant tell me he's a better option than Pitta, i still see him in the games. Did you not see him drop that long perfect bomb by Flacco? I know i wasn't seeing things.

I'm up this late because I've been writing this fucking paper, that i started late on, so i'm double frustrated on that... I'm gonna be passed out in class hope my Professor, is in a good mood. Sorry if i'm coming off harsh. Just don't understand why its such a hard concept to grasp.

[RavenScallywag]

I'll jump into the fire here...

I see what bleed is saying. Vonta Leach, best FB in the game, no denial there...

But, when it's 3rd and long, what is the point of bringing Leach out there? Very little chance you're going to run it there. Leach is a decent receiver, but more in a short yardage situation to bang through some defenders. Maybe as a pass blocker, but I bet if you go and look through every offensive play we've run (I'm not going to do it), Leach isn't on the field for every offensive snap in the game.

So, what we're saying is, when you pull Leach off the field to load up for a pass, the primary guy checking in SHOULD be Pitta. Dickson is supposed to be a more athletic, hybrid WR/TE type anyway, but in any case, you can use the two of them, along with Torrey and Boldin, in many different formations. Unbalanced line, one on each side, one dropped into the slot, one in the back field...

This is two things really...#1, an indication of how well BOTH TEs have played this year and #2, an indictment of the way Lee Evans is playing.

[JAB1985]

I think its kind of hard to look at Heaps stats last year vs, Dickson and Pitta this year. Dickson only had 150 yards and 11 catches last year as our 2nd TE while Pitta has over 40 and 400. obviously were more TE oriented than last year, certainly with 2 TE sets and our lack of a 3rd WR. Theyve both certainly had good years, and getting rid of Heap, although not my favorite move was still probably the best for the team.

As far as who plays when, obviously I think Pitta has been in that roll more lately if not sliding past Dickson as the primary TE. Matchups and game situations determine personnel so I think its hard to say that it should be one way or another EVERY time. you start getting predictable and teams key in on it. I think Pittas 3rd down conversion catches are probably a good sign that hes in on 3rd and long and playing well.

[festivus]

Heap missed even more games this year and was injured when he
came here. Oz knew what he was doing.

It's been said Heap doesn't like taking medications and shots because
of his religion. Not sure if that's true but it's been said.

Whatever, he only had 283 yds this year and 1 TD as opposed to 938 yds and 8 TDs for Pitta and Dickson.

That rumor was debunked while he was still here.

That's the more interesting comparison, though, what he's doing *this* year compared to what Dickson & Pitta are doing. Because if we'd kept him - as much as we revere him, with good reason - it's *this* year's Heap we'd have. Not last.

[Mista T]

OMG This is the most pointless argument i've ever had on this Message board, and i feel like you wanted to make it difficult.

Makes absolutely no sense, why this has even gone this far based on the Bold portion, if you really meant what you said in the bold portion.


................ I don't understand, are you competent? Why is this such a hard concept? ITS FUCKING SIMPLE.

Would you all please stop all the bickering and just get on with the Tight End discussion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is ridiculous -- and disruptive. If you need to insult each other, please take your insults to PMs.

Thanks.

[Paintballguy]

I've been really impressed with both TE's. I wish Dickson wouldn't have as many drops, but he has made some big catches. I think both will be a force going forward, as they are only in their second year.

[bmorecareful]

Dickson and Pitta were okay this year, but neither of them were a replacement for Todd Heap. Heap's 2010 was significantly better than Dickson's 2011; since Dickson was our 16 game starter at #1 TE, it's not really arguable. Heap had a similar number of catches for more yards per catch with much better blocking. Flacco was also rarely intercepted throwing to Heap but he was intercepted more throwing to Dickson than any other player in 2011. Heap also didn't have a drop in 2010. We've already gone through this before.

It's not fair to say "durrrr well Dickson and Pitta TOGETHER had better stats than Heap durrrr!" Completely illogical and ridiculous. We ran virtually no 2TE sets last year, instead we ran more 3 WR sets with Houshmandzadeh in the slot; Pitta is the replacement for TJ, and the stats and game charting bear that out (did you know Pitta has lined up as a WR in the slot or split wide far more than he has lined up at in-line TE or H-back?)

I'm pleased with Pitta's performance this year, but let's face it, Dickson has been a disappointment. He's top 10 in the league in targets for a TE, but he hasn't really done a whole lot with those targets, his routes are still sloppy, and he struggles to catch routine passes at times. And his blocking is god-awful.

I think there's still plenty of upside for these guys. I think the Ravens would be well-served to continue to run lots of 2TE sets because we do not have a 3rd WR worth seeing the field over Pitta. Plus, I'm not sure why some have said you can't run out of a 2TE set. A lot of good teams run the 2TE set as their base offense (Patriots are the best example) and you can certainly run well out of it, particularly around the perimeter. Your TEs have to block well, though, and our's don't, but that skill will come in time.

Running the 2TE set doesn't mean Leach doesn't get his snaps. A good offense has to be variable and capable of beating you a lot of ways. We need to be able to run out of 2TEs and pass out of the I-formation, even though technically those are "passing" and "running" formations, respectively.

[psuasskicker]

We use these TEs pretty regularly as receivers...it doesn't limit our ability to run at all on first down to use them, and it doesn't limit our ability to pass with them either. There have been several times when Pitta or Dickson line up in the backfield or split wide, not to mention the literally countless times they have them lined in the slot.

- C -

[pslholder96]

Would you all please stop all the bickering and just get on with the Tight End discussion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is ridiculous -- and disruptive. If you need to insult each other, please take your insults to PMs.

Thanks.

Thank You!!:insane:

[JAB1985]

Would you all please stop all the bickering and just get on with the Tight End discussion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is ridiculous -- and disruptive. If you need to insult each other, please take your insults to PMs.

Thanks.

this shouldnt even had to be said but thanks for making it clear.

Hey Guys, were about to host a home playoff game after having a bye from winning our division, the mood around here should be more celebratory than aggressive.

[Sec545]

Very well said.

[Sec545]

Dickson and Pitta were okay this year, but neither of them were a replacement for Todd Heap. Heap's 2010 was significantly better than Dickson's 2011; since Dickson was our 16 game starter at #1 TE, it's not really arguable. Heap had a similar number of catches for more yards per catch with much better blocking. Flacco was also rarely intercepted throwing to Heap but he was intercepted more throwing to Dickson than any other player in 2011. Heap also didn't have a drop in 2010. We've already gone through this before.

It's not fair to say "durrrr well Dickson and Pitta TOGETHER had better stats than Heap durrrr!" Completely illogical and ridiculous. We ran virtually no 2TE sets last year, instead we ran more 3 WR sets with Houshmandzadeh in the slot; Pitta is the replacement for TJ, and the stats and game charting bear that out (did you know Pitta has lined up as a WR in the slot or split wide far more than he has lined up at in-line TE or H-back?)

I'm pleased with Pitta's performance this year, but let's face it, Dickson has been a disappointment. He's top 10 in the league in targets for a TE, but he hasn't really done a whole lot with those targets, his routes are still sloppy, and he struggles to catch routine passes at times. And his blocking is god-awful.

I think there's still plenty of upside for these guys. I think the Ravens would be well-served to continue to run lots of 2TE sets because we do not have a 3rd WR worth seeing the field over Pitta. Plus, I'm not sure why some have said you can't run out of a 2TE set. A lot of good teams run the 2TE set as their base offense (Patriots are the best example) and you can certainly run well out of it, particularly around the perimeter. Your TEs have to block well, though, and our's don't, but that skill will come in time.

Running the 2TE set doesn't mean Leach doesn't get his snaps. A good offense has to be variable and capable of beating you a lot of ways. We need to be able to run out of 2TEs and pass out of the I-formation, even though technically those are "passing" and "running" formations, respectively.

Very well said.