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  1. #85

    Re: Stealers cap situation for 2012 a complete disaster



    Informative thread, but do you guys really think they cut Ike Taylor? He just signed a big 4 year deal and had a good season. Keisel too? I could see them cutting or at least restructuring Heath Miller, 7 million is a lot for a aging TE.
    I could see another team placing a claim on Wallace, giving up a first for him if he is only scheduled to make about 3 million.
    Last edited by Boulderraven; 01-13-2012 at 10:54 AM.




  2. #86

    Re: Stealers cap situation for 2012 a complete disaster

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelFaninBMore View Post
    My thoughts exactly. Good discussion. This thread will be exhibit A the next time I get asked why a Steelers fan is posting on a Ravens board. Because you don't get this info on Steeler boards. Most of them don't even acknowledge that a cap problem exists, and the few that do (like scout) believe it's overblown and the front office will magically fix it and keep the whole roster intact.
    Be careful. You might get deported from the "Nation."




  3. #87
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    Re: Stealers cap situation for 2012 a complete disaster

    [QUOTE=SteelFaninBMore;397842]
    That seems to be the way Goodell wants it anyway, might as well change with the times. They could still win enough games to be in contention for a wildcard.

    The silver lining is that this rebuilding/reloading period comes at a time where the AFC is not as strong as it was the last few years. The Colts are down, the Jets are imploding (unless they somehow land Manning). The powerhouses for the forseeable future look to be New England and Baltimore, and then a considerable drop-off to a log-jam of second-tier teams, that should include Pittsburgh. 9 wins next year could still get a #6 seed, as it did this year.

    QUOTE]

    Cinci might be the next power, and maybe the Raiders. one day the Chargers might get their act together (after they fire Norv). doubt Miami, Buff, Cleve, Indi, Jax will do much soon.
    Baltimore Ravens, 2012 NFL Champions!




  4. #88

    Re: Stealers cap situation for 2012 a complete disaster

    Quote Originally Posted by Boulderraven View Post
    Informative thread, but do you guys really think they cut Ike Taylor? He just signed a big 4 year deal and had a good season. Keisel too? I could see them cutting or at least restructuring Heath Miller, 7 million is a lot for a aging TE.
    I could see another team placing a claim on Wallace, giving up a first for him if he is only scheduled to make about 3 million.
    I don't see how you can cut your top corner you just gave a long term deal to either. Problem is as I laid out earlier they are so pressed against the cap something has to give. They will have to restructure him at the least, along with the other top 6 contracts. And all that does is just push money to next year. The cap numbers for their top guys are already huge because they restructured a lot of them last year to get under the cap. If they do it again it is just going to be worse for 2013. Miller isn't going anywhere either he is one of their core players, and at 29 years old I wouldn't call that old or aging.




  5. #89

    Re: Stealers cap situation for 2012 a complete disaster

    Steelfan I totally forgot about Brett Keisel, what do you think about him? Another guy just like Ike who is old, locked up for a long time and the best at his respective position by a long shot. Has a big cap number with very little savings if cut (4.5 cap number would only free up 1.15 extra if they cut him).

    Those numbers dictate they almost have to keep him, but again they just don't have the money. Plus you have Heyward and Hood right behind him 10 years younger and high draft picks?




  6. #90

    Re: Stealers cap situation for 2012 a complete disaster

    Where the Steelers could take a hit is with their veteran leadership. When Baltimore released, McGahee, Heap, Mason and Gregg, they still had the type of quality veteran leadership to lend itself to overcoming the hurdles of youth. The question will be whether or not the Steelers will be able to do the same. A great player does not automatically make a leader. Chris McAlister was a great player. Chris McAlister was not a great leader.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  7. #91

    Re: Stealers cap situation for 2012 a complete disaster

    Here is an update with some stuff I have been reading....

    Projected with cap numbers

    Quarterback: (3)

    Ben Roethilsberger....16,920,000 UC
    Dennis Dixon..............1,000,000 UFA
    Charlie Batch..............1,000,000 UFA

    Sub Total - 18,920,000

    Running Back: (5)

    Rashard Mendenhall.....3,427,500 UC
    Issac Redman.................540,000 EFA
    Mewelde Moore.............1,000,000 UFA
    Jonathan Dwyer...............565,948 UC
    David Johnson..............1,260,000 RFA

    Sub Total - 6,793,448

    Offensive Line: (10)

    Maurkice Pouncey...........2,166,750 UC
    Marcus Gilbert...................733,503 UC
    Jonathan Scott...............2,700,000 UC
    Ramon Foster.................1,260,000 RFA
    Doug Legursky................1,260,000 RFA
    Trai Essex.......................1,000,000 UFA
    Jamon Meredith..................800,000 UC
    Willie Colon.....................5,700,000 UC
    Greg Warren.......................925,000 UC
    Max Starks?.....................1,000,000 UFA

    Sub Total - 17,545,253

    Tight End: (3)

    Heath Miller.....................7,070,500 UC
    Weslye Saunders................466,333 UC
    Draft Pick(5)......................400,000 N/A

    Sub Total - 7,936,833

    Wide Receiver: (5)

    Mike Wallace....................2,750,000 RFA
    Antonio Brown.....................564,359 UC
    Emmanuel Sanders..............735,357 UC
    Jerricho Cotchery..............1,000,000 UFA
    Arnez Battle.....................1,362,500 UC

    Sub Total - 6,412,216

    Defensive End: (4)

    Brett Keisel...................4,500,000 UC
    Evander Hood...................1,728,535 UC
    Cameron Heyward.............1,523,870 UC
    Draft Pick(2)........................700,000 N/A


    Sub Total - 8,452,405

    Defensive Tackle: (4)

    Steve McLendon...................540,000 EFA
    Draft Pick (1).....................1,200,000 N/A
    Draft Pick (6)........................300,000 N/A
    UDFA....................................100,000 N/A

    Sub Total - 2,140,000

    Outside Linebacker: (4)

    LaMarr Woodley....................7,100,000 UC (restructure)
    James Harrison.....................9,030,000 UC
    Jason Worilds..........................895,000 UC
    Chris Carter............................505,700 UC

    Sub Total - 17,530,700

    Inside Linebacker: (3)

    Lawrence Timmons..............5,125,000 UC (restructure)
    Farrior/Foote.........................3,825,000 UC
    Stevenson Sylvester.................578,854 UC

    Sub total - 9,528,854

    Corner: (6)

    Keenan Lewis.......................1,260,000 RFA
    William Gay.........................1,250,000 UFA
    Curtis Brown...........................595,300 UC
    Cortez Allen............................562,875 UC
    Draft Pick(4)............................400,000 N/A
    Draft Pick (7)...........................100,000 N/A

    Sub Total - 4,168,175

    Safety: (4)

    Troy Polamalu.......................8,887,500 UC
    Ryan Clark............................4,250,000 UC
    Ryan Mundy..........................1,260,000 RFA
    Draft Pick(3)............................600,000 N/A

    Sub Total - 14,997,500

    Kicker and Punter: (2)

    Shaun Suisham.......................1,687,500 N/A
    Punter......................................400,000 N/A

    Sub Total - 2,087,500

    Now that all adds up to 116,512,884 with all 53 players. Say 116 million with just the top 51 players. Add in the 2.4 million for dead money and we are up to about 118.4 million. Add in 6 million for dead money for the guys they release and they are at 124.4 million, probably exactly where the cap is going to be at. They got a big time relief of about 8 million with the Woodley and Timmons restructures due to roster bonuses built into the contract that can be converted to signing bonus and spread out over the remaining years.


    -Woodley and Timmons can restructure, adding about 1 to 1.5 million to each of their cap numbers for the next 4-5 years or so.

    -Suisham is no savings if cut really, and with 3 years on the deal he is likely to be back from what I read.

    -Keisel coming back even though he is 34, again minimal savings if cut.
    Last edited by 52decleetzu; 01-14-2012 at 12:53 AM.




  8. #92

    Re: Stealers cap situation for 2012 a complete disaster

    Didn't Woodley and Timmons just sign their new extensions?
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  9. #93

    Re: Stealers cap situation for 2012 a complete disaster

    Quote Originally Posted by The Excellector View Post
    Didn't Woodley and Timmons just sign their new extensions?
    Yes, and that is what makes them prime candidates for restructuring, with money not paid out yet that can be converted to signing bonus...

    http://www.steelersdepot.com/2012/01...ons-contracts/

    LOL at the website blocking copying the text. Only in Pittsburgh SMH.




  10. #94

    Re: Stealers cap situation for 2012 a complete disaster

    Reading all this stuff about the Steelers got me interested in the Ravens cap situation. I'm certainly no cap expert so I did a lot of digging through bmoreravor's columns, rotoworld, and spotrac to come up with these #'s.

    QB:
    Joe Flacco - 8,000,000 (No idea what his cap # is due to incentives)
    Tyrod Taylor - 491,275

    RB:
    Ricky Williams - 1,575,000 (1.4m in incentives could increase this # if they're LTBE)
    Anthony Allen - 477,500
    Vonta Leach - 4,333,333

    WR:
    Anquan Boldin - 8,000,000
    Lee Evans - 5,507,500 (The restructure makes this a bit confusing)
    Torrey Smith - 765,725
    David Reed - 584,667
    Tandon Doss - 568,140

    TE:
    Ed Dickson - 760,833
    Dennis Pitta - 663,667

    OL:
    Bryant McKinnie- 4,000,000
    Marshal Yanda - 6,500,000
    Michael Oher - 2,040,000
    Jah Reid - 605,810
    Ramon Harewood - 564,723

    DL:
    Haloti Ngata - 10,400,000
    Terrence Cody - 820,000
    Arthur Jones - 584,500
    Pernell McPhee - 501,140

    LB:
    Terrell Suggs - 11,520,000
    Ray Lewis - 6,850,000
    Paul Kruger - 865,000

    CB:
    Jimmy Smith - 1,695,500
    Chris Carr - 3,750,000
    Domonique Foxworth - 8,600,000
    Emanuel Cook - 540,000
    Chykie Brown - 501,140

    S:
    Ed Reed - 8,500,000
    Bernard Pollard - 2,585,000

    S/T:
    Billy Cundiff - 2,800,000
    Sam Koch - 2,000,000

    Dead Money:
    Willis McGahee - 3,750,000
    Kelly Gregg - 789,000


    Total Value: 112,489,453


    Restricted Free Agents:
    Lardarius Webb
    Cary Williams
    Dannell Ellerbe
    Danny Gorrer

    Unrestricted Free Agents:
    Ray Rice
    Ben Grubbs
    Matt Birk
    Andre Gurode
    Kris Wilson
    Cory Redding
    Jarret Johnson
    Jameel McClain
    Brendon Ayanbadejo
    Brandon Mckinney
    Haruki Nakamura
    Tom Zbikowski

    Exclusive Rights Free Agents: (I'm assuming all these guys are EFA's)
    Morgan Cox
    Sergio Kindle
    Matt Lawrence
    Justin Boren
    Albert McClellan
    Michael McAdoo
    Chavis Williams
    LaQuan Williams


    * Cutting Foxworth and Evans should save us close to 10m against the cap
    * If Ed Reed decides to Retire or gets released we would save another 7.2m.
    * The projected 120m salary cap for 2012 could be closer to 130m for the Ravens if they used the loophole illustrated below by bmoreravor

    If the Ravens choose not to, or fail to, sign anyone to a contract extension by late November, they still have options with the surplus Cap space. As they (and many other teams) have done in the past, they can renegotiate some contracts by inserting "phony” incentives into those deals allowing them to carry any excess 2011 Salary Cap space over into 2012, thereby increasing their 2012 Cap space.

    This loophole, which existed in the prior CBA, was not closed by the new CBA, so teams still have the ability to carry excess Salary Cap room from year to year. This is accomplished by renegotiating a contract (or contracts) during the season and writing in Not Likely To Be Earned (NLTBE) incentives.

    Normally, NLTBE incentives do not count against the 2011 Cap, but – for some reason – the CBA says that they do if they are added during the season. As such, the full amount of those incentives immediately counts against the 2011 Cap, essentially eating up the excess Cap space. If unearned – and they would be written so that they would go unearned – the team receives a credit the following year for those unearned incentives. As such, that amount would be carried over into 2012 and would increase the team’s Cap space.

    http://ravens24x7.com/columns/The-Mo...ound-cap-space
    Last edited by Reedpixuoff; 01-14-2012 at 09:46 PM.




  11. #95

    Re: Stealers cap situation for 2012 a complete disaster

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelFaninBMore View Post
    My thoughts exactly. Good discussion. This thread will be exhibit A the next time I get asked why a Steelers fan is posting on a Ravens board. Because you don't get this info on Steeler boards. Most of them don't even acknowledge that a cap problem exists, and the few that do (like scout) believe it's overblown and the front office will magically fix it and keep the whole roster intact.
    As long as they have Big Ben and the trio of young receivers they will remain competitive. They will probably cut some guys and then resign them for more cap-friendly deals. Nothing to see here.




  12. #96

    Re: Stealers cap situation for 2012 a complete disaster

    Quote Originally Posted by steelerhater View Post
    As long as they have Big Ben and the trio of young receivers they will remain competitive. They will probably cut some guys and then resign them for more cap-friendly deals. Nothing to see here.
    They may not keep Wallace, though. I could see a team giving up a first for him.




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