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  1. #13
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    Re: Worst NFL defenses - Packers and Pats



    Quote Originally Posted by DkBlue View Post
    It is no where near flag football. Just check the injury lists. The 3-4 defense has been solved and teams are putting some great offensive talent on the field.

    The biggest change impacts the defensive backs. On almost every pass play the commentator will say "No flag." PI seems to be called more than ever this year.
    I don't think its flag football but it's certainly nowhere close to what it used to be. Check out the injuries in MLB. A sport doesn't have to be physical for a lot of athletes to get hurt. This year with players not being in the shape they normally on and the inability of coaches to do what it takes to get them into shape there seem to be more injuries than ever.

    I agree with you about pass interference. Sometimes I think Flacco throws deep into double coverage because he thinks the can get a PI call. Lots of other QBs seem to be doing the same thing. Holding calls seem to be a lot less frequent too even though there is a lot of obvious holding going on. It's all part of the same thing.
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  2. #14
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    Re: Worst NFL defenses - Packers and Pats

    There are still teams out there using hard nosed defense to help them win games.

    The Giants demolished the Patriots because of stellar defensive play.

    The Packers had one of the best defenses in the league last year and the Steelers had nothing for them.


    The Ravens, Steelers, Jets, Bengals, Niners, Dolphins, and even the Saints and Browns are winning games because of their defense. Hell, the only reason the Texans continue to be successful is because of Wade Phillips and his defense.


    If defenses weren't important than every team would be gunning for offensive juggernaut players and letting the defense go by the wayside. It's not like the Packers and Pats don't have good defensive players.

    Let's look at Green Bay:

    1 - They don't have anyone opposite of Clay Matthews. He took the league by storm last year and now offenses are keying on him and only him. Charles Woodson finally is starting to slow down (he is something like 35 or 36 years old). Lastly, the Packers had arguably their best player in the secondary go down in October (Nick Collins) and are starting Charlie Peprah (who has never been very good) and Morgan Burnett, who is a 2nd year player with no experience. Take into consideration that AJ Hawk and Desmond Bishop have been out with injuries here and there and they're starting a rookie DJ Smith at MLB from the monster juggernaut school of Appalachian State.

    Now, let's look at New England:
    Were predominately a 3-4 team last year. Bellichek decides to swap to a 4-3 front with 3-4 players. That, and that alone, is enough of a reason for why the Pats have struggled on defense. More importantly is the fact that Devin McCourty has been injured a lot of the year and they used a high draft pick on another corner, Ras-I Dowling, and he's been injured as well (which is funny to me because I pointed out how oft-injured he was while at UVA prior to last year's draft and that was why I wanted the Ravens to stay away from him). The Pats also have ZERO talent at the safety positions. They let Merriweather go, which in retrospect wasn't a great idea, and Patrick Chung has been in and out with injuries all year.


    THAT is why the Packers and Patriots have been less than impressive on the defensive side of the ball. Not because they're gearing more effort to their offenses.
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  3. #15

    Re: Worst NFL defenses - Packers and Pats

    Quote Originally Posted by ed from Bel Air View Post
    I think the NFL has gone to far with its rule changes favoring the passing game when one of the two teams with the worst defenses in the NFL is undefeated, and the other shares the best record in their conference.
    They're the worst defenses in terms of yards. GB leads the league with 23 picks, NE is tied for second with 17. GB is 13th in points allowed per game, while NE is 17th. To me GB is an average defense and NE is a pretty bad defense, but I don't really think either is the worst.




  4. #16

    Re: Worst NFL defenses - Packers and Pats

    Quote Originally Posted by PTORaven View Post
    They're the worst defenses in terms of yards. GB leads the league with 23 picks, NE is tied for second with 17. GB is 13th in points allowed per game, while NE is 17th. To me GB is an average defense and NE is a pretty bad defense, but I don't really think either is the worst.
    Green Bay and NE are both terrible on defense, there is nothing average about them.

    GB is giving up 6.2 per play, and NE is giving up 6.3 a play. Good for 31st and 32nd respectively.




  5. #17
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    Re: Worst NFL defenses - Packers and Pats

    Quote Originally Posted by PTORaven View Post
    They're the worst defenses in terms of yards. GB leads the league with 23 picks, NE is tied for second with 17. GB is 13th in points allowed per game, while NE is 17th. To me GB is an average defense and NE is a pretty bad defense, but I don't really think either is the worst.
    Part of this is because they're such high scoring offenses, it forces the opposition to go pass happy and try to score quickly. The strategy is working for them...
    World Domination 3 Points at a Time!




  6. #18

    Re: Worst NFL defenses - Packers and Pats

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    There are still teams out there using hard nosed defense to help them win games.

    The Giants demolished the Patriots because of stellar defensive play.

    The Packers had one of the best defenses in the league last year and the Steelers had nothing for them.


    The Ravens, Steelers, Jets, Bengals, Niners, Dolphins, and even the Saints and Browns are winning games because of their defense. Hell, the only reason the Texans continue to be successful is because of Wade Phillips and his defense.


    If defenses weren't important than every team would be gunning for offensive juggernaut players and letting the defense go by the wayside. It's not like the Packers and Pats don't have good defensive players.

    Let's look at Green Bay:

    1 - They don't have anyone opposite of Clay Matthews. He took the league by storm last year and now offenses are keying on him and only him. Charles Woodson finally is starting to slow down (he is something like 35 or 36 years old). Lastly, the Packers had arguably their best player in the secondary go down in October (Nick Collins) and are starting Charlie Peprah (who has never been very good) and Morgan Burnett, who is a 2nd year player with no experience. Take into consideration that AJ Hawk and Desmond Bishop have been out with injuries here and there and they're starting a rookie DJ Smith at MLB from the monster juggernaut school of Appalachian State.

    Now, let's look at New England:
    Were predominately a 3-4 team last year. Bellichek decides to swap to a 4-3 front with 3-4 players. That, and that alone, is enough of a reason for why the Pats have struggled on defense. More importantly is the fact that Devin McCourty has been injured a lot of the year and they used a high draft pick on another corner, Ras-I Dowling, and he's been injured as well (which is funny to me because I pointed out how oft-injured he was while at UVA prior to last year's draft and that was why I wanted the Ravens to stay away from him). The Pats also have ZERO talent at the safety positions. They let Merriweather go, which in retrospect wasn't a great idea, and Patrick Chung has been in and out with injuries all year.


    THAT is why the Packers and Patriots have been less than impressive on the defensive side of the ball. Not because they're gearing more effort to their offenses.
    What are you talking about Wicked? Julian Edelman is turning into a shutdown corner




  7. #19
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    Re: Worst NFL defenses - Packers and Pats

    Quote Originally Posted by Knox Harrington View Post
    What are you talking about Wicked? Julian Edelman is turning into a shutdown corner
    You're right and Matt Slater is turning into the next Ed Reed back there at FS.
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  8. #20

    Re: Worst NFL defenses - Packers and Pats

    I hear you decleetz, but my point is they're both around the middle of the pack in points allowed. to me, points allowed is a much better defensive measure than yards allowed. FootballOutsiders has them at 24th and 26th, and that seems about right. so i revise my earlier statement, they're both in the bottom third of the league on defense, but i still don't think they're the worst defenses in football.




  9. #21

    Re: Worst NFL defenses - Packers and Pats

    I dont think this was suppose to be a debate whether defense is important or not the OP asked if the NFL will change the rules back to a more equal advantage as far as offensive/defensive strength. you can win with a great offense and no defense and you can win with a great defense and mediocre to poor offense. this will probably never change, but when youre talking about the NFL they are obviously gearing towards offense and safety as opposed to advantages to defenses. we might someday soon be talking about a "great" defense that allows a league best 26 points per game. Itll still be considered great because its the best but thats all relative to the era and still just as important as todays and yesteryears NFL.
    -JAB




  10. #22

    Re: Worst NFL defenses - Packers and Pats

    Quote Originally Posted by JAB1985 View Post
    I dont think this was suppose to be a debate whether defense is important or not the OP asked if the NFL will change the rules back to a more equal advantage as far as offensive/defensive strength. you can win with a great offense and no defense and you can win with a great defense and mediocre to poor offense. this will probably never change, but when youre talking about the NFL they are obviously gearing towards offense and safety as opposed to advantages to defenses. we might someday soon be talking about a "great" defense that allows a league best 26 points per game. Itll still be considered great because its the best but thats all relative to the era and still just as important as todays and yesteryears NFL.
    Well put - I agree 100%




  11. #23
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    Re: Worst NFL defenses - Packers and Pats

    I don't see them changing the rules and I hope the Ravens start / continue to take deep shots. More times than not, even if the ball isn't caught there is a good chance of a PI. You gotta try it a few times a game.
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  12. #24
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    Saw this quote by Harbaugh in USAToday
    "it is a passing league. If you look at the rules, the way they're built, the yards are piled up in the passing offense as opposed to the running offense and that's the way you score points"

    Hmmmmm
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