DE draft prospects comparision

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 01-22-2010, 09:27 PM

I am HUGE Brandon Graham fan.

Dude looks and plays like a Lamar Woodley clone.

**edreedisgod20** · 01-22-2010, 11:25 PM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

I am HUGE Brandon Graham fan.

Dude looks and plays like a Lamar Woodley clone.

This.

**baltimore_hokie** · 01-22-2010, 11:45 PM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

I am HUGE Brandon Graham fan.

Dude looks and plays like a Lamar Woodley clone.

Woodley clone? I thought he would be more of a downed lineman, 3-4 DE type. I would lose most of my interest in him if he was going to be another pass rushing OLB.

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 01-23-2010, 01:03 AM

No way is Graham a 3-4 end. You'd basically be taking him away from what he does best...rush on the edge.

He has the exact same body type and playing style as Woodley.

And frankly, I have no idea why you wouldn't want a guy like that on the edge when we struggled so much this year rushing the passer from the edge.

**jonboy79** · 01-23-2010, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

No way is Graham a 3-4 end. You'd basically be taking him away from what he does best...rush on the edge.

He has the exact same body type and playing style as Woodley.

And frankly, I have no idea why you wouldn't want a guy like that on the edge when we struggled so much this year rushing the passer from the edge.

Because I see very little chance we play the 3-4 Next year. We need to move away from drafting lots of tweeners, it used to be a great way to get a passrush, but Mattison seems to prefer the 4 man line.

I think we really need a DT, a penetrating 1 gap, attack dog under tackle.

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 01-23-2010, 11:14 AM

Originally Posted by jonboy79

Because I see very little chance we play the 3-4 Next year. We need to move away from drafting lots of tweeners, it used to be a great way to get a passrush, but Mattison seems to prefer the 4 man line.

I think we really need a DT, a penetrating 1 gap, attack dog under tackle.

Well, if we are going to a 4-3, I guess I can see your point.

I definately don't agree with the thinking process to go to that particular front (I think considering the way the college game has become all about speed, you are automatically eliminating some very good players because of size), but I guess if that is what's happening, then he wouldn't be a great fit.

**jonboy79** · 01-23-2010, 11:31 AM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

Well, if we are going to a 4-3, I guess I can see your point.

I definately don't agree with the thinking process to go to that particular front (I think considering the way the college game has become all about speed, you are automatically eliminating some very good players because of size), but I guess if that is what's happening, then he wouldn't be a great fit.

I strongly prefer the 3-4 from the perspective of our current personnel and that I prefer the formation as a whole. I believe I see the writing on the wall. Eagles part 2. Suggs had his hand in the dirt basically all seasln.

**Jeremiah W** · 01-23-2010, 12:09 PM

The 3-4 vs 4-3 debate rages on year after year with no clear advantage. Players make defenses work not schemes. I prefer the 3-4 vs some teams the 4-3 vs others depending on how good certain O line players are.

When you go nickle or dime it does not matter as much anyway and is more about 4 guys with hands on the ground.

I saw a lot of Suggs and JJ in those situations as the hand on the ground DE, Bannan and Edwards also saw a lot of snaps on those passing downs and they are all tweeners and none of them were very effective true DEs. Pryce was by far the most effective rusher and the only one with legit size, speed and moves. That is why the only potential trade I have been harping on is to get a guy like Peppers. Seymour could have made a huge difference. Some one. There are guys out there that are close to 300 pounds that can get after the Qb through a guy , not just by going around them.

I would like to see our front 7 get smaller and faster but the DEs get bigger. Keep Suggs and JJ as OLBs work on coverage and conditioning and rushing the Qb from a 2 point stance. Slim Nagta, McKinney, Talavou and Gregg down and work on 1 gap moves and crossing stunts, rip, swip and spin moves to get to the Qb, trample the run on the way to the QB or let Ray and teh LBs clean them up. We had 3 bad games vs the run, but the Jets are the only power run team left in the post season. Now to advance, your front 7 needs to be able to cover and pressure with 4 a lot more than they need to stuff the run.

The main reason I like the 3-4 more is because you can better disgiuse your front 7 blitzes, but you can do the same thing from a 4-3. I did not see enough pre snap movement, shifts and games to confuse the protections, and that could help, but really we just need better pass rushers with better ways to beat 1 on 1 blocking. Faster, more consistant pressure on the Qb from the front 4 and all of our secondary issues will be forgotten.

**Rxdoxx** · 01-23-2010, 01:48 PM

I still like the 3-4 but the time that we had freely grabbing the jewels is over.

It is a copy-cat league.

We started back at least with Boulware if not before that. Discovered an amazing way to use tweeners to create a defensive philosophy of chaos and confusion for any O-line.

That era is over. Look no further than last year's draft. We had a lot of discussion on possible players to draft, and we watched the tweeners all get grabbed before they fell to us. Talking about DE in college that project as a possible LB, Orakpo, Larry English, Robert Ayers were all gone well before we hit the clock.
You could say that before we were copied so heavily, shift that draft back maybe 7-8 years and at least 2 of those 3 would have been there for us if we wanted them.

Now in some ways we throw a lot of rotational beef on the DL to keep them fresh, and look like a 4-3 more often than not. So the need/discussions now come up for a true DE or a brick wall DT who can push.

Face it, the beast DE are gone very very early, I don't have much hope of us getting one. I'm left with looking at tweeners and anticipating ScoNo's breakdown of DT to see what might be there (if we draft D in the 1st).
I don't know enough yet to make any decision on where or who I'd like to see us really get. Still gathering processing info, and threads like this help a lot.

**CRZA938** · 01-23-2010, 02:29 PM

First of all, thanks ScoNo for putting these together. I appreciate it.

Originally Posted by Jeremiah W

I think more than even a true DE we need more pass rush and pocket crushing from the DL. It looks like they will let Edwards and Bannan at least test the market and they do have McCkinney, Talavou and Divins, but still need a pass rushing DT or two to take over for Pryce. So the need is front 4 pass rush, and there are some DTs that look like they may be the BPA at #25.

Dunlap has that kind of size as does Wooten. Geathers from SC is supposd to be a day 2 early with upside and relatives who were or are really good.

Dt is a little more interesting to me than DE so far @the 25th pick there are some pretty big time guys like Williams from UT that could be on the board.

I agree. Larger DE's or DT's should be our focus if we go this route. That said, and this should come as no surprise, but we need to load up on offensive weapons.

This is not only becuase of a lack of talent, but the way the league rules now reward passing offenses and penalize tough, tenacious defenses.

**Sua Sponte** · 01-24-2010, 12:59 PM

I agree WR definently needs to be #1, but you never know with Ozzie.

Did anyone watch the Shrine Bowl yesterday (East vs West).
I missed the first half because I was at a Birthday Party, but the second half I watched and had some good notes.

First i'll address WR. No real big names, the only guys I seen in the second half doing anything was and the only stats were Blair White and Freddie Barnes

White (MSU)looked good 7-93
Barnes (BG) had a few nice grabs with good coverage on him 4-40

TE Quarless (Penn St)made a awesome one handed grab on a hook route.
TE Dennis Pitta (BYU)

Now to the thread topic.

Greg Hardy (DE, Ole Miss) looked really good, i guess they don't track stats for Def. players but I know in the second half he had a Sack, TFL, and chased down a QB after getting double teamed in the middle of the field (which he held his ground on) ran all the way to the sideline and held the QB to a 2-3 yard gain (impressive speed and awareness).

thats about all i got out this game.

**NC Raven** · 01-24-2010, 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by ScoNo

Greg Hardy (DE, Ole Miss) looked really good, i guess they don't track stats for Def. players but I know in the second half he had a Sack, TFL, and chased down a QB after getting double teamed in the middle of the field (which he held his ground on) ran all the way to the sideline and held the QB to a 2-3 yard gain (impressive speed and awareness).

Hardy has been setting up to be a real value pick for somebody. His stock should rise over the next three months, though. I think he could be one of the big "buzz" guys right before the draft. Right now most of the mocks have him lower than what he'll probably end up going. Coming into the 09 season he was viewed as a borderline top 10 draft choice. Anybody who gets him at 20 or later should be getting very nice value.