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  1. #16

    Re: Putin warns US about Socialism.



    Quote Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne View Post
    education, health care, roads highways, social security, education, etc etc etc.

    i don't need to pick up a history book.
    Public Education in the US, huge success there...
    Health care, been there done that, had that argument, the best healthcare in the world is available right arond the corner from us.
    Social Security is the biggest failure in the entire government. Private industry performs similar type services 10 times as efficiently, on average.

    You listed basically every portion of the government that needs lots of work.

    Name me a fully socialistic society that has succeeded for a long time.




  2. #17
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    Re: Putin warns US about Socialism.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonboy79 View Post
    Public Education in the US, huge success there...
    Health care, been there done that, had that argument, the best healthcare in the world is available right arond the corner from us.
    Social Security is the biggest failure in the entire government. Private industry performs similar type services 10 times as efficiently, on average.

    You listed basically every portion of the government that needs lots of work.

    Name me a fully socialistic society that has succeeded for a long time.
    social security is not a failure. many people out there are retired on their savings and s.s. combined. 401k's are more of a failure right now than s.s. as 401k's disappear more will rely on s.s.

    no one is suggesting that the u.s. will become a "fully socialistic society". you are taking an argument for socialized elements of society to an absurd extreme to diminish it's utility. there is no such thing as a fully socialistic society as there is no such thing as a fully capitalist society. Obama is neither a socialist nor wanting a fully socialist society.

    the ironic thing is that the people on this board that argue the most about the benefits of socialism are myself and Roch. We are self-employed...we have our own businesses...we are truly entreprenuers. we create our own wealth and we understand the benefits of forms of socialism.

    the conservatives on this board, from what I have gathered, have been government employees and/or employed by others. you really don't have real world experiences depending fully on yourself to pay your way through the world.

    Roch and I are liberals, believe in the benefits of socialized programs and add independently to the wealth of this country through our own businesses. Its not like we are sitting back taking hand outs...We are the wealth generators that you conservatives are so adamantly defending as truly American.

    isn't it ironic...








  3. #18

    Re: Putin warns US about Socialism.

    Hmmm you should not have guessed. You were wrong again like normal.
    I currently own my own business. Have in the past, will in the future. My family's wealth was created by my Father's business. I worked for people for a few years to gain real life experience.




  4. #19
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    Re: Putin warns US about Socialism.

    [QUOTE=TRAP;141733]
    Quote Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne View Post


    But he knew enough to kick your ass in here and even shut you up for a while.

    Once again, even in here Galen says nothing. He cant even run good smack

    Go to Perez Hilton's blog Galen. Its gay.
    Trap you are seriously delusional!








  5. #20

    Re: Putin warns US about Socialism.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonboy79 View Post
    Public Education in the US, huge success there...
    Health care, been there done that, had that argument, the best healthcare in the world is available right arond the corner from us.
    Social Security is the biggest failure in the entire government. Private industry performs similar type services 10 times as efficiently, on average.

    You listed basically every portion of the government that needs lots of work.

    Name me a fully socialistic society that has succeeded for a long time.
    Private sector health care, in this country is the exact opposite of efficiency. Outdated modes of recordkeeping, and non health educated people telling doctors what methods by which to treat patients. Spending millions of dollars to create delightful sounding names to medicine... Viagra people spent hundreds of millions just to come up with a name that would be attractive to the general public, at the same time driving up the price. So, something that costs fitty cents to make costs 5 bucks a pop. That's efficient? Some things are just different. If I can afford to buy a canoe to recreate in, then I buy a canoe. If someone else can afford to buy a yacht to recreate in, so be it.. Some things SHOULD be commensurate to our rate of earnings, but basic health care, and education should not. Our future is our people, and the future gets a little dimmer if only the wealthy survive, and become educated.
    Intelligence, genius, is not partial, nor bigoted. It appears in the rich and the poor, and should be harvested from all.
    Social Security is NOT the biggest failure of this country(Granted, it needs improvement, because time have changed). It was created in a time when ONLY the wealthy had ANY provision for retirement, the working people were just shit out of luck.. The Getty's and the Rockefellers were using them as slaves, 16 hour days, unworkable conditions, and slave wages.. They were barely able to feed themselves, much less save for retirement, and the responsibility fell on our gov't to care for them. It was a good idea, and worked splendidly, but it has become outdated.... At least it is not affected by the greed of the stockmarket players. I, for one, am tired of insurance companies running the world, making all the rules. If you really have your own business, you understand that point, at least.
    I employ over 100 people, and every year we are shopping our insurance coverage, every year our premiums take astronomical jumps, every year we must cut to make insurance affordable for our employees, while trying to stay competitive in our field, every year we must make decisions about whether to terminate an employee because a pre-existing condition makes the rates for everyone double. Where is the fairness in that?




  6. #21

    Re: Putin warns US about Socialism.

    Things will be even worse when a non-health educated person also now has a quota list to decide how to work on you...

    Tort reform is the single biggest barrier to efficiency in our health system.

    How are you going to enjoy it when none of us have the choice of whether to buy a canoe or a yacht becuase we are wondering when we can afford to have beef for our family instead of the normal chicken.

    Even after the stock market crash 401k's are no worse off then SSI. SSI is more then half(income) overhead, less then half payout. I good 401k has an administration in the range of a percent, OF EARNINGS.


    You will have the same problems tenfold if the government gets involved in healthcare, instead of shopping around however, you'll simply be forced to take what is offerred as there will be no choices. The costs will continue to increase astronomically.




  7. #22

    Re: Putin warns US about Socialism.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonboy79 View Post
    Things will be even worse when a non-health educated person also now has a quota list to decide how to work on you...

    Tort reform is the single biggest barrier to efficiency in our health system.

    How are you going to enjoy it when none of us have the choice of whether to buy a canoe or a yacht becuase we are wondering when we can afford to have beef for our family instead of the normal chicken.

    Even after the stock market crash 401k's are no worse off then SSI. SSI is more then half(income) overhead, less then half payout. I good 401k has an administration in the range of a percent, OF EARNINGS.


    You will have the same problems tenfold if the government gets involved in healthcare, instead of shopping around however, you'll simply be forced to take what is offerred as there will be no choices. The costs will continue to increase astronomically.
    Yes, I said that SS was outdated, and should be re-thought. However, I have lost over half of my retirement account in the last 4 months.. At least I still have my regular SS benefits intact.




  8. #23

    Re: Putin warns US about Socialism.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rochardrik View Post
    Yes, I said that SS was outdated, and should be re-thought. However, I have lost over half of my retirement account in the last 4 months.. At least I still have my regular SS benefits intact.
    But what you are not thinking about, is that if SSI was run as efficiently as your 401k, your benefits would be SEVERAL times higher. Less then half the money collected by SSI goes into receipients hands. Fewer then 3% from 401k's go into administration fees.




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