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  1. #73

    Re: Harbs has lost this team



    [QUOTE=Goode05;1311696]Yesterday they kneeled before the anthem and then stood for it what r u talking about


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    Lol

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    Last edited by HbgPARavenfan; 10-02-2017 at 10:29 PM.
    113 Receptions 889 Yards -Kyle Juszcyk (targets = 155, 73% catch rate).

    40 receptions 553 yards. - #11 (targets = 94, 43% catch rate)





  2. #74
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    Re: Harbs has lost this team

    Quote Originally Posted by PalladinInNC View Post
    A good while ago I said that a SB winning coach deserves 3 straight years of not making the playoffs before he is fired. This year will be year No. 3 and Harbs should be fired. Let's try to take feelings out of this for a minute and look at the situation in cold, hard facts:

    1. The amount of injuries that the team has had for years. I do not care what excuses are thrown around. When it occurs every year that is a reflection on either coaching or picking players that are consistently injury prone. I think it is a bit of both but I think that is on Harbs and his coaches more so than the players picked. A number of the players consistently injured did not have that rep in college. They join the Ravens and they suddenly become injury prone. That's not a coincidence!

    2. Harbs problem with picking good coaches. This has been his fatal flaw for years. Marty and Pees are just another example of this. Don't forget Cam and Mattison in the past. The last really good defensive coach he had was Pagano. This will not get any better when/if they are gone. He will just keep picking average/bad coaches.

    3. Scheme for defense/offense. He does not adapt to changes either during the game or to overall change across the league and hires coaches with similar viewpoints. The 2000 Ravens defense is gone but we still want to run the ball, play tough defense, and win close 13-10 games. Those days are gone and most teams (even bad teams know it). He does not!

    4. Who plays and who doesn't play. He has a blind spot for veterans and certain players who cannot play. Campy, Hurst, etc. should have been gone years ago. Other draft busts are held onto for too long. Elam, Brooks, Brown one year. Now Correa, Perryman, etc. another year.

    5. No correction of problems year after year after year. The misuse of challenges. Not utilizing players to maximize their strengths or misusing players by playing them out of their positions (Kruger, and Elam for examples).

    Bisciotti is a pretty good owner and he is also willing to make hard business decisions when necessary even if it costs him money. He did it with Billick after extending his contract. I think he'll do it with Harbs if this team really crashes and burns. Empty seats in a stadium will do that and it is starting to happen. Harbs will either be gone after this year or next year despite the extension of his contract.

    Now what needs to be done to correct the problem?

    Well, of course you clean house. However, that does not include Ozzie. Yes he is not the greatest in picking offensive talent. However, he picks talent in relation to what his coaches say they need along with input from Harbs. The failure on the offensive side might change if you have better coaching with coaches that can provide Ozzie with better input. It sure did work when they had Kubiak (the best OC that they ever had).

    First, you get a new coaching staff with young talented coaches. Next, and this is very important, if the Ravens really bomb this year and fall into the top ten for the draft, the most important thing they need to do is draft a new QB. This team is not a player or two away from being a playoff team. Despite how the defense looks right now, they do have the defensive talent (although they do need to get a young FS in the future). With new defensive coaches, it will be fine. It is the offense (which we all know already that is the problem). Drafting a top OT, OG, and RB in the first three rounds in 2018 will not solve the problem (although if Harbs and Company are still around, that is what they will want to do). It's time for Joe to be replaced.

    I like Joe, but he has regressed to the point that you can usually tell when a QB can no longer be a starter no matter who the coach is or who the players are around him. It's happened to so many others (Mark Brunell, Jake Delhomme, Carson Palmer, etc.). With his contract he cannot be cut until after next year, I believe, or the cap hit will be insane. Draft a QB this year and have him learn for a year under Joe and then in 2019 move the guy into the starting role and either move Joe to the backup position or just cut him.

    I've been an optimistic Ravens supporter for a long time and I know this year will be a long one to go through. However, if Bisciotti does what has to be done, this team will turn around quickly. Ozzie has already done it twice before (2003 and 2008). He can do it again!
    You are spot on. I do disagree about Cam though. Cam was the right man for the job in 2008. I think he just didn't evolve enough to stay the man for the job. The players changed and out grew him and he didn't adjust. Harbaugh's failure was realizing it a season to late.





  3. #75

    Re: Harbs has lost this team

    "Lost" is probably the correct word. Let's ask the next question: Who did he lose it to? Put differently: Who has ownership of this team? Suggs? Flacco? Weddle? (Steve Smith?)

    A quiet tenant -- possession but not ownership.
    A dutiful onsite handyman -- reliable, has possession, knows what the owner wants, but is not the owner.
    An absentee landlord -- passively collects rent, doesn't much care about the property.
    An entrepreneur developer -- sees the potential, puts in the sweat equity, scrimps and saves to make capital improvements, looks for investors who buy-in.

    Throughout Harbaugh's tenure he has, to his credit, done a good job of ridding the team of the absentee-landlord type player. Michael Huff comes to mind. But when it comes to the entrepreneur owner -- we've had to import those players. Boldin, Smith, Weddle -- finished products brought in to lead by example. But no (few) homegrown stakeholder i.e. Ben Cartwright, Ponderosa owner.

    Instead, it's been quiet tenants and dutiful handymen. Role players like Justin Bannan, Lawrence Guy, Corey Graham, Josh Wilson, and Paul Kruger are the home-grown or imported quiet tenants: short timers who just filled a role. As for the dutiful handymen: Jimmy Smith, Lardarius Webb, Rick Wagner, CJ Mosley, and (sadly, so it would seem) Joe Flacco. They care. They do their job. They are good at their job. But they seem to lack that something extra. There's an edge that's missing. Maybe that edge comes from knowing you are a superior talent. Perhaps those players don't talk the talk because they don't think they can walk the walk.

    Make no mistake about it, this team has been decimated by injuries. Yanda's loss is probably the proverbial bridge-too-far. They likely won't be able to sustain a running game. Without a running game they probably can't play the complementary football they were hoping a revitalized defense (and defensive identity) would allow.

    Perhaps they were hoping that a heavy investment in defense would create an attitude, a dominating attitude, and with it they would have or develop dominating personalities. But I don't think that's going to happen this year. Moreover, I question whether it's in Harbaugh's ability to nurture and develop players with that kind of personality.

    Want them? Yes.
    Import them? Yes.
    Grow them at home? I...I don't know.

    So, has he lost the team? I kind of hope so because I want to see who fills the vacuum.





  4. #76

    Re: Harbs has lost this team

    Quote Originally Posted by JAB1985 View Post
    because he dropped the ball and Flacco was INTs twice by exceptional plays by the defense.

    its a little different situation, even if I get your overall point.
    Ugh. Regardless of whether they were nice INTS they were still both brutal inadvisable throws that never should have left his hand. Reaching real hard on that one, as current Flacco defenders must.

    I really really hope he turns it around but absolving him of his piss poor play so far is getting silly around here





  5. #77

    Re: Harbs has lost this team

    Palladin is spot on imo. Points 2 and 4 are the biggest problems that are directly tied to Harbaugh. His hiring of staff has been atrocious since 2011, save for one year of Kubiak. And 4 is probably my biggest gripe, they keep sticking rookies in the wrong spots because there’s some dwindling veteran in the way at their natural position. Jensen should have taken over for Zuttah last year. The Correa thing is dumb as hell. Kruger was never given a shot until his last year. There’s so many examples, it’s been a constant problem with Harbaugh and I think it’s negatively affected the way the picks have been able to develop.





  6. #78

    Re: Harbs has lost this team

    Time to get us some JIM BOB COTTER





  7. #79
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
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    Chapel Hill, NC
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    Cool Re: Harbs has lost this team

    Quote Originally Posted by JonAB View Post
    Palladin is spot on imo. Points 2 and 4 are the biggest problems that are directly tied to Harbaugh. His hiring of staff has been atrocious since 2011, save for one year of Kubiak. And 4 is probably my biggest gripe, they keep sticking rookies in the wrong spots because thereís some dwindling veteran in the way at their natural position. Jensen should have taken over for Zuttah last year. The Correa thing is dumb as hell. Kruger was never given a shot until his last year. Thereís so many examples, itís been a constant problem with Harbaugh and I think itís negatively affected the way the picks have been able to develop.
    Thanks gang!

    I usually do not write long analyses on these threads and just put up snarky jokes for amusement. However, when I do put up analyses of the Ravens stuff I try to keep out the emotions and try to evaluate the situation on the facts presented. I have the experience. I'm a retired Federal auditor/analyst and to do it properly you have to look at facts and not just assume something!

    Everyone has a shelf life on ability (even the Patriots' BB).

    Harbs shelf life on the Ravens is about done!





  8. #80
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    Re: Harbs has lost this team

    playing the CEO monday presser right now, he annoys me.





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