Cincinnati Attendance

[GirlsKickButt]

If this D keeps up the almost dominate performances, M&T will be filled and rockin' again.

I have a feeling that we will see M&T rock again this season.

[21xxxv]

And saying "I did notice a lot of empty seats" is not remotely the same as saying "a few no-shows".

Dude-, I mean zero harm or insult. I just meant that having 10-15k, solid empty seats is much different than having pockets of purple when the team isn't relevant. Opening Day will not be that way in B'More, regardless of who the Ravens play. Have a great day!

[GreenWave52]

The attendance problem is real. Not in every city, but it is a league wide concern.

I was speaking to a friend who works on the business side of a team (not Ravens) and they think eventually ticket prices will start going the other direction (cheaper), but the league will make up for it in digital revenue.

[BcRaven]

The attendance problem is real. Not in every city, but it is a league wide concern.

I was speaking to a friend who works on the business side of a team (not Ravens) and they think eventually ticket prices will start going the other direction (cheaper), but the league will make up for it in digital revenue.

I'm not a revenue expert or CPA, but doesn't the NFL make it's bulk of income from TV earnings and gear sales (to a lesser extent)? While I'm sure they'd like attendance to be high (with parking, beer and hot dog sales, and the like), does lower ticket sales impact their income that much? ... Bc

[52N19]

i figured out the economics of NFL stadium profit when we had a box at a falcons game against the lions when they were fighting for a playoff spot. this was a long time ago when iron head hayward and jeff george played for the falcons.

the stadium was less then half full but atlanta has two stories of boxes that circle the whole stadium and every box was full. i had no interest in the game so i walked around the corridor to see the names on all of the boxes. it was a who's who of fortune 500 companies of which atlanta has a ton of. however, that recipe won't work in baltimore where there is not one fortune 500 company.

in baltimore its the individual fan or bust.

[HKusp]

I have been on both sides of this issue. I had seasons tickets from 2005-2009 and a great tailgate, never missed a home game those years until the last game of the '09 season Bears game, the Ravens had already made the playoff's, and it had snowed almost 20 inches the day before the game and I plow. $90+ an/hour or go to the game....I decided to make the money. Then the next few years I went to a few games a season but stayed home for at least half, telling myself it was cheaper and a better experience at home on HD. The thing is, TV coverage is so ball-centric, and I am a fan of more than what is happening around the ball. The stadium experience is awesome to see the ENTIRE game, something that the regular TV coverage doesn't provide. I am a season ticket holder these last 2 seasons again, and I prefer it.

[ERey]

I have been on both sides of this issue. I had seasons tickets from 2005-2009 and a great tailgate, never missed a home game those years until the last game of the '09 season Bears game, the Ravens had already made the playoff's, and it had snowed almost 20 inches the day before the game and I plow. $90+ an/hour or go to the game....I decided to make the money. Then the next few years I went to a few games a season but stayed home for at least half, telling myself it was cheaper and a better experience at home on HD. The thing is, TV coverage is so ball-centric, and I am a fan of more than what is happening around the ball. The stadium experience is awesome to see the ENTIRE game, something that the regular TV coverage doesn't provide. I am a season ticket holder these last 2 seasons again, and I prefer it.

That's a great point. As an avid football fan I like to see what's going on away from the ball, like the alignment of the safeties. Or what's happening on the sidelines. The routes of the receivers and not just who caught the ball. And the cheerleaders (the female ones). You can't see any of that on TV.

[bravens23]

I'm not a revenue expert or CPA, but doesn't the NFL make it's bulk of income from TV earnings and gear sales (to a lesser extent)? While I'm sure they'd like attendance to be high (with parking, beer and hot dog sales, and the like), does lower ticket sales impact their income that much? ... Bc

Correct. Actual game tickets sales is the #3 highest revenue source for the NFL. TV revenue from network subscriptions is by far the biggest revenue stream (basically they make the most money off people that stay at home and watch on TV) and merchandise sales is #2.

I've long said this... realistically, the ideal NFL fan from the NFL's perspective is a guy who buys a jersey and has a TV provider service that watches the game at home on TV every week. That person is the NFL's biggest money maker.

The other thing to consider is that an empty seat doesn't necessarily reflect a non-purchased seat. It just means that whoever purchased the ticket didn't attend the game. In general, NFL teams are only going to care so much about empty seats as to when it becomes noticeable from a non-paid seat perspective. For a lot of these teams, hundreds or even thousands of seats are bought for every home game by secondary market re-sellers, meaning the team has already made the money they set out to make for the seat.

I think you'll see a combination of two things happening in the near future:

1. Newer football stadiums will be smaller, relative to the seating capacity. We're already seeing this...

Atlanta Falcons new stadium has a capacity of 65,000, which is down from 80,000 in the Georgia dome.
Minnesota Vikings new stadium has a capacity of roughly 67,000, which is just slightly higher capacity than the Metro Dome.
New York Giants/Jets new stadium has a capacity of 80,000, which is basically the same as the old Meadowlands.
49ers new stadium has a capacity of 68,000, which is just under what old Candlestick Park is.

So ask yourself... why would an enterprise that seemingly prints money not being building monstrosity size stadiums to try to attract as many customers as possible? Answer... they don't want more people. They want wealthier people.

2. Ticket prices MAY drop, if stadiums across the league actually start to feel the pinch. BUT... I don't think you'll see anything noticeable there for awhile. If anything, you may see bigger price swings between premium and non-premium seating. You may see lower bowl seats see a 2x spike, while upper deck seats may become a lot cheaper.

[21xxxv]

Correct. Actual game tickets sales is the #3 highest revenue source for the NFL. TV revenue from network subscriptions is by far the biggest revenue stream (basically they make the most money off people that stay at home and watch on TV) and merchandise sales is #2.

I've long said this... realistically, the ideal NFL fan from the NFL's perspective is a guy who buys a jersey and has a TV provider service that watches the game at home on TV every week. That person is the NFL's biggest money maker.

The other thing to consider is that an empty seat doesn't necessarily reflect a non-purchased seat. It just means that whoever purchased the ticket didn't attend the game. In general, NFL teams are only going to care so much about empty seats as to when it becomes noticeable from a non-paid seat perspective. For a lot of these teams, hundreds or even thousands of seats are bought for every home game by secondary market re-sellers, meaning the team has already made the money they set out to make for the seat.

I think you'll see a combination of two things happening in the near future:

1. Newer football stadiums will be smaller, relative to the seating capacity. We're already seeing this...

Atlanta Falcons new stadium has a capacity of 65,000, which is down from 80,000 in the Georgia dome.
Minnesota Vikings new stadium has a capacity of roughly 67,000, which is just slightly higher capacity than the Metro Dome.
New York Giants/Jets new stadium has a capacity of 80,000, which is basically the same as the old Meadowlands.
49ers new stadium has a capacity of 68,000, which is just under what old Candlestick Park is.

So ask yourself... why would an enterprise that seemingly prints money not being building monstrosity size stadiums to try to attract as many customers as possible? Answer... they don't want more people. They want wealthier people.

2. Ticket prices MAY drop, if stadiums across the league actually start to feel the pinch. BUT... I don't think you'll see anything noticeable there for awhile. If anything, you may see bigger price swings between premium and non-premium seating. You may see lower bowl seats see a 2x spike, while upper deck seats may become a lot cheaper.

Which is why there is football in LA.

[BcRaven]

Correct. Actual game tickets sales is the #3 highest revenue source for the NFL. TV revenue from network subscriptions is by far the biggest revenue stream (basically they make the most money off people that stay at home and watch on TV) and merchandise sales is #2.

I've long said this... realistically, the ideal NFL fan from the NFL's perspective is a guy who buys a jersey and has a TV provider service that watches the game at home on TV every week. That person is the NFL's biggest money maker.

The other thing to consider is that an empty seat doesn't necessarily reflect a non-purchased seat. It just means that whoever purchased the ticket didn't attend the game. In general, NFL teams are only going to care so much about empty seats as to when it becomes noticeable from a non-paid seat perspective. For a lot of these teams, hundreds or even thousands of seats are bought for every home game by secondary market re-sellers, meaning the team has already made the money they set out to make for the seat.

I think you'll see a combination of two things happening in the near future:

1. Newer football stadiums will be smaller, relative to the seating capacity. We're already seeing this...

Atlanta Falcons new stadium has a capacity of 65,000, which is down from 80,000 in the Georgia dome.
Minnesota Vikings new stadium has a capacity of roughly 67,000, which is just slightly higher capacity than the Metro Dome.
New York Giants/Jets new stadium has a capacity of 80,000, which is basically the same as the old Meadowlands.
49ers new stadium has a capacity of 68,000, which is just under what old Candlestick Park is.

So ask yourself... why would an enterprise that seemingly prints money not being building monstrosity size stadiums to try to attract as many customers as possible? Answer... they don't want more people. They want wealthier people.

2. Ticket prices MAY drop, if stadiums across the league actually start to feel the pinch. BUT... I don't think you'll see anything noticeable there for awhile. If anything, you may see bigger price swings between premium and non-premium seating. You may see lower bowl seats see a 2x spike, while upper deck seats may become a lot cheaper.

What an excellent breakdown Maybe it's why MLB teams are scaling back on new stadiums too. I live in NYC and the original Shea stadium (built in 1961) was 45,000. The new Citi field (built in 2009) has a capacity of about 42,000. BTW the population in NYC has not shrunk... Bc

[leachisabeast]

Think my rugby game from Saturday had more people in the stands watching than what cincy had Sunday lmao

[The Fanatic]

Wow. Fan throws his hat at Andy Dalton yesterday. LOL

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/09/beng...l-video-ravens

All we need now is Marvin Lewis to have a press conference chastising the fans telling them "You're Not In Cleveland"