Is this too much?

**Ortizer** · 08-13-2017, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by Baltravens

Hi, Are you familiar with genetics as well as DNA? DNA has been used all the time in the courts as evidence convicting one or clearing one. That is science put to work since the early 1990's. Humans, you and I have genes, chromosomes, and DNA.

Google "mapping" genes and you will find the facts that one is NOT born homosexual, but by logical deduction becomes that way through the environment he/she is in. Psychology first saw homosexual behavior as abnormal in 1973, but have since then changed its stance. As a Christian, we are not to judge other people; however, I still hold that the behavior of John or Mary is what we can examine and evaluate. I am conservative, but I still hold homosexual behavior as abnormal and prohibited in the Bible.

I have military ancestry with a hardcore Veteran Marine father. You watch how I could rear a baby born as a boy into a normal Christian adult.

I work in LP observing and documenting actions and behavior. There is no such thing as a person saying, "I have had a hard life THAT CAUSED me to abuse and rape women."

God changed my life at very young age. I bowed down to the Master long ago, and He has given me a virtually perfect life.

Don't make excuses for little Sally's behavior and this false transvestite stuff. One raises a child either to be weak or strong. One thing is for sure, baptize that child in the name of Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit.

...Worship God in this troubled society.

They are discovering new genetic markers and ways genetics and environment interact all the time. I see it as difficult to say all of genetics is understood. My three year old can look at two sentences next to each other and tell me if they look the same. She can't tell what they mean though.

In religious terms though, in a fallen world, I see no reason to think that it would extend to genetics and sexuality.

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**usmccharles** · 08-14-2017, 09:48 AM

Originally Posted by Chuck Williams

First off, I'm not old. I'm 32.

Secondly, we are all bigots. We all have ideas or groups of people who we are not tolerant of. Judging from your post, I imagine you are intolerant of the alt-right, which I am as well.

I'm not racist. Color is only skin deep. Gender is not.

On the subject of racism, I will say that cops unfairly target minorities. By no means am I a Black Lives Matter supporter. To me, they are no different than the Tea Partiers and Berniebots.

Thanks for clarifying your age.

When i asked are you racist, i was just being rhetorical because the mindset of hating a group of people (trans) when you dont know them would believe me to think the same about race. You are free to hate, or publicly chastise who you want, i just see zero logic in that way of thinking, being so close minded. Care to explain what effects a transperson has with how you live your life and why others choices makes has any relevance in your life if it does not directly affect you? Just trying to see your side.

**PerpetuallyBored74** · 08-16-2017, 01:03 PM

Originally Posted by darb72

Incorrect. Studies have found that girls born to women who use a certain fertility drug become lesbians at a 34% rate, compared to the 5% rate that occurs naturally. Being the youngest son in a large family leads to higher rates of homosexuality as well.

This isn't to say that homosexuality is either nature or nurture, but a bit of both.

I believe we will eventually discover the genetic predisposition towards homo/bisexuality now that we are mapping the genome. Maybe then we'll discover what are the environmental/external factors that trigger that predisposition.

Of course, that would also mean we could finally effectively 'cure' homo/bisexuality, by not exposing those with that predisposition to any of those factors.

**darb72** · 08-16-2017, 09:23 PM

Originally Posted by PerpetuallyBored74

I believe we will eventually discover the genetic predisposition towards homo/bisexuality now that we are mapping the genome. Maybe then we'll discover what are the environmental/external factors that trigger that predisposition.

Of course, that would also mean we could finally effectively 'cure' homo/bisexuality, by not exposing those with that predisposition to any of those factors.

This is a distinct possibility, though I personally believe it's more hormonal than genetic. There are, for lack of a better term, shemales who are genetic males but are resistant to male hormones. Androgen insensitivity syndrome (AIS) people develop the physical characteristics of females and live their lives as women. They are attracted to men, get married to males, and often don't discover the truth until after they can't get pregnant.

The fact that they are uniformly "straight", again for lack of a better term, would indicate that hormones and other biological processes in the body have more to do with a person's sexuality. The genetic idea should still be considered, as should any theories that have yet been disproved.

**PerpetuallyBored74** · 08-20-2017, 03:35 AM

Originally Posted by darb72

This is a distinct possibility, though I personally believe it's more hormonal than genetic. There are, for lack of a better term, shemales who are genetic males but are resistant to male hormones. Androgen insensitivity syndrome (AIS) people develop the physical characteristics of females and live their lives as women. They are attracted to men, get married to males, and often don't discover the truth until after they can't get pregnant.

The fact that they are uniformly "straight", again for lack of a better term, would indicate that hormones and other biological processes in the body have more to do with a person's sexuality. The genetic idea should still be considered, as should any theories that have yet been disproved.

Thing is, homo/bisexuality is commonplace throughout the animal kingdom.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homose...ior_in_animals

So, this behavior is far from unnatural. (Not that you said it was)

Disagree about the hormones. Hormones influence libido and secondary characteristics like hair (thick or thin), but not sexual preferences. There are men with low testosterone who are still 100% straight. And guys with huge amounts of testosterone who are as gay as a parade.

In humans, homo/bisexuality seems to be a recessive genetic trait.
Perhaps now that we've mapped the genome we can discover which genes are responsible.
But then that opens up another question, and with it a huge can of worms: what if we gain the capability through genetic re-sequencing to "cure" homo/bisexuality?
Should we?

**Baltravens** · 08-20-2017, 04:26 AM

The nature versus nurture argument in reference to homosexuality has been around for decades in academia; however, there is no proof that genes cause or result in a human being being homosexual.

If you claim that one is born homosexual, please provide the link (evidence) to support your assertion. Without support/evidence, your claim is invalid.

**Ortizer** · 08-20-2017, 03:44 PM

Originally Posted by Baltravens

The nature versus nurture argument in reference to homosexuality has been around for decades in academia; however, there is no proof that genes cause or result in a human being being homosexual.

If you claim that one is born homosexual, please provide the link (evidence) to support your assertion. Without support/evidence, your claim is invalid.

But the converse is also true in that there is no proof there isn't a genetic component

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**Baltravens** · 08-20-2017, 04:07 PM

Originally Posted by Ortizer

But the converse is also true in that there is no proof there isn't a genetic component

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Your statement is a double negative. Could you please restate it to clarify it.

**wickedsolo** · 08-20-2017, 05:38 PM

I don't know if you can really show "nurture" data that influences who we are attracted to.

If that were the case, every guy would be attracted to the same type of women since that's what a majority of media markets towards men.

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**GreatWhiteNorthRaven** · 08-21-2017, 11:36 AM

Originally Posted by wickedsolo

I don't know if you can really show "nurture" data that influences who we are attracted to.

If that were the case, every guy would be attracted to the same type of women since that's what a majority of media markets towards men.

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The scientific is extremely inconclusive and I personally don't think there will ever be decisive evidence.

It took a very long time for us to start identifying things like the social determinants of health in a variety of contexts (mental health, physical health, application to prison populations and recidivism, etc.).

Social sciences are tough in that regard. A variety of factors that are difficult to control for given the nature in which you use the scientific method. It's tough to provide ethical study designs for things such as longitudinal studies that yield the best results.

**Ortizer** · 08-21-2017, 12:22 PM

Originally Posted by Baltravens

Your statement is a double negative. Could you please restate it to clarify it.

The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

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**boller4president** · 08-22-2017, 12:49 PM

Originally Posted by wickedsolo

I don't know if you can really show "nurture" data that influences who we are attracted to.

If that were the case, every guy would be attracted to the same type of women since that's what a majority of media markets towards men.

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I would agree that different people are physically attracted to different things but the idea that one can't overcome those physical attractions is what I have a problem with.

They act like they have no control over their own actions. That they don't choose to act on those attractions is just PC bull. I'm actually physically attracted to one of my coworkers but I choose to not act on that attraction because I have a wife