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  1. #1
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    (Alleged) Russia/Trump Scandal



    Just wanted this to be its own thread.

    Saw on CNN that Mike Flynn will agree to testify only if he's granted immunity.


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  2. #2

    Re: (Alleged) Russia/Trump Scandal






  3. #3
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    Re: (Alleged) Russia/Trump Scandal

    Quote Originally Posted by OhThePossibilities View Post
    Def a lot of smoke.

    Nothing substantial has been reported yet though.


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  4. #4
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    Re: (Alleged) Russia/Trump Scandal

    I've tried my hardest to stay away from the political thread but man. What a freaking clusterfuck.

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  5. #5
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    Re: (Alleged) Russia/Trump Scandal

    I doubt he wants immunity in exchange to throw Trump or others under the bus.

    He wants immunity to save his own ass.





  6. #6
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    Re: (Alleged) Russia/Trump Scandal

    I'm confused by the whole Russia thing. There seems to be such a divide in what is actually right or wrong in terms of communication with Russia.

    I don't think Russia had anything to do with the election - Trump was elected fairly. I do think there's some shit going on, but there's been so many stories I've lost track of it all.

    What a fucking shitshow though.
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  7. #7
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    Re: (Alleged) Russia/Trump Scandal

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatWhiteNorthRaven View Post
    I'm confused by the whole Russia thing. There seems to be such a divide in what is actually right or wrong in terms of communication with Russia.

    I don't think Russia had anything to do with the election - Trump was elected fairly. I do think there's some shit going on, but there's been so many stories I've lost track of it all.

    What a fucking shitshow though.
    I don't agree that Russia didn't impact the election.

    I know for fact that Russian actors connected to their government targeted the RNC and DNC (among several other gov agencies/groups). After they were able to get in (spearphishing) they identified mail servers and high profile computers. Then, they start leaking emails that painted the entire DNC (namely Hillary) in a pretty terrible light. I'm sure the emails in the RNC did the same thing, but for whatever reason, they didn't leak them. I wouldn't be surprised if they did leak them down the road at some point.

    Bottom line, whether directly or indirectly, the information that was leaked and the non-stop news coverage of it absolutely impacted the election. How could it not have? Hillary was always considered to be highly untrustworthy, but the information leaked from the DNC really solidified it. In addition to her, it also showed how corrupt the entire DNC was.

    Now, that's pretty much the extent of it.

    The whole "Russian's hacked the election" phrase is terribly misleading because it implies that Russians hacked into the voting machines/voting system and manipulated vote counts. That would be an impossible task because the US voting system is largely decentralized. Voting machines for me, in Maryland, are different than voting machines for HR in Texas, which are different than voting machines in Kentucky, and so on. There are states that use the same type of voting machines/software, but they're not linked to a central server or anything. So, in order to physically "hack" votes, Russian operatives would have had to go to every state and every voting district to attack individual voting machines.

    So, logically, what would have more impact and easier to achieve? Target voting machines and physical voting systems? Or, target the DNC and leak a bunch of info?

    The question that many, including myself, have is why leak just the DNC stuff? I came to a couple of conclusions...
    1) The stuff they got from the RNC was bland and not scandalous at all (un-fucking-likely).
    2) They weren't able to get into the RNC (don't make me laugh...).
    3) They valued a Trump Presidency more than a Hillary Presidency (Interesting theory and geo-politically, that could make sense).
    4) They did find some pretty damaging info on RNC systems and are holding it as leverage for down the road (Also interesting and not out of the realm of possibilities).
    Disclaimer: The content posted is of my own opinion.

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  8. #8
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    Re: (Alleged) Russia/Trump Scandal

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    I don't agree that Russia didn't impact the election.

    I know for fact that Russian actors connected to their government targeted the RNC and DNC (among several other gov agencies/groups). After they were able to get in (spearphishing) they identified mail servers and high profile computers. Then, they start leaking emails that painted the entire DNC (namely Hillary) in a pretty terrible light. I'm sure the emails in the RNC did the same thing, but for whatever reason, they didn't leak them. I wouldn't be surprised if they did leak them down the road at some point.

    Bottom line, whether directly or indirectly, the information that was leaked and the non-stop news coverage of it absolutely impacted the election. How could it not have? Hillary was always considered to be highly untrustworthy, but the information leaked from the DNC really solidified it. In addition to her, it also showed how corrupt the entire DNC was.

    Now, that's pretty much the extent of it.

    The whole "Russian's hacked the election" phrase is terribly misleading because it implies that Russians hacked into the voting machines/voting system and manipulated vote counts. That would be an impossible task because the US voting system is largely decentralized. Voting machines for me, in Maryland, are different than voting machines for HR in Texas, which are different than voting machines in Kentucky, and so on. There are states that use the same type of voting machines/software, but they're not linked to a central server or anything. So, in order to physically "hack" votes, Russian operatives would have had to go to every state and every voting district to attack individual voting machines.

    So, logically, what would have more impact and easier to achieve? Target voting machines and physical voting systems? Or, target the DNC and leak a bunch of info?

    The question that many, including myself, have is why leak just the DNC stuff? I came to a couple of conclusions...
    1) The stuff they got from the RNC was bland and not scandalous at all (un-fucking-likely).
    2) They weren't able to get into the RNC (don't make me laugh...).
    3) They valued a Trump Presidency more than a Hillary Presidency (Interesting theory and geo-politically, that could make sense).
    4) They did find some pretty damaging info on RNC systems and are holding it as leverage for down the road (Also interesting and not out of the realm of possibilities).
    Yeah when you put it look that I understand what you mean. People seem to frame it more like what you referred to when you say the literal hacking of voting machines. They likely had a role in the email scandal that definitely impacted voters (particularly, created this mantra of getting the crooked career politician out that many voters grabbed onto and ran with).
    Its not whether you get knocked down; its whether you get up.
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  9. #9
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    Re: (Alleged) Russia/Trump Scandal

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatWhiteNorthRaven View Post
    Yeah when you put it look that I understand what you mean. People seem to frame it more like what you referred to when you say the literal hacking of voting machines. They likely had a role in the email scandal that definitely impacted voters (particularly, created this mantra of getting the crooked career politician out that many voters grabbed onto and ran with).
    The whole situation is pretty bad.

    Mike Flynn associated with Russian diplomats? So what? It's not a Logan Act violation (as HR pointed out in the other thread).
    Paul Manafort - that could be a little more interesting, but a guy doesn't get paid $10 mill per year (allegedly) to be careless.
    Jeff Sessions - this seemed completely innocent. At least he did the right thing and recused himself from this investigation.
    Jared Kushner - no idea with this one, but he's been involved with the Trump business lines for a while and we know that Trump has had business dealings in Russia. So, it is possible that Kushner (as well as Trump himself, Ivanka, and many others) had relationships with Russian businessmen.

    That's a lot of people in high administrative positions.

    I just wish Trump had taken the high road to try and get ahead of this. Instead, he's countering everything with the "fake news" label and making some pretty ridiculous claims of "not knowing" anything. Then he creates the whole "illegal wiretapping" scandal, which seemed to be a distraction effort.

    Trump is doing himself no favors at this point. That's why the media and Dems are chomping at the bit to try and "get him".

    According to (Democrat) Adam Schiff, there is evidence linking Trump administration, Russian operatives, and the election. According to Comey, there is evidence, but he hasn't specifically stated whether or not it implicates Trump.

    Thus the smoke (a lot of smoke) and no actual fire yet.
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  10. #10
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    Re: (Alleged) Russia/Trump Scandal

    I really think we are beyond a Logan Act violation. There is a smell of treason in the air. Flynn is going down...hard.


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  11. #11
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    Re: (Alleged) Russia/Trump Scandal

    1. I'm going to make a prediction. This topic will not go away Trumps whole Presidency, however long that may be. And that will happen because we'll never get definitive answers, just a lot of speculation. Cause as Wicked says, there's a lot of smoke just not fire.

    2. Question for you Wicked (trying to educate myself). I remember in an earlier thread you mentioned to Dade that the Russians were better at hacking than the Chinese, cause the Chinese didn't care if you knew it was them and the Russians will make it look like it was someone else ( I believe you used a burglar analogy).

    When you take that in to account, and I just saw this story WikiLeaks release shows how the CIA uses computer code to hide the origins of its hacking attacks and 'disguise them as Russian or Chinese activity' - how is it you say you know the Russians did hack the servers?
    We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid. - Benjamin Franklin





  12. #12
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    (Alleged) Russia/Trump Scandal

    Members of both parties who occupy their respective Intel committees in Congress all seem to agree on two things: that Russia meddled in the election but that the meddling didn't affect the outcome.

    Unless there's stark evidence to the contrary, I don't see how any of us can claim that their efforts did indeed affect the outcome of the election.

    That said, they do need to investigate that and the Trump's camp contacts with Russian officials.

    Comey seems to be up to the task and the House Intel committee seems motivated as well.

    I will reserve judgement until their duties are done.
    Last edited by HoustonRaven; 03-31-2017 at 10:36 AM.





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