What are your doubts about religion/Christianity

[NCRAVEN]

It is my opinion. I've shown how I arrived at that opinion. It may not be 100%, but it makes sense to me and how I interpret the Bible. My opinion isn't some brand new concept either. There are several people that have arrived at the same, or similar, conclusions about who Jesus really was based on all of the things I've listed in this thread.

Can you share those? I'd like to read up on them to see what and why others doubt (as I said when I started the thread).

[blah3]

It is my opinion. I've shown how I arrived at that opinion. It may not be 100%, but it makes sense to me and how I interpret the Bible. My opinion isn't some brand new concept either. There are several people that have arrived at the same, or similar, conclusions about who Jesus really was based on all of the things I've listed in this thread.

But it is not you interpreting the bible. It's completely changing what is said in the bible about Jesus and Rome. Which is next to nothing. That is not interpretation at all.
Interpretation differences are something like 40 years is literally 40 years or a long amount of time.

[HoustonRaven]

People actually use the Bible has a historical reference? Not trying to be snarky, I am genuinely shocked that a work of mostly fiction is used in such manner.

[NCRAVEN]

People actually use the Bible has a historical reference? Not trying to be snarky, I am genuinely shocked that a work of mostly fiction is used in such manner.

That me reminds me of Ricky Bobby. "Saying with all due respect doesn't mean you get to say whatever you want" "it sure as hell does, it's in the Geneva convention". Man, what a funny movie.

Seriously though, I'm not offended I just found that funny.

Regarding the bible. I can't speak for the Old Testament as most of my reading has been on the New Testament. However regarding the Old Testament, it does give a name of place, name of people and roughly a time. Take that for whatever it's worth (if anything).

Regarding the New Testament, from a historical standpoint, it holds up VERY well to scrutiny. And from the standpoint of the period of time it was written about, and to the copies of those documents I believe is it's under 100 years. At least that's what I've read.

Comparing that to other historical people (like Socrates) and writings about them I believe that difference of time is much greater.

[NCRAVEN]

Here is a reasonably logical theory that I have about Jesus's resurrection...

1) Jesus was not liked at all in Jerusalem at that time because he was rebellious against the Roman occupation. He was a revolutionary. The Romans probably looked at Jesus in the same way that the British viewed Sam Adams or the KKK viewed Martin Luther King Jr.
2) Jesus was crucified - a common Roman punishment for a variety of "crimes" - and if the stories are true, then he died on a crucifix or from wounds or from dehydration/starvation.
3) Jesus's body was entombed as per the common practices at that time.
4) Jesus's followers (likely including his wife, Mary Magdalen - yes, I do believe that Mary was Jesus's wife) were able to remove his body from the tomb during the night at some point and did so without anyone knowing.
5) Romans or other residents in the area noticed that Jesus's tomb was opened and when they went inside, he was gone without a trace.
6) Being unable to explain how that happened, the story that Jesus was resurrected and walked out of his tomb was born. And as oral tradition tends to happen, the story became more and more incredible over the years.

Another possibility?

Jesus was never crucified. The whole story is fabricated and used as a mechanism to detail the atrocities incurred by the Roman occupation at that time.

Hey Wicked - Just finished watching "Finding Jesus" on CNN (thought it was okay, nothing great) they do cover Mary Magdalene and "potential" evidence she could have been Jesus wife.

Ultimately the say there's no credible evidence, but thought you may wanna watch it.

[usmccharles]

I just read through this entire thread, really enjoyed the opinions and debates as this subject is always a interesting one.

[HoustonRaven]

I just read through this entire thread, really enjoyed the opinions and debates as this subject is always a interesting one.

Welcome to the forum, Devil Dog!

[usmccharles]

Welcome to the forum, Devil Dog!

Thanks, since BR.com forum section I shutting down I needed a new home.

As far as this topic goes, I am not very well educated on the matter, I grew up in a Jewish family (non-practicing) but for the most part had beliefs, I however do not believe in any form of religion. I just don't see anything logical about the idea of religion outside of a way to control mass thought or instill fear. That being said, I really enjoy learning others points of views and trying to learn more, that's how we grow.

[NCRAVEN]

Thanks, since BR.com forum section I shutting down I needed a new home.

As far as this topic goes, I am not very well educated on the matter, I grew up in a Jewish family (non-practicing) but for the most part had beliefs, I however do not believe in any form of religion. I just don't see anything logical about the idea of religion outside of a way to control mass thought or instill fear. That being said, I really enjoy learning others points of views and trying to learn more, that's how we grow.

Correlation does not equal causation. :)

To your point about not believing in an form of religion, maybe I shouldn't have made the thread about that. I just wanted to know peoples thoughts and doubts about Christianity. I was looking for some real doubts to challenge what I believe, didn't really get any of that, more just folks who haven't given it much though (or so it seemed).

Here is a decent video with some good arguments (not great) for God/Christian view if you care to watch. (GWNR, he also covers the moral argument)

[leachisabeast]

I have a lot of doubts about Christianity, but I feel the same way about any religion.

As HR said, religion was a way for uneducated people (by no fault of their own) to understand the physical world around them.

"Why does the sun come up?"

-God said, let there be light.

-Apollo rides his chariot across the sky every day.

"Why are there different seasons?"

-Persephone travels to the underworld to live with her husband, Hades, during fall and winter. Then, during spring, she comes back to earth from the underworld where she can be with her mother.

Re Jesus, I don't believe that he was the son of God because I honestly am not even sure such a thing exists. I do believe that Jesus, the man, existed. I believe that he was likely a highly evolved and intelligent man. I also believe that he was well versed in multiple cultures (which was unheard of at the time) and there is evidence to suggest that he traveled around the middle east and Mediterranean. But I don't think that there was anything supernatural about him. I just think that one needs to consider that a vast majority of people at that time were uneducated and inexperienced outside of their small bubble, so when someone like Jesus comes along and he knows herbal remedies for ailments, he knows how to brew beer and make wine ("turning water to wine"), he knows how to talk to people, he knows how to organize and accomplish social desires. In a sense, Jesus was not all that different than other revolutionaries throughout history. It's all relative, but if you were to take someone with a highly evolved sense of being and a high intellect and put them in a group of uneducated and unworldly people, that someone is by default going to look supernatural. We saw this during World War 2 when American GI's would land on a remote Pacific island with primitive tribes that had no idea of how big the world actually was off their island. Those tribes truly believed that the American GI's were gods because of their clothes, ships, and aircraft. To them, it was supernatural that American GI's could fly (in an airplane).

I also think that there are so many differing opinions on God, faith, the afterlife...who is really right? Is anyone right? No one knows and I think that telling someone that they're wrong because they believe something different is a terrible thing to do.

What I will say is that having kids and getting older, I have been thinking about my own mortality a little and I would love to think that there is something after this world/life so that when I'm gone, it's not equivalent to turning a light switch off in a room. It's scary and sad all at the same time to think about. But what are you going to do? That's life.

Great great post, this is exactly where I stand on things

[usmccharles]

Correlation does not equal causation. :)

To your point about not believing in an form of religion, maybe I shouldn't have made the thread about that. I just wanted to know peoples thoughts and doubts about Christianity. I was looking for some real doubts to challenge what I believe, didn't really get any of that, more just folks who haven't given it much though (or so it seemed).

My bad on that. But the read was very informative. Even though I lack beliefs in this area, I actually really enjoy reading about it, only way to form a educated opinion is to be informed

[Jsmoove]

haven't been on this side of the fence for a while, some good topics going on here...this is a big topic for me, i often have conversations with others about what to believe anymore lol. I seriously feel like we live in the matrix man, I feel like everything we were told growing were all lies, well the majority of things. I grew up in the church, shit I was even on my churches bible study team, back in the day we would go up against other youths from other churches in a bible knowing competition each year.

As I grew older I started reading more things that weren't accessible to me as kid (as internet was still fairly developing thing and didn't have the flurry of information that we do now). I feel like Jesus was a lie, a made up part of a story derived from teachings of possibly a great person during that time but not as we know him in Christianity (i have my reasons). The bible itself I feel is a lie, while I am not a religious person anymore I still do believe in God and there has to be something higher than us, what made us? or who made us? why are we here? why is the world the way it is? Why don't you do something about all the hurt and pain and injustice? These are questions I have for God.