Watching the Seahawks and missing our attitude

[Captain Silver]

It's funny how he suddenly can't coach when the Ravens lose, where was Ray Lewis great leadership in 2002, 2005, 2007. I love Ray Lewis but his great leadership didn't always fix the Ravens problems in the past.

I didn't say the man can't coach, I said he is to blame when they come out flat and that he needs to reinvent himself and the team into something more than they are. Ray was this team, ask anyone in the NFL, he was the barometer, even when they sucked in years you list, he was still impassioned and played inspired and raised the level of play of those around him, imagine how bad we'd have been without him those years?

I was a big fan of Brian Billick and he could coach, he just had poor luck with the QB's much of which his own doing. That being said we had a swagger, an attitude. That left with Ray. Billick had swagger. John needs to find a swagger, something, because the man can coach, Ray or not, winning a Super Bowl is a tremendous feat that deserves respect and recognition.

That being said, this is the NFL - Not For Long. I get there are injuries, but the team looked listless its last two games, this is the head coaches responsibility. If he can't get these guys to play, then eventually someone else WILL.

3 years of good will left is a lot and I NEVER said he couldn't coach, so go back and re-read what I wrote and READ what I just wrote before you comment.

[Captain Offense]

I agree that there is a "fire in the belly" missing from this team, especially in games where you would expect them to come out and curb-stomp (First game against Bengals, Chargers, the back-to-back games with Bengals and Steelers, Texans). I will not automatically conclude that you need to just bring in chippy guys to solve that problem. The balancing act is extremely difficult because there is a fine line between that emotionally-charged player that can inspire others and when that fire blows up in your face (see Cary Williams on Saturday). Getting those pieces of the puzzle is like getting that vicious dog to protect your property; there is a benefit as long as it does not turn on you.

I have no answer for why this team has not found it inside to at least "look" like they are focused or have a purpose. I would really figure that at this level you should not have to generate guys to do what is necessary and understand the importance of performance, but it appears to be important. In the story about the "mutiny" it was reported that the team shoved back at the idea of full practice after the Houston debacle, got Harbaugh to lighten up and then came out and practiced like garbage - enough for Reed to call them out. If any of that is true, then it would suggest that this team does not have a self-motivating culture for the games that matter. You see some of the guys on this team and that does not seem to make sense, but why else do they fail to show up?

If you have enough prime talent (or an elite one at a prime position), maybe this is not as necessary a factor. If you have a lot of "good" talent, maybe that inspiration becomes more of importance.

[Ravenboy2003]

Watching the Seahawks right now really makes me wish we would have done what we needed to do to repeat in 2002 coming off our first SB win and having a dominating defense like theirs. Really no excuse for that defense not to have won more than one ring. Ozzie couldn't build and offense and Billick couldn't coach what he had to work with.

[BigPlayReceiver]

The Ravens have dealt with so much with the Ray Rice drama being the tip of the iceberg, the fact that this team still has a shot at the playoffs going into week 17 is a mini miracle.

Lots of troof here.

Take away our DB injuries alone and we aren't having lots of conversations like this one.
That "fire" would still be absent IMO, but it would not be indirectly linked to our losing b/c we'd have 2-3 more wins under our belt and maybe even resting cats going into the CLE game.

I'm not dismissing the thread or the OP's point, but Ravens management deliberately chose its culture and atmosphere and John Harbaugh is a large part of that. One day it will change, and maybe it will produce 3 rings in 7 years, but it still may not be what SEA has now; and in that case, who would really give a isht? I do get the spirit of what the OP is saying, I just think that winning takes care of itself.

Carroll is blessed with an excellent GM, a 1-in-a-million QB, a historic defense, and a stadium that demands mayhem. Only but a few fan-bases would not prefer that set up over what they actually have.

[ERey]

I'm guessing aside from the Ravens there are 30 others wishing they had the Seahawks defense. I'm sure if Ozzie could field the 2000 Ravens defense every year for all eternity he would. But life doesn't work that way.

Let's note that even with Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, Terrell Suggs, Haloti Ngata, Chris McAlister and many others in their prime, the Ravens never won another playoff game until Joe Flacco and Ray Rice arrived. It's great to have defense but you need balance.

[JustaslowZ06]

Agree. A game like yesterday in the past and the Ravens MAY have still lost. But they wouldnt have gotten punked like they did. Just no heart out there.

[ERey]

What's odd is the Ravens sucked from '96-'98. They were 8-8 in '99 then won it all in 2000. But they only had one more year with that team until the great purge of 2002. I never really thought about it but that seems odd for a team that was only good for 2 years. Fast forward to 2012 and same thing. They win it all then lose half the team. But the 2013 purge makes sense because they were good from 2006-2012 (minus 2007). The Seahawks don't appear to have this issue. I guess it's all timing depending on how you manage the cap and when you win it all.

[Terpsfan82]

What's odd is the Ravens sucked from '96-'98. They were 8-8 in '99 then won it all in 2000. But they only had one more year with that team until the great purge of 2002. I never really thought about it but that seems odd for a team that was only good for 2 years. Fast forward to 2012 and same thing. They win it all then lose half the team. But the 2013 purge makes sense because they were good from 2006-2012 (minus 2007). The Seahawks don't appear to have this issue. I guess it's all timing depending on how you manage the cap and when you win it all.

That team in 2000 was comprised of mostly veterans, a good bit of whom had been playing together for a few years. Before they came together, they were a group of talented individuals who did not know how to win - that's why it was so important to them to go 8-8 and have their first non losing season as a franchise in '99. They invested heavily in the defense, with 96-98 being horrible defensive teams - through the draft and free agency. Lewis in '96, Boulware in '97, Starks in '98 and McAllister in '99 were the draft picks that put them over the top. But after they won it all, many of the veteran guys were let go so they could bring in Elvis Grbac. The rest is history.

[ERey]

That team in 2000 was comprised of mostly veterans, a good bit of whom had been playing together for a few years. Before they came together, they were a group of talented individuals who did not know how to win - that's why it was so important to them to go 8-8 and have their first non losing season as a franchise in '99. They invested heavily in the defense, with 96-98 being horrible defensive teams - through the draft and free agency. Lewis in '96, Boulware in '97, Starks in '98 and McAllister in '99 were the draft picks that put them over the top. But after they won it all, many of the veteran guys were let go so they could bring in Elvis Grbac. The rest is history.

ugh.. Elvis Grbac. Kyle Boller was not the worst move in team history. It was Elvis Grbac.

[esmd]

The Seahawks are the '00-'06 Ravens defense with a good offense. Now we see what we missed. What could've been if we'd had a Russell Wilson back then. Oh well.

And using the Seahawks and their swagger to bash Harbaugh is pretty silly, IMO. The Ravens front 7 has plenty of swagger. It's the crippled back end that doesn't. Maybe if we had a secondary like Seattle we'd be able to have more swagger. But when we're running out there what we're running out there, it is what it is. And on offense, hey, look around, we don't have an abundance of playermakers. Just look at our skill players. We have Joe, who is a top 10 QB, and then what? An in his twilight Steve Smith, a letdown in Torrey Smith, Owen Daniels, a nice player in his time but also in his twilight, and Forsett, who came off the scrap heap.

Anyway, as for the Seahawks, they're good, really good, and they know it. Good for them. Now the Ravens have to work on getting to that level on both sides of the ball. Oh, and btw, let's see how the Seahawks do when they have to pay Wilson and Lynch. Plus Sherman, Chancellor, and all the other guys they have that will want $$$$.

[ThisGirlBleedsPurple]

I'm guessing aside from the Ravens there are 30 others wishing they had the Seahawks defense. I'm sure if Ozzie could field the 2000 Ravens defense every year for all eternity he would. But life doesn't work that way.

Seahawks do have a monster defense but keep in mind they haven't had to mortgage their salary cap on a huge Russell Wilson contract yet so they had the ability to retain some great players post Superbowl. Wait until they have to pay Wilson along with some other contracts and let's see what type of team they are able to field. I guarantee they won't look as scary as they do now. Wilson is only costing them a little over $817,000 currently.

[Captain Silver]

What is being misconstrued here is swagger vs. sleepwalking. Fact, the team doesn't realize it is in a goddamn football game till, oh about the 3rd quarter.