The 2-Minute Drill

**Greg** · 08-18-2006, 10:53 PM

I don't care that the refs F'd up, we were on the 17. What is the point of the run. Either kill the clock with a spike or throw it into the end zone. The only thing positive that the running play could give beyond a FG try would be a TD. What are the odds of running one in from 17 yards out? And if Musa gets close but doesn't quite get in there wouldn't have been time to spike the ball after the run. IT MAKES NO SENSE, NONE!

**Ravenatic20** · 08-18-2006, 10:59 PM

Originally Posted by Greg

I don't care that the refs F'd up, we were on the 17. What is the point of the run. Either kill the clock with a spike or throw it into the end zone. The only thing positive that the running play could give beyond a FG try would be a TD. What are the odds of running one in from 17 yards out? And if Musa gets close but doesn't quite get in there wouldn't have been time to spike the ball after the run. IT MAKES NO SENSE, NONE!

I agree. A pop up to Heap in the end zone, or just a simple spike would have made the most sense to me.

**crowdog89** · 08-18-2006, 11:09 PM

Not to mention the TO we called when McNair slid at the 25. They spotted it at the 27 which at first I thought was good, but then on the replay you could see he should have been spotted at the 25, that is where the ball landed when he slid.

Greg, I believe that when a qb slides, it's not where the ball lands, but where the slide begins where the ball is marked. That's my understanding of the rule anyway.

**Greg** · 08-18-2006, 11:21 PM

Greg, I believe that when a qb slides, it's not where the ball lands, but where the slide begins where the ball is marked. That's my understanding of the rule anyway.

Correct, but when he slid the ball landed on the 25, at least that is what it looked like on the big boards. In any case, why not challenge, the worst that could have happened was...WE LOSE THE SAME TO WE USED!

Now I only saw one replay at the game and you know how good those are, but that's the way it appeared.

**DeepPurple** · 08-19-2006, 04:03 PM

I would like Billick or Fassel to answer, even if we had made the two yards and a first down, what was the upside? Anything short of the endzone wasn't going to cut it, this isn't college where they stop the clock on a first down.

There was only three choices that could of been made; 1) bring out the field goal unit and kick on third down while the clock was running 2) spike the ball on third down and bring out the field goal unit on fourth down while the clock was stopped 3) pass to the endzone on third down and if not successful kick field goal on fourth down. The option of running up the middle on third down with no timeouts and the clock running with 16 seconds shouldn't of even entered the equation.

**Ravens0587** · 08-19-2006, 04:10 PM

I think the clock doesn't stop on first downs in college anymore

**Hrafn** · 08-19-2006, 04:57 PM

No doubt our two minute drill sucks, but I am willing to let this one slide on account that it is the preseason.

The fact that both Billick and Stover in a sideline interview during the 3rd quarter both blamed it on the refs, changing the ball instead of spotting the ball used on 3rd down as they are supposed to. According to Stover they call it a Bingo play and are supposed to execute in 18 seconds. That they have a name for it indicates that it is something that they practise and have there for a reason.

Let me give you an example. We're down by 3, 30 seconds to go in the 4th. 3rd down and a bit to go at at the 30-somthing yard line and are out of time outs. We need to get a little closer or get it to the right hash mark to give Matt a better chance. This is the drill we need to have down and pratice in a live situation. Think regular season game or even playoff. Would be sad if we hadn't practised it in the preseason.

Another reason that make me believe that this is what they wanted to do was that there was about 15 seconds from the completion to Clayton until the snap on 3rd down. They were slow all the way from the completion to Heap.

If we wanted to practise two minute drill that ends in TD, no doubt they would have gone no huddle from the completion to Heap, or at least call a few plays at a time. But they sure took their time to get plays underway.

I would rather we practised a TD endning two minute drill, but they better also have the Bingo play down when we need it to tie a game up or win it in the waning seconds of an important game. So I'm ok with it.

**Greg** · 08-19-2006, 05:17 PM

There was only three choices that could of been made; 1) bring out the field goal unit and kick on third down while the clock was running 2) spike the ball on third down and bring out the field goal unit on fourth down while the clock was stopped 3) pass to the endzone on third down and if not successful kick field goal on fourth down. The option of running up the middle on third down with no timeouts and the clock running with 16 seconds shouldn't of even entered the equation.

Exactly, thanks for clearly saying what I was trying to say.

Those were the only 3 reasonable options.

Hrafn, if they were practicing a drill for running a play to get closer and even position the ball then get out for the kick that would be fine with me. And in that case they should just say "we normally wouldn't do that at the 17, but we wanted to practice for that in case we had a game situation where we wanted a few more yards" then I would buy it.

I think they wanted to keep going for the TD, something more important to practice, and mistakenly called that running play. And worse yet, THEY MAY NOT SEE IT AS A MISTAKE!

Fine, run another play, BUT PASS, you have little to no shot at a TD from there on the ground anyway. And a failed pass stops the clock.

**Hrafn** · 08-19-2006, 05:23 PM

Surely it was a moronic play call if they didn't want to go through what I outlined. But I refuse to believe that Fassel is that dumb. Many a regular season two minute drill begs to differ, but in this instance I cannot believe that they would mess it up so badly with nothing on the line.

**DeepPurple** · 08-19-2006, 07:41 PM

In high school or college and with a less experienced kicker I could see the hash marks might be a consideration. However, in the NFL the hash marks are only 7 yards apart, so the ball is spotted no more than 3-1/2 yards from center of the field at anytime and we've got a kicker who's been kicking in the NFL since 1989. If you need more yards to get in field goal range and have no timeouts, you throw to the sidelines. Plus the excuse of the referees having to change footballs shouldn't be an excuse, they've been using special kicking balls for at least five years.

In reference to the poster about college no longer stopping the clock on a first down, it was still in use last season, so if it's been changed that's a brand new rule change. I watch as much college football as I do pro, which is a lot.

**Ravens0587** · 08-19-2006, 10:05 PM

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/previe...ory?id=2543105

3. Game clock (Rule 3-2-5, 3-2-5-e)

Change: When the ball is free kicked, the game clock will start. When Team B is awarded a first down, the game clock will start on the ready-for-play signal.

Rationale: One of the goals in revising the rules was to shorten the length of games. The game clock will now start when the ball hits the kicker's foot on free kicks and kickoffs, and when the referee signals the ball is ready for play on first downs, instead of at the snap. Many coaches believe these changes will eliminate 10-15 plays per game.

**Hrafn** · 08-20-2006, 04:19 AM

Originally Posted by DeepPurple

In high school or college and with a less experienced kicker I could see the hash marks might be a consideration. However, in the NFL the hash marks are only 7 yards apart, so the ball is spotted no more than 3-1/2 yards from center of the field at anytime and we've got a kicker who's been kicking in the NFL since 1989. If you need more yards to get in field goal range and have no timeouts, you throw to the sidelines. Plus the excuse of the referees having to change footballs shouldn't be an excuse, they've been using special kicking balls for at least five years.

I'd say throwing to the sidelines is a more high risk play than a run play. Risk of sack, incompletion, fumble and int, vs risk of fumble and loss of yards on run play.

Check Billick's PC on br.com or Aarons article.

I don't know if Billick's PC was just spin, but he said the officials were apologetic about it. Making me think that special kicking balls are not used in similar situations. The ball used on pevious down will be used.

No further on this on my part.

However Billick also stated that they also ran on the Boller led 2 minute drill vs Gmen. That getting a 1st down + spike gives you a more controlled opportunity to try for the end zone with 10 seconds or so on the clock.

I don't see how this is the case. With 30 seconds on the clock and third down as the scenario pass play to no later than end zone at 10 seconds remaining:

Do you risk not getting the first down, and letting the other team know it is an end zone pass to gain 20 seconds of getting the play in? Here is where I no longer support the thinking of the coaching staff. Bingo play (here used as run + field goal) only applicable if long FG situation and a couple of yards gives you higher conversion rate.