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  1. #121

    Re: Jim Caldwell to the Lions!!!?????



    IMO, whether Caldwell stays or goes - assuming he isn't hired as a HC somewhere - will depend on whether a more experience, successful OC can be hired to replace him.
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  2. #122
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    Re: Jim Caldwell to the Lions!!!?????

    Quote Originally Posted by B-more Ravor View Post
    IMO, whether Caldwell stays or goes - assuming he isn't hired as a HC somewhere - will depend on whether a more experience, successful OC can be hired to replace him.
    *coughNorvcough*
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  3. #123
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    Re: Jim Caldwell to the Lions!!!?????

    Quote Originally Posted by veritas View Post
    Not being currently under contract does not preclude him from coming back. I want him precluded from coming back, at least as OC.
    The only capacity I'd be happy to see him come back is as a QB coach.
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  4. #124
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    Re: Jim Caldwell to the Lions!!!?????

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    *coughNorvcough*
    My first choice. But honestly what OC is not more experienced than Caldwell, he's never done it?
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  5. #125
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    Re: Jim Caldwell to the Lions!!!?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravenswintitle View Post
    My first choice. But honestly what OC is not more experienced than Caldwell, he's never done it?
    True.

    Part of me still thinks they wanted Norv last year...but he had already signed with Cleveland (IIRC) before the Super Bowl.

    Nothing to prove that...just a hunch. Schematically, he makes a lot of sense. And even though he runs the AC, his version has produced much more successful units than Cam's or Camwell's.

    Maybe they do bring in Norv? Plus, it would put another chink in Cleveland's armor (not sure they need another though...) and Norv already has experience seeing Pittsburgh and Cinci's D.


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  6. #126

    Re: Jim Caldwell to the Lions!!!?????

    with Lovie hired Caldwell might be the top "Rooney Rule" guy.

    I just want someone to hire him to force the Ravens' hand. I don't think they will retain him regardless, but you never know with Harbaugh. Caldwell getting hired by someone else would be awesome.




  7. #127
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    Re: Jim Caldwell to the Lions!!!?????

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    True.

    Part of me still thinks they wanted Norv last year...but he had already signed with Cleveland (IIRC) before the Super Bowl.

    Nothing to prove that...just a hunch. Schematically, he makes a lot of sense. And even though he runs the AC, his version has produced much more successful units than Cam's or Camwell's.

    Maybe they do bring in Norv? Plus, it would put another chink in Cleveland's armor (not sure they need another though...) and Norv already has experience seeing Pittsburgh and Cinci's D.


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    Agreed with the bolded, Norv just has a sense of the game and the players. Good with adjustments, game plans. Probably one of the best coordinators of that offense. And I do think that offense fits Flacco's skill sets well.
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  8. #128
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    Re: Jim Caldwell to the Lions!!!?????

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    You just posted three links with the words "rumored" and "interested" in the titles.

    When this all shakes out I'm confident Caldwell won't be a HC of any NFL team next season.

    And by some miracle he is, he's not going to be very good at it.
    I'm not saying he's definitely going to get hired. I'm saying in the two cases where he's being requested for interviews, it seems/seemed like it was more than just Rooney Rule satisfaction.

    Of course, now I disprove my theory about neither of those situations happened. Lovie Smith is reportedly hired as next coach of the Bucs, so Lions would still need a minority candidate to interview.
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  9. #129

    Re: Jim Caldwell to the Lions!!!?????

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    *coughNorvcough*
    Yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    Part of me still thinks they wanted Norv last year...but he had already signed with Cleveland (IIRC) before the Super Bowl.
    Yes. I don't think it was a coincidence that Caldwell got his one-year extension a few days after Norv signed on in Cleveland. Although, once they won the SB with the offense looking so good, I'm not sure they could have/would have made a change.
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  10. #130
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    Re: Jim Caldwell to the Lions!!!?????

    Quote Originally Posted by ravensnhokies View Post
    Sorry guys... Big No to Norv

    He is still a Coryell disciple and I'm just plain fed up with its long developing patterns by design. Look at the difference between Rivers in 2012 with Norv and 2013 with McCoy/Whisenhunt and their more flexible Erhardt-Perkins Scheme. He was a completely renewed QB this year. In 2012, Rivers had a shit Oline, and Norv still stuck to that system. Philip was killed just like Joe this year. Norv is married to the damn AC. It is an aesthetically beautiful system if you have a great OL like the Chargers in the late 70s/early80s, but we don't have anything remotely close. Sure the OL will get better... can't get any worse... but its time to go another route with a fresh new system. The EP system (or modified version) gets your QB in rhythm with easier/wide open receiver throws , and we all know Joe is a lot better in rhythm. It is still a big PAP system (as opposed to West Coast) which I think Joe is at his best.

    I really don't understand why any of you would want to go from an OC that was married to the Air Coryell to another OC that is married to the AC. It's not that the Norv's AC is a better system than Jim's AC. Its still the same AC system. Norv probably will call better plays out of it at better times than Jim. But fundamentally, its still the longer developing patterns/lower percentage deeper passes that require your OL to protect your QB a lot longer than the other offensive systems. I want a younger OC than isn't married to a system.
    The Air Coryell works and has worked for us up until this year when we no longer had the personnel to make sure it worked without a hitch. Joe is the perfect guy for that style of offense. He's not overly mobile, he has a huge arm and up until this season we had the RB horses to make the important play actions worth a damn. Every offensive coordinator is, 'married' to a system. What would you like to see us start running here? A system more tailored to a QB like Brady or Peyton where they throw quick three second passes and have their receivers go for 2304023432 yards a clip? How much better do you think that will fair? The receivers we have right now make their money being faster than the defenders opposite them; it's easy to outrun the DBs with longer developing routes and more difficult when it's a quick slant (see Torrey or Jacoby on the slants they do get; YAC rarely occur there). Joe has also shown that he has a tendency to lock onto a guy; that's not going to help that style of offense either.

    Brady and Peyton have made their money spreading that rock like nobody's business and having the almost immeasurable football IQ to do so with precision timing and expediency. I'm not knocking Joe but merely pointing out that his skillset is much different than those two. I mean Hell, if someone smarter than I am (the rest of this board) says they think Joe could run something like that without resorting to the muddle huddle all game I'd be all for bringing in the oft mentioned, 'young, hotshot, hungry OC who's going to take our offensive game to the limits!,'.




  11. #131

    Re: Jim Caldwell to the Lions!!!?????

    Quote Originally Posted by rlh445 View Post
    The Air Coryell works and has worked for us up until this year when we no longer had the personnel to make sure it worked without a hitch. Joe is the perfect guy for that style of offense. He's not overly mobile, he has a huge arm and up until this season we had the RB horses to make the important play actions worth a damn. Every offensive coordinator is, 'married' to a system. What would you like to see us start running here? A system more tailored to a QB like Brady or Peyton where they throw quick three second passes and have their receivers go for 2304023432 yards a clip? How much better do you think that will fair? The receivers we have right now make their money being faster than the defenders opposite them; it's easy to outrun the DBs with longer developing routes and more difficult when it's a quick slant (see Torrey or Jacoby on the slants they do get; YAC rarely occur there). Joe has also shown that he has a tendency to lock onto a guy; that's not going to help that style of offense either.

    Brady and Peyton have made their money spreading that rock like nobody's business and having the almost immeasurable football IQ to do so with precision timing and expediency. I'm not knocking Joe but merely pointing out that his skillset is much different than those two. I mean Hell, if someone smarter than I am (the rest of this board) says they think Joe could run something like that without resorting to the muddle huddle all game I'd be all for bringing in the oft mentioned, 'young, hotshot, hungry OC who's going to take our offensive game to the limits!,'.
    I don't see how it makes sense to send your receivers deep all the time when you know your receivers struggle against press man coverage . Overall your quarterback (Joe Flacco) is going to suffer under Norv Turner system because his system is base on deep routes more than anything. Norv is good offensive coordintor but the air corydell system is probably the least quarterback friendly offense in the nfl and in my opinion we need a new system or atleast a coordinator that under stands that yes we have fast receivers that can take the top off the defense but theres no need to send them deep 90% of the time.

    I remember watching the chargers last year and I heard the announce say that ever since Norv Turner left Rivers has more control and change plays when he wants to. Why would we want Flacco to have less control of the offense ?




  12. #132

    Re: Jim Caldwell to the Lions!!!?????

    Quote Originally Posted by rlh445 View Post
    The Air Coryell works and has worked for us up until this year when we no longer had the personnel to make sure it worked without a hitch. Joe is the perfect guy for that style of offense. He's not overly mobile, he has a huge arm and up until this season we had the RB horses to make the important play actions worth a damn. Every offensive coordinator is, 'married' to a system. What would you like to see us start running here? A system more tailored to a QB like Brady or Peyton where they throw quick three second passes and have their receivers go for 2304023432 yards a clip? How much better do you think that will fair? The receivers we have right now make their money being faster than the defenders opposite them; it's easy to outrun the DBs with longer developing routes and more difficult when it's a quick slant (see Torrey or Jacoby on the slants they do get; YAC rarely occur there). Joe has also shown that he has a tendency to lock onto a guy; that's not going to help that style of offense either.

    Brady and Peyton have made their money spreading that rock like nobody's business and having the almost immeasurable football IQ to do so with precision timing and expediency. I'm not knocking Joe but merely pointing out that his skillset is much different than those two. I mean Hell, if someone smarter than I am (the rest of this board) says they think Joe could run something like that without resorting to the muddle huddle all game I'd be all for bringing in the oft mentioned, 'young, hotshot, hungry OC who's going to take our offensive game to the limits!,'.
    The Steelers run the Erhardt-Perkins system just like the Patriots. Do they look anything alike? No. The reason is that the EP system is flexible in its design. Its the route concepts that get receivers open. You run a lot out of it and thus PAP is a very successful result.

    The only team that runs the Air Coryell well is the Saints, and that's only b/c Drew Brees is the most accurate deep ball passer in the league. I'm a big Joe Homer, but facts are facts, Joe can't sniff Drew's jock when it comes to deep ball accuracy.

    You're right every coordinator is likely married to either the Air Coryell, Erhardt-Perkins, or the West Coast (only NFL team not running one of these schemes is the Eagles which is a true spread). I like the EP scheme b/c of its flexible in its design where you can throw deep out of it. And you won't have DBs able to bracket Torrey deep like they do in the AC, b/c they will have to respect the shorter routes. Ok, we absolutely do need to get better route runners to run the EP, but I contend if we don't get better route runners, period, no scheme will work. Our fast but shitty route runners in the AC didn't work this year.




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