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  1. #1
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    The Ravens need an Entirely New Offensive System and Philosophy Part II.



    I'm struggling to actually determine where I should start. Hopefully, it will come along as I type.

    Joe Flacco has not played his best. It is clear that he's trying to force it, but do you know why he's trying to force it? Because he has to force it, because no one else on this offense is going to make anything happen. Sometimes you get the TD like the one he threw to Clark versus the Bengals and sometimes you get picks. Both instances would be very risky, throwing from about 10-15 yards away, between at least two defenders, on the run. That wasn't any less risky a throw than some of the picks. That touchdown doesn't happen if Flacco doesn't take a huge chance. Do you know why he's constantly trying to make those throws? Because this team has constantly asked him to make those throws, because no one on this team is catching the ball unless it is darn near pin point put on them. There's no Rob Gronkowski or Jimmy Graham. There's no AJ Green or Calvin Johnson.

    Which is why I get frustrated when I hear this talk about how Joe Flacco is not elite, because he apparently can't carry a team on his back. Well, let's look at the QBs that people would deem 'Elite'. Peyton Manning, the guy whose always had high quality offensive weaponry, and a system built around his arm? Harrison, Wayne, Clark in his prime, Stokely, now, Welker and Thomas? As if Tom Brady didn't have high quality defenses (and video assistance) when he was winning his rings. As if he didn't have Welker and Moss when he was breaking records. He was struggling this year, just like Flacco was. And what happened, Gronkowski came back and Amendola came back and he went off.

    This organization is stuck in the past, wanting to win the old fashioned way, playing tough defense and running the ball. The man just went for 11 TDs and 0 Ints, with a reject returner from Houston who only catches with his body, A second year WR who could only run deeper routes at the time, a possession WR who couldn't gain separation and is now fading in San Fransisco, and Dennis Pitta. All from a few minor tweaks to an archaic system and 'some' better protection.

    Winning the Super Bowl the way they did should have been a sign that they needed to move on with the times. Yet, they just went back to the old approach, leaving the offense with hardly any depth at all. I can understand why they traded Boldin, but no veteran depth behind him at all? No depth behind Pitta? When you should have known that you were one injury away from what is currently taking place? No depth on the offensive line behind an untrustworthy McKinnie or a Kelechi Osemele who you knew was playing through such pain, or a Marshal Yanda coming off of shoulder surgery.

    Now people are talking like Joe wasn't worth the money and honestly, I'm surprised he's still standing. You can talk about getting whoever to play QB all you want, I can almost guarantee you they would have been hurt by now.

    And then there's this philosophical clusterfuck with Cameron's old system still in place, Caldwell's input or lack thereof, because none of us know for sure what his role honestly is other than calling the actual plays, and Harbaugh sticking his finger in the mix.

    The system is an aged system too heavily reliant on extended pass protection for the deeper throws. They need a quick passing system with vertical elements based off of it. That's why the Ravens short passing game struggles. That's why they struggle when they try WR screens (rarely), because that's not what the system emphasizes. Yes, the plays are in the system to be called, but you are going to practice more of what you emphasize.

    They need a new OC with some creativity, a new WR coach, a new O-Line coach and they need to let that man run the show. And they need to focus on building the team philosophy around the QB that led them to the Super Bowl.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  2. #2

    Re: The Ravens need an Entirely New Offensive System and Philosophy Part II.

    I completely agree.




  3. #3

    Re: The Ravens need an Entirely New Offensive System and Philosophy Part II.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Excellector View Post
    I'm struggling to actually determine where I should start. Hopefully, it will come along as I type.

    Joe Flacco has not played his best. It is clear that he's trying to force it, but do you know why he's trying to force it? Because he has to force it, because no one else on this offense is going to make anything happen. Sometimes you get the TD like the one he threw to Clark versus the Bengals and sometimes you get picks. Both instances would be very risky, throwing from about 10-15 yards away, between at least two defenders, on the run. That wasn't any less risky a throw than some of the picks. That touchdown doesn't happen if Flacco doesn't take a huge chance. Do you know why he's constantly trying to make those throws? Because this team has constantly asked him to make those throws, because no one on this team is catching the ball unless it is darn near pin point put on them. There's no Rob Gronkowski or Jimmy Graham. There's no AJ Green or Calvin Johnson.

    Which is why I get frustrated when I hear this talk about how Joe Flacco is not elite, because he apparently can't carry a team on his back. Well, let's look at the QBs that people would deem 'Elite'. Peyton Manning, the guy whose always had high quality offensive weaponry, and a system built around his arm? Harrison, Wayne, Clark in his prime, Stokely, now, Welker and Thomas? As if Tom Brady didn't have high quality defenses (and video assistance) when he was winning his rings. As if he didn't have Welker and Moss when he was breaking records. He was struggling this year, just like Flacco was. And what happened, Gronkowski came back and Amendola came back and he went off.

    This organization is stuck in the past, wanting to win the old fashioned way, playing tough defense and running the ball. The man just went for 11 TDs and 0 Ints, with a reject returner from Houston who only catches with his body, A second year WR who could only run deeper routes at the time, a possession WR who couldn't gain separation and is now fading in San Fransisco, and Dennis Pitta. All from a few minor tweaks to an archaic system and 'some' better protection.

    Winning the Super Bowl the way they did should have been a sign that they needed to move on with the times. Yet, they just went back to the old approach, leaving the offense with hardly any depth at all. I can understand why they traded Boldin, but no veteran depth behind him at all? No depth behind Pitta? When you should have known that you were one injury away from what is currently taking place? No depth on the offensive line behind an untrustworthy McKinnie or a Kelechi Osemele who you knew was playing through such pain, or a Marshal Yanda coming off of shoulder surgery.

    Now people are talking like Joe wasn't worth the money and honestly, I'm surprised he's still standing. You can talk about getting whoever to play QB all you want, I can almost guarantee you they would have been hurt by now.

    And then there's this philosophical clusterfuck with Cameron's old system still in place, Caldwell's input or lack thereof, because none of us know for sure what his role honestly is other than calling the actual plays, and Harbaugh sticking his finger in the mix.

    The system is an aged system too heavily reliant on extended pass protection for the deeper throws. They need a quick passing system with vertical elements based off of it. That's why the Ravens short passing game struggles. That's why they struggle when they try WR screens (rarely), because that's not what the system emphasizes. Yes, the plays are in the system to be called, but you are going to practice more of what you emphasize.

    They need a new OC with some creativity, a new WR coach, a new O-Line coach and they need to let that man run the show. And they need to focus on building the team philosophy around the QB that led them to the Super Bowl.




  4. #4

    Re: The Ravens need an Entirely New Offensive System and Philosophy Part II.

    Definitely need a whole new system to be implemented by a new OC plus they need to upgrade the OL and receivers and bolster the RB position. In short, they need an offense good enough to neutralize Harbaugh because if it comes down to coaching, he'll usually lose.




  5. #5

    Re: The Ravens need an Entirely New Offensive System and Philosophy Part II.

    How many times do you watch other games and wonder, "Why can't the Ravens get a guy wide open like that?" His mis throws get magnified because our receivers are only open 2-3 times a game. Chicago ran that stack concept all day and it confused our defense. Where is ours? Every throw is low percentage.

    We need a new system!




  6. #6

    Re: The Ravens need an Entirely New Offensive System and Philosophy Part II.

    Quote Originally Posted by dscola31 View Post
    How many times do you watch other games and wonder, "Why can't the Ravens get a guy wide open like that?" His mis throws get magnified because our receivers are only open 2-3 times a game. Chicago ran that stack concept all day and it confused our defense. Where is ours? Every throw is low percentage.

    We need a new system!
    Stacks. Rubs. Pick plays. But let's be honest here...the Ravens CAN'T EVEN RUN A SCREEN PLAY that doesn't blow up in their face. The whole offensive design is shit. And people are complaining because Joe can't turn the shit into gold? LOL. Get a fuckin clue already.




  7. #7

    Re: The Ravens need an Entirely New Offensive System and Philosophy Part II.

    I don't claim to be a football genius that knows the ins and outs of scheme, but I do watch a ton of football and I believe the Ravens aren't doing enough scheme-wise to make up for the personnel they have.

    The Broncos do amazing, AMAZING things with quick tunnel screens to their wide outs. Nick Foles is out in Philadelphia just lighting teams up because Kelly's offense creates space and creates mismatches. The Patriots used to get Wes Welker open all day long with little rub routes and pick plays that were easy 5-7 yard completions for Brady.

    The Ravens have always been an offense built on execution. It requires great protection and pin point accuracy from Flacco on throws down the field. And I also don't think enough can be said about how play action has disappeared from our arsenal... it has killed the deep passing game. Obviously the execution isn't there on a number of fronts this year (and has disappeared for long stretches over the past 5 years). It's tough to rely on week in and week out. They have to come up with ways to get the ball to Torrey and get Flacco some easy completions to get him in rhythm and find ways to create space for the running game. That's the way the NFL is going.

    When the weather gets rough and cold in Nov/Dec/January, you want a tough big-armed guy like Flacco and you want a power run game, but I really think they could be doing a lot more to move the ball consistently.




  8. #8
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    Re: The Ravens need an Entirely New Offensive System and Philosophy Part II.

    New offensive coaches preferably from the greenbay saint camp, we need to draft a big body reciever or big play TE, a gaurd wouldn't hurt either build this team around Flacco and harbaugh need to check his ego and philosphy at door.




  9. #9
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    Re: The Ravens need an Entirely New Offensive System and Philosophy Part II.

    I am seeing some different things that I didn't see under Cam, like stack/pick formations (just that we need a sure handed TE in the mix).

    I'm waiting for FilmStudy to come in, it looked to me like the ZBS was scaled back, couldn't tell if it was the weather factor or if some basic changes had been made.

    You get frustrated when you hear talk Joe isn't elite.
    Well the "eliter" than him, Matty IceCream is 2-8, apparently he has even more trouble carrying a playoff team on his back. Joe is doing better than him even when things aren't going well for either.

    They need a new OC with some creativity, a new WR coach, a new O-Line coach and they need to let that man run the show. And they need to focus on building the team philosophy around the QB that led them to the Super Bowl.
    Yep, and we need to draft an impact LT, FS, TE, C and RB bruiser, I don't see a lot of tools for a lot of creative options to be used.... Is Vonta in? run Is Vonta out? No power run, just a tricky one if at all. Need a TE who can block and catch, a RB who can provide an extra 1.5sec of protection from what we are currently getting and aslo catch and run for the sugar huddle to be useful....
    To be on a pedestal is to be in a corner




  10. #10
    iggyman555 Guest

    Re: The Ravens need an Entirely New Offensive System and Philosophy Part II.

    Quote Originally Posted by veritas View Post
    Definitely need a whole new system to be implemented by a new OC plus they need to upgrade the OL and receivers and bolster the RB position. In short, they need an offense good enough to neutralize Harbaugh because if it comes down to coaching, he'll usually lose.
    it doesnt matter who the OC is and what the system is harbs will tone it done and play ultra conservative




  11. #11

    Re: The Ravens need an Entirely New Offensive System and Philosophy Part II.

    100% accurate. The Ravens are in a paradoxical situation of running an offense that is not only one of the league's simplest and most easily defended, but ALSO one of the least QB-friendly. It's pretty tough to not only be this bad, but also make it look this hard!

    The problem is John Harbaugh. He brought Cam in here to run 3 yards and a cloud of dust, throw deep off play action, and keep everything outside the numbers where it probably won't be picked off. Cam did that and we ripped him for it, even though he showed in 2 minute drills and come from behind situations that he COULD run a modern offense when Harbaugh had no other choice but to allow it.

    Under Caldwell nothing has changed although we throw a little more over the middle and have a few new wrinkles to the offense. For the most part it's still run, run, pass, punt even if we do it out of the pistol. We're still so simplistic and predictable with the league's smallest playbook and smallest route tree. Opposing defenses have it so easy; all they need to do is crash the run and cover over the top and the Ravens are helpless.

    The worst part is, even if he'll allow some tiny changes along the way, I don't think Harbaugh understands that the basic 1980's Schembechler offense and defense won't work anymore. He just doesn't think he needs to change fundamentally. Unless Bisciotti steps in and forces him to hire creative coordinators that are allowed to run modern schemes, it's not going to happen.




  12. #12
    Join Date
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    Re: The Ravens need an Entirely New Offensive System and Philosophy Part II.

    Quote Originally Posted by dscola31 View Post
    How many times do you watch other games and wonder, "Why can't the Ravens get a guy wide open like that?" His mis throws get magnified because our receivers are only open 2-3 times a game. Chicago ran that stack concept all day and it confused our defense. Where is ours? Every throw is low percentage.

    We need a new system!
    At one point the Ravens went to play tight coverage on an important third down, and Chicago immediately motioned their receivers to a stacked formation to back them off. Between stuff like that and the crossing routes/mismatches/reverses they were running, at one point in the fourth quarter I legitimately found myself wondering if the Ravens' offensive coaches ever watch the game/tape of other offenses.




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