Art Jones

**Ravenswintitle** · 09-27-2013, 01:28 PM

Originally Posted by GirlsKickButt

I seriously doubt with the way Suggs is playing, they'd cut him or let him walk in FA. I see an extention for him next year and he'll retire a Raven.

As for signings, I see an extention for Pitta & and possibly Oher (unless they like Wagner at RT, but the market has been soft on OT so Oher might be had for a reasonable contract) and they will attempt to re-sign D. Smith and Ihedigbo to 1 - 2 year deals. Art Jones walks. They have Kapron-Lewis that will take his spot next year.

they're gonna tie up half the cap on 6 players? I don't think they have any other option than to let Suggs walk but I'm no capologist

**leachisabeast** · 09-27-2013, 01:48 PM

Originally Posted by Ravenswintitle

they're gonna tie up half the cap on 6 players? I don't think they have any other option than to let Suggs walk but I'm no capologist

The Ravens can keep him while being under the cap next year with some moves, it just means that we'll be very very limited with who we can sign. I think a contract extension is certainly in the cards.

I think if you cut Suggs, it would be the biggest loss in team history. Outside of Dumervil, we won't have anybody capable of getting to the QB on a consistent basis. Upshaw can't rush the passer at all, and Simon probably won't be ready by then.

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 09-27-2013, 01:55 PM

An extension is a possibility, but I don't think it'll be easy, nor necessarily prudent.

Teams, including the Ravens don't give out extensions to players already in their 30's unless they are QB's generally...even when those players can still play.

We'll see...I don't think either scenario is greater than the other.

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**BcRaven** · 09-27-2013, 01:56 PM

Originally Posted by leachisabeast

... I think if you cut Suggs, it would be the biggest loss in team history. Outside of Dumervil, we won't have anybody capable of getting to the QB on a consistent basis. Upshaw can't rush the passer at all, and Simon probably won't be ready by then.

Let's not forget Pernell McPhee. We don't really know the scope of his pass rush talents yet... Bc

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 09-27-2013, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by BcRaven

Let's not forget Pernell McPhee. We don't really know the scope of his pass rush talents yet... Bc

Don't forget Hamilton who has shown a lot of pass rushing potential and even Simon who has shown some good moves.

And there isn't anything stopping them from drafting another pass rusher as well.

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**BcRaven** · 09-27-2013, 02:15 PM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

Don't forget Hamilton who has shown a lot of pass rushing potential and even Simon who has shown some good moves.
And there isn't anything stopping them from drafting another pass rusher as well.
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Certainly not forgetting them, but McPhee had 6 sacks as a rookie (DE) and another 1.5 last season. So, he's shown some pass rush talent in NFL games already... Bc

**Bhcforlife** · 09-27-2013, 02:22 PM

They aren't going to cut Suggs if he continues his current rate of production through the entire season. That's just not going to happen. At his current pace he's going to have the best season of his career, both numbers wise and "eye test" wise - better than his DPOTY season. Just going by that current pace, you are saying they would cut a 31 year old coming off a 16 sack season, a guy who in (at that point) his last three healthy seasons would have a combined 41 sacks. No way they cut that kind of production. Suggs seems to be the rare player getting better with age.

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 09-27-2013, 02:36 PM

Originally Posted by Bhcforlife

They aren't going to cut Suggs if he continues his current rate of production through the entire season. That's just not going to happen. At his current pace he's going to have the best season of his career, both numbers wise and "eye test" wise - better than his DPOTY season. Just going by that current pace, you are saying they would cut a 31 year old coming off a 16 sack season, a guy who in (at that point) his last three healthy seasons would have a combined 41 sacks. No way they cut that kind of production. Suggs seems to be the rare player getting better with age.

In his and almost any other players case that's not a QB, the 31...turning 32 next year...is just as big of a number as the sacks.

I'm just pointing out that extensions at his age for his position are extremely rare...so it's not out of the question that it won't happen for him either.

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**Paintballguy** · 09-27-2013, 02:37 PM

Originally Posted by Bhcforlife

They aren't going to cut Suggs if he continues his current rate of production through the entire season. That's just not going to happen. At his current pace he's going to have the best season of his career, both numbers wise and "eye test" wise - better than his DPOTY season. Just going by that current pace, you are saying they would cut a 31 year old coming off a 16 sack season, a guy who in (at that point) his last three healthy seasons would have a combined 41 sacks. No way they cut that kind of production. Suggs seems to be the rare player getting better with age.

:word I don't see them parting ways with Suggs. He's too good of a player. I'm thinking a 3 year extension or so to help get that cap number down.

**leachisabeast** · 09-27-2013, 02:51 PM

Didn't the Giants have a similar situation with Strahan in his last 3/4 years in the league? I could be wrong, but I'm sure they worked something out that ensured Strahan retiring as a Giant in 2007.

**Bhcforlife** · 09-27-2013, 03:04 PM

I understand your point, Raveninwoodlawn, but most non QBs entering 30, 31, 32, are beginning or on the decline. Again, I'm projecting here, but if Suggs were to keep up this pace his two best years would be 29 and 31, and without the fluke injury last year we'd likely be looking at a guy who's three best years were 29-31. I don't think it's difficult to project him to maintain that level of play at least another 2-3 years, with a transition at that point into more of a rush specialist. I could be way off, just how I feel though...

Not really worth discussing too much at this point anyway IMO. He could end up with the 3 sacks he has now, or he could end up with 22. Things can change so much between now and the time this decision will have to be made.

**ursula** · 09-27-2013, 04:45 PM

Originally Posted by Bhcforlife

I understand your point, Raveninwoodlawn, but most non QBs entering 30, 31, 32, are beginning or on the decline. Again, I'm projecting here, but if Suggs were to keep up this pace his two best years would be 29 and 31, and without the fluke injury last year we'd likely be looking at a guy who's three best years were 29-31. I don't think it's difficult to project him to maintain that level of play at least another 2-3 years, with a transition at that point into more of a rush specialist. I could be way off, just how I feel though...

Not really worth discussing too much at this point anyway IMO. He could end up with the 3 sacks he has now, or he could end up with 22. Things can change so much between now and the time this decision will have to be made.

I think this is a good way to look at Suggs' situation and I say that as a huge Suggs fan-as are most of us here. Our cap is hellish and we don't want it to become Pittsburgh-ish so Suggs being back next year is and will remain a question. And really, the Suggs' contract is only problematical because of the other large contracts: Ngata's and Rice's. Webb's and Yanda's (which is a very friendly team contract), and Flacco's is looming over the rest....It is because of all of this that I can't understand why the team didn't part ways with McClain this offseason because I can't see them keeping him around for next year.

Players who are looking like cap casuaties next offseason:
- McClain. Team saves $3.2M against the cap by cutting him, creating $1.2M of dead money
- McKinnie. Team saves $3M against the cap by cutting him, creating $1M of dead money. Cutting him almost guarantees the team needing to draft a high round/1st round OT.
- Koch. Team saves $1.6M against the cap by cutting him, creating $1.2M of dead money. Need a new punter then..or maybe he takes a salary cut...
- Huff Team saves $1.25M against the cap by cutting him, creating $1M of dead money. I'd give that money to Dig on a 1 year contract.
- Leach. Team saves $2.33M against the cap by cutting him, creating $0 of dead money.

That's over $11M in cap savings.

I'm praying that the team and Suggs work out a solution where he stays with us.