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  1. #16
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    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore



    Quote Originally Posted by Cj34 View Post
    GOTA that's flat out ridiculous. Name me another city that's gone through what Baltimore has. No other city with our history has been shit on by the NFL for 13 yrs, used by other NFL owners to get a sweeter deal and passed over for expansions by cities the likes of Jacksonville and Charlotte. If it wasn't for Modell we STILL wouldn't have a team. The die hard football fans would still be rooting for whoever we rooted for in the 80's after the Colts left and a lot of Ravens fans wouldn't even be football fans right now.
    Who would the old Cardinals fans be routing for if Georgia Frontiere didn't move the Rams to St. Louis? How about Bob McNair in Houston who came in with almost unlimited money to make sure that Houston got their team back. Lots of owners made huge commitments to cities and fanbases and are the reason they had a team. That asshole Irsay is probably in discussion for the Indy Mt. Rushmore.

    I love Modell but if I wouldn't bump any of the 4 that The Excellector posted for him. 4 HOF players with one of them also being a HOF GM is tough to beat.
    He Who Dares.....Wins




  2. #17
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    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    People might not want to hear this, but Modell was one of those owners trying to use Baltimore to get a sweeter deal. However, Cleveland called his bluff.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  3. #18
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    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    I'm torn on this. I love this list, but I too want to find a place for Art. However, I don't think you can put him there instead of Ozzie. And obviously Ray isn't coming off the list. So that leaves Reed and Ogden, both of them in the discussion for the best player at their position ever.

    Blasphemous as it may be to say this... I feel like Modell should get Ogden's spot. I'd rather have the discussion only include players, so we could sit here debating whether Flacco or Stover or Suggs or someone else gets that final spot. But there's no team without Art Modell and there may be no championships without Ozzie's GM-ing prowess. So when you look at Ogden vs. Reed, I'm going with Reed.




  4. #19
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    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    You'll get most everyone to agree on Ray Lewis and Ed Reed. From there you'll get several opinions of rounding out the other two.

    Should be players only IMO which is why I would go with Ogden and Stover. For a good ten years this team was built on defense and there wasn't much offense outside of running the ball and kicking field goals.
    World Domination 3 Points at a Time!




  5. #20
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    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    (1) Bill Belichick [failed in Cleveland so team could be moved]; (2) Art Modell [man who moved team to Baltimore]; (3) Earnest Byner [Ring of Honor]; (4) my sister-in-law who drove me to drink in Maryland, all the other United States, plus Washington D.C. ... Bc




  6. #21
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    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    Quote Originally Posted by The Excellector View Post
    People might not want to hear this, but Modell was one of those owners trying to use Baltimore to get a sweeter deal. However, Cleveland called his bluff.
    LOL! Yes they did.
    "Screw it, let's ride"!




  7. #22
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    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    Quote Originally Posted by GOTA View Post
    Who would the old Cardinals fans be routing for if Georgia Frontiere didn't move the Rams to St. Louis? How about Bob McNair in Houston who came in with almost unlimited money to make sure that Houston got their team back. Lots of owners made huge commitments to cities and fanbases and are the reason they had a team. That asshole Irsay is probably in discussion for the Indy Mt. Rushmore.

    I love Modell but if I wouldn't bump any of the 4 that The Excellector posted for him. 4 HOF players with one of them also being a HOF GM is tough to beat.
    You make a good point, however, this is our Mt. Rushmore we are talking about. Not St. Louis, Houston, or Indy. If we choose to include Art, that's our business. As for Indy if they were ever to put that drunken bafoon on their Mt. Rushmore it would provide plenty of comical relief. LOL!

    "Screw it, let's ride"!




  8. #23
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    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    Regardless, I am happy that Modell moved the team. But that's not enough for this Mt Rushmore. Modell is one of a bunch of respected players, coaches, and front office staff/owners who have made major contributions to the team who don't make the cut. In the end, four people stand out and it is as the first post by The Excellector has it:

    Ray Lewis

    Ed Reed

    Jonathan Ogden

    Ozzie Newsome


    What would be interesting is arguing who is on the second team....

    Stover, Modell, Harbaugh, Suggs, Flacco, Biscotti, Boulware, etc.....




  9. #24

    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    "Should be players only IMO which is why I would go with Ogden and Stover. For a good ten years this team was built on defense and there wasn't much offense outside of running the ball and kicking field goals. "

    If this is true, (which it is), isn't there a debate on whether Jamal should be up there? No Jamal, No SB 35.




  10. #25
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    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    so PFT released their picks for Ravens...

    Florio: Ogden, Newsome, Ray, FLACCO
    PFT Readers: Ogden, Newsome, Ray, Reed

    Florio's reasoning is that because Flacco's arrival sparked a 5 year straight playoff run culminating in a SB win, he deserves a spot.

    If you check in a couple years, I might agree with that. Right now, I think you put Reed, as a future HOF, on it over Flacco.
    .
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    “When I think of a Baltimore Raven - we go in there, we take your lunch box, we take your sandwich, we take your juice box, we take your applesauce, and we take your spork and we break it. And we leave you with an empty lunch. That’s the Baltimore Raven way.” - Steve Smith Sr.


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  11. #26
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    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    Ravens Mt Rushmore to me would be players or leadership who made a significant impact, and who retired a Raven. In that case, for me, I would be:
    Ogden, Ray, Stover, Newsome. ( Would put Flacco in Newsome's place if he retires a Raven ) Just my .02 cents.




  12. #27

    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    So Florio had a poll to see who the fans would pick, then summarily ignored it (and his co-host) to pick his own 4 guys?

    What was the point?

    The Ravens have 3 sure-fire HOFers, and a guy who would likely get in as a GM, if he wasn't already there as a player.

    All due respect to the others mentioned, this is a no-brainer (IMHO, YMMV)




  13. #28
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    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    Quote Originally Posted by MarkS View Post
    So Florio had a poll to see who the fans would pick, then summarily ignored it to pick his own 4 guys?

    What was the point?
    That's how they've done all of them. Basically, he makes the "PFT Team" picks so put the graphic up, then posts if the readers agreed or who they picked. I just put more stake in the PFT Planet picks, they seems to be more on the money.

    I guess it was a safeguard to make sure spammers didn't stuff the ballot box, idk?
    .
    .
    “When I think of a Baltimore Raven - we go in there, we take your lunch box, we take your sandwich, we take your juice box, we take your applesauce, and we take your spork and we break it. And we leave you with an empty lunch. That’s the Baltimore Raven way.” - Steve Smith Sr.


    Call me a Special Teams coach again. I dare you! I double dare you, MFer!




  14. #29

    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    I'm not picking on anyone that thinks Stover belongs, but I just don't get it....

    I've met Matt a bunch a times, and had conversations with him. Super nice guy. Big fan of his. He is one of the all time Raven greats. But in terms of Face of the Franchise for the Ravens who have been superb in their 17 years ... No way. He is still only a Kicker.

    The difference between Matt and your standard run of mill guy was about 3-4 kicks/yr inside the 40. Honestly, is that a transcendental type player? Outside the 40, Matt was pretty average (outside 45 -- I'd say below). The big factor was the Ravens offense was so shitty inside the 25, that they had to kick FGs all the time. And Matt was steady and reliable. But again Matt was slightly more reliable than your average NFL kicker. If a kicker is gonna make your FotF list, he better have made multiple Adam Vinatieri type clutch kicks in the playoffs. Matt made 2 --- 2009 Div against Titans, and the 47yd in SB35 (if you wanna include the 51yder in the Colts 2007 Div Lost... that was clutch too). I remember the misses too. The 36yd gimme against the Raiders in the 2001 AFCC, and he also missed a 41yder in SB35.

    My Face of the Franchise... Ray, JO, Oz, and Reed (right now). If Joe plays 8 more years and wins another SB, he'll take Ed's place.




  15. #30

    Re: No Debate Necessary- Baltimore Ravens Mount Rushmore

    Quote Originally Posted by ravensnhokies View Post
    I'm not picking on anyone that thinks Stover belongs, but I just don't get it....

    I've met Matt a bunch a times, and had conversations with him. Super nice guy. Big fan of his. He is one of the all time Raven greats. But in terms of Face of the Franchise for the Ravens who have been superb in their 17 years ... No way. He is still only a Kicker.

    The difference between Matt and your standard run of mill guy was about 3-4 kicks/yr inside the 40. Honestly, is that a transcendental type player? Outside the 40, Matt was pretty average (outside 45 -- I'd say below). The big factor was the Ravens offense was so shitty inside the 25, that they had to kick FGs all the time. And Matt was steady and reliable. But again Matt was slightly more reliable than your average NFL kicker. If a kicker is gonna make your FotF list, he better have made multiple Adam Vinatieri type clutch kicks in the playoffs. Matt made 2 --- 2009 Div against Titans, and the 47yd in SB35 (if you wanna include the 51yder in the Colts 2007 Div Lost... that was clutch too). I remember the misses too. The 36yd gimme against the Raiders in the 2001 AFCC, and he also missed a 41yder in SB35.

    My Face of the Franchise... Ray, JO, Oz, and Reed (right now). If Joe plays 8 more years and wins another SB, he'll take Ed's place.
    I totally agree with the stover assessment plus that defense gave them good field position. I would say Reed, Lewis, Oj n Oz

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