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06-19-2013, 02:23 PM #14Veteran Poster
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Re: A historical comparison of Joe Flacco through year 5- Part two (quantitative)
Yes, the quantitative data is not necessarily very predictive due to the fact some guys are getting 0's across the board for years on the bench, combined with the fact that passing stats have gone way up over the decades to the point where direct comparisons of totals across decades don't mean much when gauging talent.
All that said, for HoF type qualifications, those "totals" will count at the end, and even if Hall voters might adjust a bit for different eras, it is hard to argue with "all-time" rankings in terms of statistics, especially very high rankings (regardless of how they came about).
In terms of judging talent and longterm prognoses, it might be better to compare years 3-5, etc, where the early-start bias is removed and we can better judge trendlines and development curves (to attempt to predict future results/comparisons).
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06-19-2013, 02:49 PM #15Steve Flacco, Apparently
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Joe didn't come onto a good team, Joe came onto a 5-11 team with a rookie head coach and a fullback playing running back because the star runner was out of shape and the rookie runner wasn't ready to carry the load.
Flacco is a big part of the reason the 2008 Ravens made us forget the 2007 Ravens, taking away from that by claiming he inherited a good team is disingenuous.My motto was always to keep swinging. Whether I was in a slump or feeling badly or having trouble off the field, the only thing to do was keep swinging. -Hank Aaron
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Re: A historical comparison of Joe Flacco through year 5- Part two (quantitative)
World Domination 3 Points at a Time!
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06-19-2013, 03:09 PM #17
Re: A historical comparison of Joe Flacco through year 5- Part two (quantitative)
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06-19-2013, 03:19 PM #18Regular 1st Stringer
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Re: A historical comparison of Joe Flacco through year 5- Part two (quantitative)
Alright, RWT. I'll just own up to being a massive purple glasses wearing homer on this issue. While I recognize that my argument is largely based in fandom, I'll try to lay it out in a way that might pass for rational.
Ultimately, I don't understand how a 5-11 team is a "good" team, but a 3-13 team is "horrible". Once you get below six wins in a season, 2 wins isn't enough to sway the definition of a team, for me. Sure, the Colts lost 13 games in Manning's rookie year, but the same guys won 13 the next year. I can't call a team capable of winning 13 games in a season horrible. Sure, they lost 13 the year before (putting them in the position to draft Manning), but that was not the same roster - Mora absolutely gutted the defensive roster when he took over.
In fact, the biggest difference between those two seasons is Manning himself - 26 TDs/28 INTs the 13 loss year, versus 26 TDs/15INTs the 13 win year. If I'm going to compare Joe's rookie year Ravens team to Manning's rookie year Colts team, I would not say the Colts team was horrible. I'd say their rookie QB was.
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06-19-2013, 03:38 PM #19Veteran Poster
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Re: A historical comparison of Joe Flacco through year 5- Part two (quantitative)
Yeah, some people are getting confused about what we are talking about in terms of "team." Most are assuming we are talking about the team other than QB, for the purposes of this discussion. In which case the Ravens have been a good 'team' for over a decade.
2006 we had the best record in franchise history with a journeyman QB putting up milquetoast stats. When the QB production went into the tank in 2007, combined with a lame duck HC who 'lost the team,' we were 5-11. But the non-QB part of the team was indeed very good (because of the defense primarily).
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