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  1. #16
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up



    OBY is feeling the heat too. He's crying in this pic. He knows he's in trouble and there
    are even impeachment mumblings in Congress especially the house. The DEM controlled
    Senate would never let it happen but there might be enough votes in the house to
    get impeachment w/o removal ala Clinton.

    http://news.yahoo.com/photos/tear-ru...170209867.html
    Last edited by AirFlacco; 05-13-2013 at 08:11 PM.




  2. #17
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    Obama is not going to get impeached.

    There's no evidence to suggest he was ever in on anything related to it. This all points to Hillary.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  3. #18
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    Obama is not going to get impeached.

    There's no evidence to suggest he was ever in on anything related to it. This all points to Hillary.
    Youre probably right but never say never. While most of this is about Hilly, it's about
    OBY too and don't forget the IRS going after Conservatives. That was a Cincinnati
    Office mistake but it leads up to the WH, just like Benghazi.

    As President Ford said, Congress can impeach on whatever they vote for and GOP
    controls the house and still has votes in the Sentate. More evidence is being discovered
    every day. One can be impeached for a misdemeanor depending how embarrassing it
    is and how much the public wants it, so there's enough to possibly impeach him for
    gross negligence as our leader.

    In the case of Clinton the public wanted it and there were enough votes to remove him but
    GOP didn't want to because Gore would have been the incumbent running vs W and
    incumbents usually win like OBY just did. You saw how close the Gore vote was so
    it's safe to say he would have won had he been the incumbent. Unlike Tricky Dick who
    was never lucky, Slick Willie can count his lucky stars he wasn't removed.

    Never say never.



    http://stop-obama-now.net/offense/
    Last edited by AirFlacco; 05-13-2013 at 08:10 PM.




  4. #19
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    If they wont or wouldnt impeach over Fast and Furious, then I doubt they'll go after him on this one.

    They're going to let Hillary fall on this grenade.

    I still find it rather incredible how much information is mishandled, garbled, and flat out ignored by leadership. Happens far too much IMO.

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  5. #20
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    Not to mention the public like in the case of Holder. The public just didn't want it unlike with Nixon and Clinton. They probably won't want it with OBY either. He has 9 lives of a cat.




  6. #21
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    If they wont or wouldnt impeach over Fast and Furious, then I doubt they'll go after him on this one.

    They're going to let Hillary fall on this grenade.

    I still find it rather incredible how much information is mishandled, garbled, and flat out ignored by leadership. Happens far too much IMO.

    Sent from my DROID X2 using Forum Runner
    Maybe a little bit of a tangent, but I wonder if this is because nowadays there is too much information. Does it get garbled because it comes in so fast and in such volume (probably at the insistence of highers) instead of being worked some first and presented more clearly and concisely? And, of course, there is the competition to be the first one to tell highers something which often results in wrong first reports.




  7. #22
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    Quote Originally Posted by Haloti92 View Post
    Which is it? The military is on alert for every possible threat or they don't even have a refueling tanker on standby? And why was Hicks told a jet likely was not coming due to the fear of offending the Libyan government along with the reason of a tanker not being available? And what forces were General Ham referring to when he said he had forces ready but was never given the order to send them?

    What we know is that the military was told they could not get involved (this order came from on high and early). Any subsequent excuse or reason they give is suspect considering this fact/order and the obvious reality that without such an excuse they would be left saying "we didn't do all we could for our people."

    As for intelligence, we had people on the ground in communication and an overhead drone. We also aren't dealing with SAM batteries, enemy air force or any credible army in such situations.

    This idea that we need 100% confirmed intelligence and 0% risk profile in order to mount a rescue effort against a terrorist attack is embarrassing if it is the current state of our military. But I doubt that is the case at all.

    And even then, as I said and as will never stop being true, no one knew when this attack would end. After the fact statements of "wouldn't have got there in time" are nonsense. No one knew that at the time they were ruling out military intervention. Woods and Doherty were killed 7 hours after the attack commenced.
    You have your opinion and I have mine. We're just have to agree to disagree. On this incident I form my opinion from my training and experiences in military command and control, and my knowledge of first hand account on Benghazi, given where I currently work.




  8. #23
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    Quote Originally Posted by JStruds View Post
    Maybe a little bit of a tangent, but I wonder if this is because nowadays there is too much information. Does it get garbled because it comes in so fast and in such volume (probably at the insistence of highers) instead of being worked some first and presented more clearly and concisely? And, of course, there is the competition to be the first one to tell highers something which often results in wrong first reports.
    True. I can't tell you how many times I've submitted Operational Reports only to turn around and submit a correction or followup because the first notification was completely wrong. There is alot of pressure to make notification to higher ups.




  9. #24
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    I understand changes that occur on the ground and within the hours after the attack.

    But that's not what happened here. Changes in talking points, event details, etc occurred at a much higher level some 60+ hours after the attack AND after 90% of the info was already collected.

    Take a look at the email exchanges between the Director and the WH. It's very clear these are not SitRep changes. These are politically motivated changes.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  10. #25
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    I understand changes that occur on the ground and within the hours after the attack.

    But that's not what happened here. Changes in talking points, event details, etc occurred at a much higher level some 60+ hours after the attack AND after 90% of the info was already collected.

    Take a look at the email exchanges between the Director and the WH. It's very clear these are not SitRep changes. These are politically motivated changes.
    Oh don't misunderstand me HR. I agree pretty much everything thats taken place after the attack has been politically motivated. From the WH changing talking points and trying to spin it a certain way, to some in the GOP using it to continue their never ending war against Obama.

    The thing that gets under my skin is people who say what we could've done DURING the attack. That's something I'm fully well verse in.




  11. #26
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    Quote Originally Posted by Dade View Post
    Oh don't misunderstand me HR. I agree pretty much everything thats taken place after the attack has been politically motivated. From the WH changing talking points and trying to spin it a certain way, to some in the GOP using it to continue their never ending war against Obama.

    The thing that gets under my skin is people who say what we could've done DURING the attack. That's something I'm fully well verse in.
    Well, it is neither here nor there, but I had friends in a carrier strike force in the Med during that time. I'm not saying that they could have deployed anything in time, but it isn't like the US was devoid of military presence in the region.
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  12. #27
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    And this is well beyond GOP talking points.

    I'm no fan of the GOP either, but this is a real scandal at this point.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  13. #28

    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    Quote Originally Posted by Dade View Post
    You have your opinion and I have mine. We're just have to agree to disagree. On this incident I form my opinion from my training and experiences in military command and control, and my knowledge of first hand account on Benghazi, given where I currently work.
    Agree to disagree then.

    One thing you cannot disagree with is that knowing how long we had to get there in hindsight has no bearing on the discussion.
    Last edited by Haloti92; 05-16-2013 at 12:24 PM.




  14. #29
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    Lots of folks comparing this to Watergate (or at least how the information has come out).

    This combined with Fast and Furious could be really damaging to the administration.
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  15. #30
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    Re: Benghazi is Starting to Blow Up

    My question to the Obama administration would be...Was all this really necessary? Had they just been up front with what happen initially this probably wouldn't still be an issue. Take credit for what happen and what calls were or weren't made, give your reasons why...but remind the American people that is was an attack by terrorists and they'll the bad guys. Then vow to ensure the safety of all diplomats world wide. Done. Case closed.

    This whole cover-up or misdirection or whatever the hell their calling it just keeps growing. The WH has only given more fuel to the GOP. The democrats can kiss the mid term elections goodbye.

    Was all this really worth it?

    One thing you cannot disagree with is that knowing how long we had to get there in hindsight has no bearing on the discussion.
    True.

    I feel like I may have come across as a prick earlier in this thread. I want to apologize for that. It's just that I take my job seriously and am very passionate about it. Hearing people say we could have done X, Y or Z to save those 4 lives....kinds feels like they're saying I didn't do my job that night. I know its not directed at me, but rather people higher on the totem pole, but still its makes me feel uneasy. I can tell you a lot of people at AFRICOM feel the same way.




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